Who is right??

[paarsurrey]

Still waiting for you to answer my question…:coffeeread:

Hi

Your question, please.
I would try to respond if I knew the answer. I am no scholar, you know.

Thanks

 

[emeraldisle]

God’s ways are not our ways, He imparts His grace and mercy on whomever He chooses. Those who do not know Christ are left to the mercy of God, and He is most merciful. Human beings can not be children of satan, all human beings are children of God. It is their sinful actions which belong to satan. Jesus was exaggerating to prove a point when He spoke as He did in John 8. Just as he was in Matthew 18 when he spoke of us cutting off limbs and gouging out our eyes if they cause us to sin. Saint Paul tells us in 1 Corinthians 6: 19-20 " Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, which you have from God? You are not your own; you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body. " Christ would not have us destroy God’s temple by physically hurting ourselves. God takes no Glory in such things. And so, like the father of the prodigal son, Our Father waits for us to come to know Him through His Son Our Lord Jesus Christ. We are all children of God, ALL of us, Christian, Jew, Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu. Our divisions are a trick of the devil. Christ came to help us destroy our divisions and become one in love knowing Him, knowing we are all one in Him. Those who do not know Him need only find Him.

Was Jesus also "exaggerating when said “He is the way, the truth and the life and no man can come to the Father except through Him”, John 14:6. Or was Jesus also exaggerating when He told Nicodemus(a Jew) that he must be born again, see John 3. I mean if Nicodemus was already a child of God due to the fact that he was a descendant of Abraham then why did He need to be born again to become a child of God. Or was Jesus really exaggerating when He said these things??

The plain truth is the Lord Jesus says He is the Son of God and the people who believe Him and what He says are thr true children of God. The people who don’t believe what Jesus says, are not Gods children but the children of the god of this world.

Now i understand why you are finding it difficult to accept this truth from Jesus because of the claimed miracles in Lourdes & Mecca. Because if you agree with what Jesus says that Muslims because they don’t believe He is the Son of God are the children of the god of this world and so the claimed miracles at Mecca come from the god of this world. Then you have a big problem with answering the question of who is doing the same type of claimed miracles at Lourdes.​

 

[BeeSweet]

Was Jesus also "exaggerating when said “He is the way, the truth and the life and no man can come to the Father except through Him”, John 14:6. Or was Jesus also exaggerating when He told Nicodemus(a Jew) that he must be born again, see John 3. I mean if Nicodemus was already a child of God due to the fact that he was a descendant of Abraham then why did He need to be born again to become a child of God. Or was Jesus really exaggerating when He said these things??

The plain truth is the Lord Jesus says He is the Son of God and the people who believe Him and what He says are thr true children of God. The people who don’t believe what Jesus says, are not Gods children but the children of the god of this world.

Now i understand why you are finding it difficult to accept this truth from Jesus because of the claimed miracles in Lourdes & Mecca. Because if you agree with what Jesus says that Muslims because they don’t believe He is the Son of God are the children of the god of this world and so the claimed miracles at Mecca come from the god of this world. Then you have a big problem with answering the question of who is doing the same type of claimed miracles at Lourdes.​

Jesus is God, and God imparts His mercy on whomever He chooses. People who don’t understand that Jesus is God are still God’s children, they just don’t know Him. The section you’re referring to in John 3 Jesus was teaching Nicodemus that he (we) must be born of water and the spirit, not born again, Jesus corrects Nicodemus for thinking He means man must be born again. Also, he is talking about entering the kingdom of God, not about whether or not we are already children of God. John 3:17 “For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him.”

God is the God of heaven and of earth, He is the God of this world as well as the next. It is pagan to say that there is a separate “god of this world” as you do.

 

[emeraldisle]

Jesus is God, and God imparts His mercy on whomever He chooses. People who don’t understand that Jesus is God are still God’s children, they just don’t know Him. The section you’re referring to in John 3 Jesus was teaching Nicodemus that he (we) must be born of water and the spirit, not born again, Jesus corrects Nicodemus for thinking He means man must be born again. Also, he is talking about entering the kingdom of God, not about whether or not we are already children of God. John 3:17 “For God sent the Son into the world, not to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him.”

God is the God of heaven and of earth, He is the God of this world as well as the next. It is pagan to say that there is a separate “god of this world” as you do.

Yes Jesus is the Son of God, yes He is merciful and true. In John 3:16 it says God loves the world(all people) so much that He gave His only Son, the Lord Jesus to die for all people but this verse also says only the people who believe in Jesus will not perish.

“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” John 3:16

As for John 3 well the following are the exact words that Jesus said to Nicodemus; “Jesus answered and said unto him, truly, truly, I say unto you, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” John 3:3. Also John 3:5 teaches us that we are born again through the word of God and by the Spirit of God.

You are making the same mistake as Nicodemus re your child of God comments because he like you thought Jesus was talking about human birth but Jesus was talking about spiritual birth. Again I say that humanly speaking Jews & Muslims are descendants of Abraham but spiritually speaking they are children of the “god of this world”(this is in the Bible its not pagan) see the following Bible verses;

“But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.” 2 Corinthians 4:3-4

Also the following Bible verses clearly tell us that the god of this world has people in his captivity;

“in humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth, and that they may come to their senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will.” 2 Tim 2:25-26 (NKJV) Copyright © 1982 by Thomas Nelson, Inc.

Jesus Christ is called redeemer & deliverer because He takes people out of the captivity of the god of this world(satan).

Now it’s clear from the Bible that anyone who doesn’t believe in Jesus as the Son of God and as their Saviour isn’t a child of God. However if they become born again(see John 3) then they are delivered from the god of this world and they become children of God.

