Who is the creature to judge the Creator?

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donsnow

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Might as well bat this one around. If it’s been done before, somebody tell me.

I’d like ya’ll to keep two things in mind.
First, what goes around comes around (Do unto others as you would have others do unto you).
Second, the Terminator series of sci-fi movies of computer AI and machines, created by humans, trying to exterminate the human race. That is to say, those who judge or deny God could be endangering all of us.

Well, there it is. Enjoy.

God is love,
Don
 
Do unto others? Are you saying this means that God must be judged?:confused:

He gave us rules to help MANKIND live. Not the other way around. And He is the ultimate, final, number one being. Nothing’s above Him. Remember, not even the angels in heaven know even the minute of the end of the world. Everything is God’s alone. Including judgement.
 
ljubim said:
Do unto others? Are you saying this means that God must be judged?:confused:

He gave us rules to help MANKIND live. Not the other way around. And He is the ultimate, final, number one being. Nothing’s above Him. Remember, not even the angels in heaven know even the minute of the end of the world. Everything is God’s alone. Including judgement.
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No, I’m saying we ought not judge God, lest we be so judged. Sorry I didn’t make that more clear.
I agree with your second paragraph. Thanks for your reply.
 
donsnow said:
No, I’m saying we ought not judge God, lest we be so judged. Sorry I didn’t make that more clear.
I agree with your second paragraph. Thanks for your reply.
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You’re welcome:)
I hope more people reply!
 
simple_soul said:
I guess fortunatly for us we can not loose it no matter how hard we try.🙂 ❤️
Or can we?:hmmm:
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Oh, simple soul -

His love is never ending for the just and those who love Him. You ask a good question.
My best answer is to counsel: let’s not be careless with His love, but cherish His love and HIm, in all three persons of the Holy Trinity.
 
donsnow said:
No, I’m saying we ought not judge God, lest we be so judged. Sorry I didn’t make that more clear.
I agree with your second paragraph. Thanks for your reply.
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Well, you are correct in that one should not judge God in the sense that you should not attack him, but, I do not think anyone can judge God but for those like Lucifer whom have decided to turn from God, then it is finish for that individual, rather an Angel or Man–or at least I think so.
As far as lest we be so judge…I think that happens the instance you take a stance against God, but all shall be judge irregardless.

Here is an excerpt which may be relevant to this topic I got from New Advent dot com: Excerpted from Radio Replies Volume II. Copyright © 1940 by Fathers Rumble and Carty

If this is true, we should not believe that a person is judged the moment he dies.

That does not follow. Each individual soul is judged by God as it leaves this world. So Scripture tells us, “It is appointed unto men once to die, and after this the judgment” (Hebrews 9:27). Some will say, “If each sould has its particular judgment as it goes from this world, then why the general judgment of all collectively at the end?” There are many reasons for that.

The first and particular judgment is for us; the second and general judgment is for God, whose justice will then be manifested to all creatures.
Again, at the particular judgment the soul only, in a state of separation from the body, is judged; at the last judgment the souls of men will be reunited to their bodies, and they will experience a reiteration of their judgment in their complete personalities, and the bodies in which men have served God or sinned will share in the happiness or misery which is the lot of the soul.
Furthermore, man is not only individual; he is essentially a social being. We live in society, a common life in which mutual influences, good and evil, are constantly in evidence. Now a common life should have a common ending.
Our Lord tells us that there is nothing hidden which shall not be revealed. For wise reason time keeps its secrets; but time, at the end, will reveal all to all under the eyes of the great Judge. And all that God has done or permitted will be justified before the whole universe. Those who have died in the grace and friendship of God will find this general judgment to their glory and happiness. But those who have died at enmity with God will find it to their disgrace and misery. So God will triumph either in His mercy or in His justice.
 
donsnow said:
Oh, simple soul -

His love is never ending for the just and those who love Him. You ask a good question.
My best answer is to counsel: let’s not be careless with His love, but cherish His love and HIm, in all three persons of the Holy Trinity.
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Amen!
 
catholicsuffer said:
Well, you are correct in that one should not judge God in the sense that you should not attack him, but, I do not think anyone can judge God but for those like Lucifer whom have decided to turn from God, then it is finish for that individual, rather an Angel or Man–or at least I think so.
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I hope the people who misjudge God can repent and be forgiven. I’m pretty sure that angels can’t repent, once they make a choice. I also think intelligent people who judge God as either non-existant or wrong have been misled by Lucifer.
My example of the “Terminator” series is meant to indicate that God has a way of letting happen to people what they do either to Him or to His helpless creatures.
catholicsuffer said:
As far as lest we be so judge…I think that happens the instance you take a stance against God, but all shall be judge irregardless.
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Yes, and I think the consequences can either be upon a sinner instantaenously or be delayed for God’s reasons.
catholicsuffer said:
Here is an excerpt which may be relevant to this topic I got from New Advent dot com: Excerpted from Radio Replies Volume II. Copyright © 1940 by Fathers Rumble and Carty

If this is true, we should not believe that a person is judged the moment he dies.

