Who sinned first: Adam or Eve

[Deb_H]

Basic Catholic teaching **regarding Adam and Original Sin ** is found in the
Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition, ISBN: 1-57455-109-4
Paragraphs 355-421.

The good news of Jesus Christ follows in Paragraph 422, etc.

One can put the word paragraph and its number in the Catechism’s search bar in link www.scborromeo.org/ccc.htm
Entering topics, like Adam, is also very useful.

When you enter a paragraph number, like “paragraph 355”, and then click on the opening line, CCC Search Result - Paragraph # 355 you will see the following under the paragraph:

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Thank you for the link . It says it all .

 

[Third_Day]

My favorite part is where God confronts Adam and asks him “who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten of the tree which I commanded you not to eat?”

Adam tries to put the blame on God. “The woman that YOU GAVE ME handed me the fruit of the tree and I ate.”

 

[rcjones]

So are we all saying that Eve gets a pass for changing God’s word and we focus solely on her eating the fruit. It seems to me she was starting to be disobedient prior to the picking and eating of any fruit.

ChadS

Ro 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

For all the discussion and rationalization we can’t negate scripture. Sin came by one man, therefore whatever Eve did, it was not a sin unto death. That is why it must be classified as a venial sin.

The OP leaves it open as to what kind of sin was committed. Eve did sin chronologically first. She changed God’s word and she put her flesh before the Word of God because she was deceived. But Mortal sin came through Adam and Adam alone.

 

[ryanoneil]

The world was fashioned as a Temple and the Garden of Eden was depicted as the sanctuary of the Temple where God dwells. In Gen 2:15 Adam is placed in the Garden “to cultivate and care for it” (Hebrew= abodah and shamar). These are words associated with priestly service and charge. Then Adam saw the serpent and he was scared that if he didn’t do what the serpent wanted he would be made to suffer and die. He feared dying more than he feared disobeying the Father. He should have stood up to the serpent to protect his wife even if it cost him his life, so he failed in his service and charge. It was a test of his love for eve, and for God, that he failed. Otherwise he would have spoke up and not allowed the whole thing to happen.

Now since the children share in blood and flesh, he likewise shared in them, that through death he might destroy the one who has the power of death, that is, the devil, and free those who through fear of death had been subject to slavery all their life. (Heb 2:14-15)

 

[Ron_Conte]

Both Adam and Eve committed the same sin, eating the forbidden fruit, and both received the same punishment. They both lost original innocence, lost the state of grace, and were made subject to death. So they both were punished with the figurative death of the soul (loss of grace) and eventually with literal grace.

Therefore, they both committed a mortal sin because only mortal sin deserves the loss of the state of grace and the punishment of death.

The claim that Adam’s sin was failing to protect his wife, out of fear of the serpent, is not supported by Tradition, Scripture, or the Magisterium.

I think that these types of false claims about Adam and Eve (e.g. that Eve sinned only venially, that Adam sinned first, or that Adam’s sin was not protecting his wife) are a result of the influence of modern society, which favors blaming men as much as possible, and women as little as possible. So the traditional teaching that Eve sinned first, and that she influenced Adam to sin, is being rewritten by various persons because it is in conflict with what secular society teaches about men and women.

[1 Timothy]
{2:11} Let a woman learn in silence with all subjection.
{2:12} For I do not permit a woman to teach, nor to be in authority over a man, but to be in silence.
{2:13} For Adam was formed first, then Eve.
{2:14} And Adam was not seduced, but the woman, having been seduced, was in transgression.
{2:15} Yet she will be saved by bearing children, if she has continued in faith and love, and in sanctification accompanied by self-restraint.

 

[rcjones]

I think that these types of false claims about Adam and Eve (e.g. that Eve sinned only venially, … are a result of the influence of modern society, which favors blaming men as much as possible, and women as little as possible. So the traditional teaching that Eve sinned first, and that she influenced Adam to sin, is being rewritten by various persons because it is in conflict with what secular society teaches about men and women.

Sorry Ron… I am influenced only by the scripture:

Ro 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Since it doesn’t mention the woman, the woman’s sin would not have passed death on to all men. God could have pulled another rib. You completely destroy the first son/second son motif painted by Cain/Abel, Ishmael/Isaac, Esau/Jacob and many others which teach that Christ is the second Adam or second man who got the inheritance that was lost by the first.

Yes Eve sinned first chronologically, but she sinned alone, not representing all men. But death to all men came through Adam, if not then Christ alone could not save.

Ro 5:19 For as by one man‘s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

So fault me for Sola scriptura if you wish, but not for societal influence.

 

[ryanoneil]

Both Adam and Eve committed the same sin, eating the forbidden fruit, and both received the same punishment. They both lost original innocence, lost the state of grace, and were made subject to death. So they both were punished with the figurative death of the soul (loss of grace) and eventually with literal grace.

I don’t disagree.

Therefore, they both committed a mortal sin because only mortal sin deserves the loss of the state of grace and the punishment of death.

