Who is the Prophet?

[dcana]

This kind of assertion leads to unnecessary conflict between people of different religions.

Muhammad, in the Qur’an stated clearly and unequivocally that Jesus IS the Christ:

“(And remember) when the angels said: O Mary! Lo! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a word from him, whose name is the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, illustrious in the world and the Hereafter, and one of those brought near (unto Allah).” - Qur’an 3:4
Note: “Christ” is the Greek translation for the Hebrew word “Messiah”.

Muhammad, in the Qur’an, calls Jesus the Christ, the Word of God and the Spirit of God. In addition in the Hadiths, Muhammad was said to state that Christ would return in the time of the end to bring about a transformation of the world and judge all people.

It is what our Scriptures assert, not me. Whether they cause “conflict between people of different religions” does not concern me. If the truth causes conflict, then it is necessary conflict, not unnecessary conflict. It is the cardinal sin in today’s western secular world to say something that may be “offensive” to others but I will not follow the rules of this particular world and, moreover, reject that whole notion. If the truth is offensive to some, so be it. How many people were extremely offended by what Jesus preached? Look at what some of those who were “offended” did to Him at the end of His earthly life. To Jesus, speaking the Truth (not that He could do otherwise) was paramount. Many were offended at what He said and many left following Him because of it.

When St. John writes that “those who deny that Jesus is the Christ”, he means much more than simply denying that He is “the expected one” or the “anointed one”. He means those who deny who He is, the one who John himself knows Him to be - e.g. “…and the Word was God.” In 2 John 1:7 that I quoted above, he says, “…men who will not acknowledge the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh”, much more specific language than simply “…men who will not acknowledge that Jesus Christ is the one called the Messiah”. We believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God, God from God, Light from Light. He is not “one of those brought near (unto -]Allah/-] God).” He is -]Allah/-] God. I crossed through “Allah” because what we mean when we say “God” is not the same as what a Muslim means when he uses the term “Allah”. There is a radical difference in meaning. As far as your claim that the Qur’an calls Him the Word of God (and I’m here taking you at your word that it actually does this), what St. John and we mean when we say that Jesus is the Word of God is that He is the Eternal Son of the Eternal Father, the Second Person of the Blessed Trinity, through whom all things were made. Whatever M. meant by the term, he did not mean this. He probably meant that He was one who spoke on God’s behalf, like a prophet. Anyone who denies that Jesus is the Eternal Word of God as His Church, which is His Body, knows Him to be, is not a Christian and has the spirit of Antichrist:

Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father. He who confesses the Son has the Father also.

• 1 John 2:22-23

M. “denied Jesus the Son, and had not the Father” (to paraphrase a bit) because He would not acknowledge Him and worship Him as his Creator and His God.

Would you say that St. John’s language in naming people who deny that Jesus is the Christ liars is offensive to some? Is sure sounds offensive to me.

As a side note, do you know how many Muslims today (if any) speak of Him as the Messiah? Do they believe that He is the Messiah as prophesied in the Old Testament? If so, why? They do not believe in the Old Testament as the Word of God, correct? Why would M. himself even believe this? Maybe he didn’t. In your quote it says that Jesus is “named Messiah”, not that He is the Messiah as prophesied in the Hebrew Scriptures. A lot of people today would agree that His name is “Jesus Christ” or “Jesus the Christ” and at the same time will have absolutely nothing to do with Him.

God bless

 

[dcana]

From our point of view Mohammad is not a prophet. If he can be said to be a prophet, then he is a false prophet. In my opinion, he was one of the greatest antichrists in history.

If not he, then who? St. John speaks of many antichrists existing even in the time in which they were living. How many billions of people in 1300 or so years have not believed that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God, in whose Name only men are to be saved, and have not become Christians through Holy Baptism and followers of Him who is “the Way [and the **only Way to the Father - “no one comes to the Father except through me” (quite a claim, isn’t it?)], the Truth, and the Life”, because of the preaching of M, a false prophet? I’d say about two, maybe three. How many souls have been lost as a result? God only knows.