That does not follow. Each individual soul is judged by God as it leaves this world. So Scripture tells us, “It is appointed unto men once to die, and after this the judgment” (Hebrews 9:27). Some will say, “If each sould has its particular judgment as it goes from this world, then why the general judgment of all collectively at the end?” There are many reasons for that.

The first and particular judgment is for us; the second and general judgment is for God, whose justice will then be manifested to all creatures.
Again, at the particular judgment the soul only, in a state of separation from the body, is judged; at the last judgment the souls of men will be reunited to their bodies, and they will experience a reiteration of their judgment in their complete personalities, and the bodies in which men have served God or sinned will share in the happiness or misery which is the lot of the soul.
Furthermore, man is not only individual; he is essentially a social being. We live in society, a common life in which mutual influences, good and evil, are constantly in evidence. Now a common life should have a common ending.
Our Lord tells us that there is nothing hidden which shall not be revealed. For wise reason time keeps its secrets; but time, at the end, will reveal all to all under the eyes of the great Judge. And all that God has done or permitted will be justified before the whole universe. Those who have died in the grace and friendship of God will find this general judgment to their glory and happiness. But those who have died at enmity with God will find it to their disgrace and misery. So God will triumph either in His mercy or in His justice.
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Interesting quote on our being judged by God.

Why don’t you know what religion you are? To me, the title “catholicsuffer” indicates you were or are catholic. Am I right or wrong?🙂
 
donsnow said:
I hope the people who misjudge God can repent and be forgiven. I’m pretty sure that angels can’t repent, once they make a choice. I also think intelligent people who judge God as either non-existant or wrong have been misled by Lucifer.
My example of the “Terminator” series is meant to indicate that God has a way of letting happen to people what they do either to Him or to His helpless creatures.

Yes, and I think the consequences can either be upon a sinner instantaenously or be delayed for God’s reasons.

Interesting quote on our being judged by God.

Why don’t you know what religion you are? To me, the title “catholicsuffer” indicates you were or are catholic. Am I right or wrong?🙂
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No, I was never a Catholic, although I did try to go through RCIA several years ago, I did not complete the sacraments. Alcohol, was my biggest problem at the time and I felt very unworthy and after going to first confession twice, the second time, because my thoughts were weighing heavily on me and I did not want to take my first communion unworthily. I started a thread on it under alcohol and how I quit after about 30 plus years of drinking constantly–http://forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=266944&highlight=alcohol+donalddon5
I have had many mystical experiences and they all have led me to the Catholic Faith and I hope to join it some day. Hopefully, after I have quit drinking for a few years, I will join the Church. I put I do not know because I certainly no longer can believe what Protestants religion teaches and I have not yet join the church, so claiming to be a Catholic would be dishonest and misleading. The complete name is Catholicsuffering but it would not fit. I don’t know why God, Jesus, and Saint Mary think that I am Catholic – You would have to know my experiences to understand what exactly I mean, but read the end of that thread and you will kind of get the ideal. Sorry, for such a long explanation.
Thanks for asking.
 
donsnow said:
.
First, what goes around comes around (Do unto others as you would have others do unto you).
Second, the Terminator series of sci-fi movies of computer AI and machines, created by humans, trying to exterminate the human race. That is to say, those who judge or deny God could be endangering all of us.
Click to expand...
Can you explain what the Terminator series has to do with God’s judment or why we should not judge God?

Also, is something good because God commands it, or does God command it because it is good?
 
catholicsuffer said:
No, I was never a Catholic, although I did try to go through RCIA several years ago, I did not complete the sacraments. Alcohol, was my biggest problem at the time and I felt very unworthy and after going to first confession twice, the second time, because my thoughts were weighing heavily on me and I did not want to take my first communion unworthily. I started a thread on it under alcohol and how I quit after about 30 plus years of drinking constantly–http://forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=266944&highlight=alcohol+donalddon5
I have had many mystical experiences and they all have led me to the Catholic Faith and I hope to join it some day. Hopefully, after I have quit drinking for a few years, I will join the Church. I put I do not know because I certainly no longer can believe what Protestants religion teaches and I have not yet join the church, so claiming to be a Catholic would be dishonest and misleading. The complete name is Catholicsuffering but it would not fit. I don’t know why God, Jesus, and Saint Mary think that I am Catholic – You would have to know my experiences to understand what exactly I mean, but read the end of that thread and you will kind of get the ideal. Sorry, for such a long explanation.
Thanks for asking.
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Good morning, sir -