So Muslims because they don’t believe Jesus is the Son of God are the children of the god of this world. So this means that the Muslims god of this world is doing the claimed miracles at Mecca. Now is the god of this world doing the similar claimed “drinking water” miracles at Lourdes? Im patiently waiting for your answer.​

 

[BeeSweet]

Yes Jesus is the Son of God, yes He is merciful and true. In John 3:16 it says God loves the world(all people) so much that He gave His only Son, the Lord Jesus to die for all people but this verse also says only the people who believe in Jesus will not perish.

“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” John 3:16

As for John 3 well the following are the exact words that Jesus said to Nicodemus; “Jesus answered and said unto him, truly, truly, I say unto you, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” John 3:3. Also John 3:5 teaches us that we are born again through the word of God and by the Spirit of God.

You are making the same mistake as Nicodemus re your child of God comments because he like you thought Jesus was talking about human birth but Jesus was talking about spiritual birth. Again I say that humanly speaking Jews & Muslims are descendants of Abraham but spiritually speaking they are children of the “god of this world”(this is in the Bible its not pagan) see the following Bible verses;

“But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.” 2 Corinthians 4:3-4

Also the following Bible verses clearly tell us that the god of this world has people in his captivity;

“in humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth, and that they may come to their senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will.” 2 Tim 2:25-26 (NKJV) Copyright © 1982 by Thomas Nelson, Inc.

Jesus Christ is called redeemer & deliverer because He takes people out of the captivity of the god of this world(satan).

Now it’s clear from the Bible that anyone who doesn’t believe in Jesus as the Son of God and as their Saviour isn’t a child of God. However if they become born again(see John 3) then they are delivered from the god of this world and they become children of God.

So Muslims because they don’t believe Jesus is the Son of God are the children of the god of this world. So this means that the Muslims god of this world is doing the claimed miracles at Mecca. Now is the god of this world doing the similar claimed “drinking water” miracles at Lourdes? Im patiently waiting for your answer.​

The verse in 2 Corinthians says satan has blinded those who do not believe, not that they are children of the god of this world as you claim. Muslims do not know Jesus Christ because they do not know the good news He preaches. Muslims know the Qur’an, not the Gospel. They are the children of God, they need only come to know Jesus Christ to attain eternal salvation. There is only one God, He is God of this world and of the next, He is the God of all. Saint Paul was referring to satan when he spoke of the “god of this world”, he was not claiming there to be another god. There is only one God, Jesus Christ is His Son Who lives and reigns with Him in the unity of the Holy Spirit. All creation belongs to Him, He is Our Father. Satan can not create, he can not have children. He can cause division, that is his goal. That is what he aims to do in veiling the Gospel from others seeing the light of Jesus Christ. That is what he is doing when he leads others to believe we are not all children of God. Jesus was sent to us to tell us we are all children of God. I can not accept your premise that the Muslim people are children of another god because your premise does not accord with the teachings of Jesus.

As for the miracles, I’d really need to know something specific before I could comment, and even then I’m not an authority on the subject of miracles. I believe God imparts His grace and mercy on whomever He chooses though.

 

[emeraldisle]

The verse in 2 Corinthians says satan has blinded those who do not believe, not that they are children of the god of this world as you claim. Muslims do not know Jesus Christ because they do not know the good news He preaches. Muslims know the Qur’an, not the Gospel. They are the children of God, they need only come to know Jesus Christ to attain eternal salvation. There is only one God, He is God of this world and of the next, He is the God of all. Saint Paul was referring to satan when he spoke of the “god of this world”, he was not claiming there to be another god. There is only one God, Jesus Christ is His Son Who lives and reigns with Him in the unity of the Holy Spirit. All creation belongs to Him, He is Our Father. Satan can not create, he can not have children. He can cause division, that is his goal. That is what he aims to do in veiling the Gospel from others seeing the light of Jesus Christ. That is what he is doing when he leads others to believe we are not all children of God. Jesus was sent to us to tell us we are all children of God. I can not accept your premise that the Muslim people are children of another god because your premise does not accord with the teachings of Jesus.

As for the miracles, I’d really need to know something specific before I could comment, and even then I’m not an authority on the subject of miracles. I believe God imparts His grace and mercy on whomever He chooses though.

Im going to let Gods Word, the Truth speak for itself so im reposting the Bible verses.

37 “I know that you are Abraham’s descendants, but you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you. 38 I speak what I have seen with My Father, and you do what you have seen with your father.”
39 They answered and said to Him, “Abraham is our father.”
Jesus said to them, “If you were Abraham’s children, you would do the works of Abraham. 40 But now you seek to kill Me, a Man who has told you the truth which I heard from God. Abraham did not do this. 41 You do the deeds of your father.”
Then they said to Him, “We were not born of fornication; we have one Father—God.”
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.” John 8:37-47 (NKJV) Copyright © 1982 by Thomas Nelson, Inc.

“Jesus answered and said unto him, truly, truly, I say unto you, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” John 3:3.

“But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.” 2 Corinthians 4:3-4

“in humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth, and that they may come to their senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will.” 2 Tim 2:25-26 (NKJV) Copyright © 1982 by Thomas Nelson, Inc.

**On the authority of Gods Word the claimed “water drinking” miracles at Mecca are not from the God of the Bible but from the god of this world(satan). So who is doing the same claimed “water drinking” miracles at Lourdes?
**

 

[paarsurrey]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Righteousone
Still waiting for you to answer my question…

Hi

Your question, please.
I would try to respond if I knew the answer. I am no scholar, you know.

Thanks