 

[Reuben_J]

From our point of view Mohammad is not a prophet. If he can be said to be a prophet, then he is a false prophet. In my opinion, he was one of the greatest antichrists in history. I do not call him that to be “mean”, but in view of the definition of “antichrist” given by St. John, and looking back at the facts of history. I, for one, never call him “The Prophet Mohammad”, but simply “Mohammad”, not because I want to offend Muslims, but because I do not consider him to be a prophet, if he even existed.

Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father. He who confesses the Son has the Father also.

• 1 John 2:22-23

For many deceivers have gone out into the world, men who will not acknowledge the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh; such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist.

• 2 John 1:7

Strictly speaking from Christianity point of view and the verses from the Bible, Mohammad is a false prophet and fits the description of an antichrist. You rightly ref.** 1 Jn 2:22 Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. **

The understanding of*** the Christ*** in Christianity is that he is the Savior, the Son, the second person of the Trinity which is different from that of Islam.

Respect and courtesy aside, a Christian has no choice but to call Mohammad a false prophet and antichrist.

Therefore if Mohammad is a false prophet and antichrist, he then cannot be the one prophesized in Deut 18:18.

 

[dcana]

Who is the Prophet? Jesus, the Lord.

As RebeccaJ points out, St. Peter said, speaking to his fellow Israelites (Acts 3:22-26):

Moses said, “The Lord God will raise up for you a prophet from your brethren as he raised me up. You shall listen to him in whatever he tells you. And it shall be that every soul that does not listen to that prophet shall be destroyed from the people.” And all the prophets who have spoken, from Samuel and those who came afterwards, also proclaimed these days. You are the sons of the prophets and of the covenant which God gave to your fathers, saying to Abraham, “And in your posterity shall all the families of the earth be blessed.” God, having raised up his servant, sent him to you first, to bless you in turning every one of you from your wickedness.

He is The Prophet, a prophet being one who is sent by God and speaks on God’s behalf. But He is much more than just a “prophet”, but God, the Son sent by the Father to speak on the Father’s behalf “all that He hears from Him”, and so to reveal Him to the world.

 

[Matthew_Light]

Muhammad called Jesus the Messiah (the Christ). So Muhammad certainly did not deny that Jesus is the Christ!

Going around claiming Muhammad is the antichrist really does the exact opposite of Pope Francis’ efforts to foster dialogue between Christiand and Muslims - a very pressing concern in this world today!

 

[rcwitness]

Muhammad called Jesus the Messiah (the Christ). So Muhammad certainly did not deny that Jesus is the Christ!

Going around claiming Muhammad is the antichrist really does the exact opposite of Pope Francis’ efforts to foster dialogue between Christiand and Muslims - a very pressing concern in this world today!

Was he Baptized then?

 

[Matthew_Light]

Whether they cause “conflict between people of different religions” does not concern me.

That’s very unfortunate.

We cannot do Christ’s work while at the same time deliberately fostering antagonism between people of differing faiths.

Can you show me official Catholic doctrine that states that Muhammad is the Antichrist, and Islam is the Devil’s religion? No, of course not. Pope Francis is doing everything he can to foster rapprochement, cooperation and amity between Christians and Muslims. This is God’s work, this is following Christ.

 

[tweedlealice]

Salaam alakum

St. John the Baptist is our Christian prophet for our Lord Jesus Christ…

Masalaam
tweedlealiice

 

[Reuben_J]

Muhammad called Jesus the Messiah (the Christ). So Muhammad certainly did not deny that Jesus is the Christ!

And what did Muhammad mean when he said that Jesus is the Messiah; and Christians when saying the same? Obviously their definitions are not the same.

Do you know that when you say that Jesus is a mere prophet, that it is an insult to us? No, not that we are angry about it because we know that it is from the Muslims’ perspective, a known fact that their belief is different from us.

Going around claiming Muhammad is the antichrist really does the exact opposite of Pope Francis’ efforts to foster dialogue between Christians and Muslims - a very pressing concern in this world today!

We don’t go around claiming Muhammad as the anti-Christ and false prophet, Mathew. You don’t do that in inter-religious dialogue as Muslims would not say that we worship three gods.