I read the last post on your alcohol link. Bless your heart. To my knowledge, once you are confirmed and have made your first Confession, you may receive Christ in the Eucharist. As long as you don’t get drunk, I think it’s not a sin to drink. I admire your efforts to free yourself from drunkeness. It can be done.
The first time I stopped getting drunk, and drinking, was in February of 1970, when my second fiancee (by virtue of Decree of Nullity I 've never been married) kept our baby and didn’t want to live with me anymore, so I moved. She would never believe I quit drinking. Then, in '70, after I returned home, her new husband petitioned to adopt our daughter. After three days and nights, I signed and mailed the petition back to them. Then, I started drinking heavy until '78 when I joined AA for 17 months; then I gathered my courage and tried controlled drinking. I found I could limit my drinks to two, the times I drank socially (beer);and to two ounces of wine to go to sleep. So, I left AA in '78. Then, Sept of ‘90 I went on an anti-depressant. In July of 91’ I tried an eight ounce beer which I sipped for 20 minutes. I walked back to my apartment and blacked out on the bed. When I came to, half an hour later, I felt like a Mac truck had hit me. I decided I had had an easy lesson, in that I came to. I haven’t drank beer nor liquor since and drank only to receive Communion.
I hope you don’t have to lose everything, before you stop drinking. Now, I know what to pray for you. May you cling to Christ for all you’re worth. I think you can join the Catholic church before you stop drinking, unless a priest says different. I don’t want to lead you against church teaching. May the Good Lord bless your efforts.
 
Leela said:
Can you explain what the Terminator series has to do with God’s judment or why we should not judge God?

Also, is something good because God commands it, or does God command it because it is good?
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Hi, Leela -

Those are two excellent questions.

First, about the Terminator series as an example. We’re supposed to treat others as we want to be treated. Many people say God does not exist, about the greatest insult you can tell someone. However, many of us agree and believe that God is an … other. I say God is right and just and capable of judging an entire society, because of the people in it.
Right now, let me say that aetheists and skeptics nor gays nor casual abortion is not the only things that displeases God about our society. People wife swapping, or cheating their employees, or employees cheating their employers, etc are all things which I believe God disapproves of and that make Him unhappy.
Basically to answer your question, when people want to throw God out of a society, and godly people tolerate that, God can throw out that entire society. Look at history. Many civilizations have risen and fallen. The Euro-American civilization thrived when most of us recognized and honored God. Now, since the '60’s and the revolt against God, the Euro-American civilization has fallen and is still falling.
I say God has a Hand in that, His judgement for our turning from Him decreasing our prosperity, rights and freedoms. That’s my present effort to answer your first question. I hope it helped.

Now, about your second question.
I think the answer shows an intertwining of the two phrases of your second question.
For example, as far as we know, before 1,500BC people killed other people and fought blood feuds; people pillaged (stole from) each other; people worshipped little and big images of creatures and other people that they called gods; people took no time to think about a Creator; people inter-married, married siblings etc; people lied about each other; as you can see, I’m outlining infractions of the Ten Commandments…I submit that to our knowledge, that all those infractions were common, ordinary and accepted by a lot of people in societies, in those days. Then, Moses received the Ten Commandments from God and Israel lived differently than the other people in those days. The Israelites enjoyed more social safety and so did their slaves, than other societies. God gave His commandments, because they were good and because the produced good for the Israelites. There is the intertwining: good and produced good.
Does that help?
 
donsnow said:
Good morning, sir -

I read the last post on your alcohol link. Bless your heart. To my knowledge, once you are confirmed and have made your first Confession, you may receive Christ in the Eucharist. As long as you don’t get drunk, I think it’s not a sin to drink. I admire your efforts to free yourself from drunkeness. It can be done.
The first time I stopped getting drunk, and drinking, was in February of 1970, when my second fiancee (by virtue of Decree of Nullity I 've never been married) kept our baby and didn’t want to live with me anymore, so I moved. She would never believe I quit drinking. Then, in '70, after I returned home, her new husband petitioned to adopt our daughter. After three days and nights, I signed and mailed the petition back to them. Then, I started drinking heavy until '78 when I joined AA for 17 months; then I gathered my courage and tried controlled drinking. I found I could limit my drinks to two, the times I drank socially (beer);and to two ounces of wine to go to sleep. So, I left AA in '78. Then, Sept of ‘90 I went on an anti-depressant. In July of 91’ I tried an eight ounce beer which I sipped for 20 minutes. I walked back to my apartment and blacked out on the bed. When I came to, half an hour later, I felt like a Mac truck had hit me. I decided I had had an easy lesson, in that I came to. I haven’t drank beer nor liquor since and drank only to receive Communion.
I hope you don’t have to lose everything, before you stop drinking. Now, I know what to pray for you. May you cling to Christ for all you’re worth. I think you can join the Catholic church before you stop drinking, unless a priest says different. I don’t want to lead you against church teaching. May the Good Lord bless your efforts.
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Thank you. But to make it clear. I have not drink since that vision and that has been more then 9 months ago but I do not know the exact date. I do not know what or if any experiences(Gifts of the Holy Spirit) that you may have had but experiences like that are usually more real then things which happens every day. I took that vision as a very stern warning from Saint Michael(not someone to take lightly–to say the least). Thank you for your prayers…as one Saint says “Pray Always”. Now back to the topic at hand.
 