But if you ask me or any Christians what Muhammad is, then by the teaching of the Bible, they have to say that he is a false prophet and anti-Christ. Biblical verses are sufficiently clear about that. Similarly, any Muslims when referring to their Quran would say that the Trinity invariably would consist of three gods, the reason why they think that we are ‘shirk’, associating human with God.

Speaking honestly and trying to denigrate/insult are two different things altogether. A Christian would be lying to himself if he should say that Muhammad is a prophet; and similarly perhaps a Muslim who would say that Jesus is God just to please Christians.

This is the reality of the difference in each belief respectively.

 

[Matthew_Light]

Biblical verses are sufficiently clear about that.

No, the verses are very clear - Antichrist is denying that Jesus is the Messiah (Christ), denying that Jesus came in the flesh, or denying that Jesus came from the Father (God).

Muhammad affirmed Jesus as the Messiah, in the flesh, from God.

As human beings, we can no longer afford the fomenting of religious prejudice and hatred between Muslims and Christians. It is no longer an option, and we should all look towards the example of the true servant of the Lord Pope Francis and seek to build bridges between people of different faiths, instead of pouring gasoline on them and setting them alight.

 

[Reuben_J]

No, the verses are very clear -

It is to us. We do not have to listen to you on how to understand the Bible. Huh, sorry about that.

The teaching of the Quran says Jesus did not die and resurrect thus denying the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. A person who claim this would be anti-Christ, again putting it simply. The Bible says there will be no new revelation and prophet in that sense, and he who teaches differently from what the apostles taught, is a false prophet. Muhammad fits both description.

I am sorry to say that you cannot persuade me from the Bible that Muhammad is a true prophet or not anti-Christ.

 

[Reuben_J]

Antichrist is denying that Jesus is the Messiah (Christ),

And that is what Muhammad did. He denied that Jesus is the Messiah who saved mankind from their sins by his death and resurrection. The Messiah is a person, an anointed King, who redeems his people. Jesus redeemed his people not by power and might but by his death and resurrection. He saved them not from physical slavery but from the consequence of sins.

That was definitely not what Muhammad had in mind. In fact he denied the Gospel, saying in the Quran that Jesus did not die on the cross. This is a denial of salvation that was being brought on the cross. This is a denial of the Christ.

denying that Jesus came in the flesh, or denying that Jesus came from the Father (God).
Muhammad affirmed Jesus as the Messiah, in the flesh, from God.

An ingenious half-truth, a perfect modus operandi of Satan.

As human beings, we can no longer afford the fomenting of religious prejudice and hatred between Muslims and Christians. It is no longer an option, and we should all look towards the example of the true servant of the Lord Pope Francis and seek to build bridges between people of different faiths, instead of pouring gasoline on them and setting them alight.

Agreed. The Pope has shown great wisdom in not burning bridges and trying to keep the line of communication alive with the Muslims no matter how different we are. There, indeed, should be no prejudice and hatred despite the differences.

 

[rcwitness]

Was he Baptized then?

Crickets…

 

[Matthew_Light]

The teaching of the Quran says Jesus did not die and resurrect thus denying the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

No, it doesn’t say that.

 

[Matthew_Light]

And that is what Muhammad did. He denied that Jesus is the Messiah who saved mankind from their sins by his death and resurrection. The Messiah is a person, an anointed King, who redeems his people. Jesus redeemed his people not by power and might but by his death and resurrection. He saved them not from physical slavery but from the consequence of sins.

So now you are complaining that Muslims have a different understanding of Messiah from Christians.

Jews also complain that Christians have a very different understanding of Messiah than Jews do.

In fact, Christians used to use the accusation of anti-Christ against Jews as well. That accusation went out of fashion around 1945. The same calumny against the Muslims and Muhammad is far past its sell-by date too. We cannot afford to use religion as a weapon to foment division and hatred in this world any longer. It’s not acceptable to God in this Day, and faithful servants of God like Pope Francis recognize this and act accordingly.

That was definitely not what Muhammad had in mind. In fact he denied the Gospel, saying in the Quran that Jesus did not die on the cross. This is a denial of salvation that was being brought on the cross. This is a denial of the Christ.

That’s simply incorrect. The Qur’an does not say that Jesus did not die on the cross, and millions of Muslims accept the historical reality of the crucifixion.

 

[Matthew_Light]

It is to us. We do not have to listen to you on how to understand the Bible. Huh, sorry about that.

How about listening to Pope Francis and the CCC then?

 

[Reuben_J]

Matthew Light:

So now you are complaining that Muslims have a different understanding of Messiah from Christians.

Disagreed, not complaining but fact.
Matthew Light:

Jews also complain that Christians have a very different understanding of Messiah than Jews do.

Agreed.
Matthew Light:

In fact, Christians used to use the accusation of anti-Christ against Jews as well. That accusation went out of fashion around 1945. The same calumny against the Muslims and Muhammad is far past its sell-by date too. We cannot afford to use religion as a weapon to foment division and hatred in this world any longer. It’s not acceptable to God in this Day, and faithful servants of God like Pope Francis recognize this and act accordingly.

Truth may be hard to take but we cannot compromise on that. As long as people are intelligent enough to know that differences of belief does not equal hatred, then discussion of that differences should not lead to hatred and prejudice.
Matthew Light:

That’s simply incorrect. The Qur’an does not say that Jesus did not die on the cross, and millions of Muslims accept the historical reality of the crucifixion.

Disagreed. And Muslims would disagree with you as well.

A Muslim friend of mine, a colleague, quoted me this.

Quran 4:157 (Sahih International) *** … And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but another was made to resemble him to them. … And they did not kill him, for certain.***
Matthew Light:

How about listening to Pope Francis and the CCC then?

Agreed. Sure.

That’s probably the best suggestion I heard so far.

 

[rcwitness]

With all due respect, it doesn’t matter much what someone says about Jesus if they don’t keep His commands. If someone should “prophesy” that Jesus is Lord, they have realized God’s plan and blessing and giving testimony! Amen!

If they do not receive His Baptism and contribute to building up His Church, then they are denying the faith.

**James 2 (RSVCE)

19 You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder.**

 

[Matthew_Light]

Disagreed. And Muslims would disagree with you as well.

Many Muslims accept the crucifixion. Here is a paper on this topic written by Alawite Muslims:

themathesontrust.org/papers/islam/andani-crucifixion.pdf

Todd Lawson, an academic, has studied the history of Islamic thought about the crucifixion. Many early Muslims did not deny the historic crucifixion:

amazon.com/Crucifixion-Quran-History-Muslim-Thought/dp/1851686355

And here is another academic treatment of that passage:

www3.nd.edu/~reynolds/index_files/jesus%20dead%20or%20alive.pdf

Quran 4:157 (Sahih International) … And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but another was made to resemble him to them. … And they did not kill him, for certain.

Why did they not quote the entire verse? And I find the Sahih translation inferior. Here is Pickthall 4:157-158:

And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah’s messenger - they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain.

But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah was ever Mighty, Wise.

Not so clear, it it? What is it actually saying?

What does “appeared so unto them” mean? It could mean many things. Among them, is that God allowed the Crucifixion, and planned that through it, God would raise Christ before all men. That is, those who believed they were killing Jesus and responsible for it, were in fact being used by God to achieve His purposes.

Or it could mean that the body of Jesus was slain, but that the spirit of Christ can never be killed. “And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul…” - Matthew 10:28

What does “Allah took him up unto Himself” mean?

It could mean that the body was dead, but the spirit of Jesus ascended to Heaven:

"And Jesus crying out with a loud voice, said: Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit. And saying this, he gave up the ghost. " - Luke 23:46

This provides more context for “appeared so unto them”:

“Think not of those, who are slain in the way of Allah, as dead. Nay, they are living. With their Lord they have provision.” - Qur’an

That it, it “appears” to us that killing the body means death, but it is simply a transition to a more real and abundant life.

Jesus’ body was killed, His spirit could never be killed by anyone.

 

[Matthew_Light]

Also, elsewhere in the Qur’an, Jesus is quoted as talking to the Father, referring to His own death:

“…Ever since You took my soul, You alone have been the watcher over them:” - Qur’an 5:117