Leela said:
Can you explain what the Terminator series has to do with God’s judment or why we should not judge God?

Also, is something good because God commands it, or does God command it because it is good?
Click to expand...
A typical atheist question, that is an attempt to confuse the mind.

Genesis 1:31
God looked at everything he had made, and he found it very good.

Here is a link that deals directly to your question: newadvent.org/summa/1006.htm

This is from that wonderful Saint and Father, Saint Augustine:
“The highest good, than which there is no higher, is God, and consequently He is unchangeable good, hence truly eternal and truly immortal. All other good things are only from Him, not of Him. For what is of Him, is Himself. And consequently if He alone is unchangeable, all things that He has made, because He has made them out of nothing, are changeable. For He is so omnipotent, that even out of nothing, that is out of what is absolutely non-existent, He is able to make good things both great and small, both celestial and terrestrial, both spiritual and corporeal. But because He is also just, He has not put those things that He has made out of nothing on an equality with that which He begot out of Himself. Because, therefore, no good things whether great or small, through whatever gradations of things, can exist except from God; but since every nature, so far as it is nature, is good, it follows that no nature can exist save from the most high and true God: because all things even not in the highest degree good, but related to the highest good, and again, because all good things, even those of most recent origin, which are far from the highest good, can have their existence only from the highest good. Therefore every spirit, though subject to change, and every corporeal entity, is from God, and all this, having been made, is nature. For every nature is either spirit or body. Unchangeable spirit is God, changeable spirit, having been made, is nature, but is better than body; but body is not spirit, unless when the wind, because it is invisible to us and yet its power is felt as something not inconsiderable, is in a certain sense called spirit”

You can read more on it at this link: newadvent.org/fathers/1407.htm

By the way-- CONFUSION is of the DEVIL
 
Hi, Catholicsuffer -

In my answer to you, since that post doesn’t have an edit button, read '73 for when I came home. Sorry about that.
 
catholicsuffer said:
Thank you. But to make it clear. I have not drink since that vision and that has been more then 9 months ago but I do not know the exact date. I do not know what or if any experiences(Gifts of the Holy Spirit) that you may have had but experiences like that are usually more real then things which happens every day. I took that vision as a very stern warning from Saint Michael(not someone to take lightly–to say the least). Thank you for your prayers…as one Saint says “Pray Always”. Now back to the topic at hand.
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Oh.
I was posting my correction, when you submitted this.

I cannot remember having a vision from an archangel, Holy Mary Mother of God, nor any person of the Holy Trinity. Most of my life, my mind was too smudged to receive such.:o
I’ve always prayed a lot. My way of clinging to the Good Shepard. As well as picturing his crucifixtion in my mind.
 
donsnow said:
Oh.
I was posting my correction, when you submitted this.

I cannot remember having a vision from an archangel, Holy Mary Mother of God, nor any person of the Holy Trinity. Most of my life, my mind was too smudged to receive such.:o
I’ve always prayed a lot. My way of clinging to the Good Shepard. As well as picturing his crucifixtion in my mind.
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Well, that doesn’t sound to smudge to me. I guess when you are as pathetic as me then the Lord feels a need to directly intervene.

Reading your earlier post. I agree with your view point on God does judge nations. I remember when the hurricane Katrina hit New Orleans (I work off shore in the Gulf of Mexico) and the Protestants started coming on television and saying that it was a punishment directly from God. Well, I don’t know if you know much about Southern Louisiana but there are a whole lot of Catholics and they(Catholics) immediately gave the Protestants(T.V. Evangelist) a lot of slack and said that it was an opportunity to help others.

I agree that it was a good opportunity to help other but I also believe that it is judgement from God. How else would you explain the Catholic main cathedral down town not getting flooded(I believe that is what I heard on the news–although you might want to check). I think that a lot of Catholics do not think that God is capable of punishing people. They seems to go to the extreme other direction of God being love. Some people just can not except punishment as being part of a loving-holy type of correction for the benefit of the one being punishment rather country or individuals.
 
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