The claim that Adam’s sin was failing to protect his wife, out of fear of the serpent, is not supported by Tradition, Scripture, or the Magisterium.

I’m not trying to discount the central importance of eating the apple at all. But the claim is supported by tradition, even if part of it is teasing the meaning out of a riddle. The garden account is a figurative proverb according to CCC 390 that speaks to the truth.

I think that these types of false claims about Adam and Eve (e.g. that Eve sinned only venially, that Adam sinned first, or that Adam’s sin was not protecting his wife) are a result of the influence of modern society, which favors blaming men as much as possible, and women as little as possible. So the traditional teaching that Eve sinned first, and that she influenced Adam to sin, is being rewritten by various persons because it is in conflict with what secular society teaches about men and women.

[1 Timothy]
{2:11} Let a woman learn in silence with all subjection.
{2:12} For I do not permit a woman to teach, nor to be in authority over a man, but to be in silence.
{2:13} For Adam was formed first, then Eve.
{2:14} And Adam was not seduced, but the woman, having been seduced, was in transgression.
{2:15} Yet she will be saved by bearing children, if she has continued in faith and love, and in sanctification accompanied by self-restraint.

This isn’t secular at all, and it doesn’t take away from the sin of Eve. Adam was created as God’s first-born son and priest. He is also created to be the father of a priestly people- a family of God. God gave Adam the priestly duty of guarding the garden sanctuary (the dwelling place of God and man) and protect his wife and himself.

God tested Adam because covenant love requires total self-giving. Covenants require the people to make a sacrifice as a token of their commitment to God. And all future covenant sacrices were only partially sucessful because the human race was weakened by Adams failure to sacrifice himself completely (up until Christ’s covenant sacrifice). The garden was concerned with the basic building block of marriage while the latter covenant were concerned with family, tribe, nation, and kingdom.

So, Adam sees a powerful serpent (Hebrew nahash). A dragon or leviathan. He was with Eve the whole time but he did nothing. He was supposed to be guarding everything.

Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ loved the church and handed himself over for her to sanctify her, cleansing her by the bath of water with the word, that he might present to himself the church in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. (Eph 5:25-27)

He was supposed to have this kind of self sacrificing love. He was supposed to say “NO, This is not going to happen!” But he was being challenge by a huge powerful serpent using deceit and raw power (similar to the beast of Revelation). Hebrews 2:14-15 says Satan has the power of death and it was the fear of death that subjected man to slavery. Adam and Eve were obviously not fearing the death threat of God when they bit into the apple. They death they feared was from the serpent. This doesn’t negate the seduction of power and other elements, but if Adam was not really seduced it was because he was frozen (and his wife was left hanging with an apple in her hand).

 

[Walter_Maxey]

I remember being in a Bible study once where it was hypothosized that the first sin wasn’t that of eating the fruit from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, but it was that Eve, when being tempted by the serpent subtly changed what God and told her and Adam. … God never told Adam or Eve that they could not touch the fruit or the tree or even that they would die if they touched it. Perhaps this isn’t an outright sin, but it may have opened up Eve, more subtly, to the temptations by the serpent, making her more prone to accept what the serpent told her.

Now that is fascinating. It opens up the possibility that someone sins who adds their own personal opinion to a Church teaching (e.g., by making something a sin which was not decreed to be a sin before they offered their addition).

And yet elaboration and interpretation goes on all the time. Obviously, it must be done with great care.

 

[Walter_Maxey]

…whatever Eve did, it was not a sin unto death. That is why it must be classified as a venial sin. … Mortal sin came through Adam and Adam alone.

1. Was it a grave matter?
2. Did Eve know it was a grave matter?
3. Did she choose to act of her own free will?

 

[Ron_Conte]

rcjones:

Scripture says that death and sin entered the human race through one man, Adam, because Adam was the head of his wife, Eve. However, this does not imply that Eve did not sin mortally. God stated to both Adam and Eve that eating the fruit would result in death, therefore, the sin was mortal for both of them.

ryanoneil: “So, Adam sees a powerful serpent (Hebrew nahash). A dragon or leviathan. He was with Eve the whole time but he did nothing. He was supposed to be guarding everything.”

This idea is not found in Sacred Tradition, nor in the teachings of the Magisterium. Tradition and Magisterium have always taught that the serpent was Satan, not a dragon. The claim that Adam was with Eve when she fell is an unsupported claim; it is not found in Tradition, Scripture, or the teachings of the Magisterium.

Also, Adam was not a priest. The ordained priesthood began with Christ, not Adam. The Jewish priesthood began with Divine Revelation to the Jews.

 

[ryanoneil]

ryanoneil: “So, Adam sees a powerful serpent (Hebrew nahash). A dragon or leviathan. He was with Eve the whole time but he did nothing. He was supposed to be guarding everything.”

This idea is not found in Sacred Tradition, nor in the teachings of the Magisterium. Tradition and Magisterium have always taught that the serpent was Satan, not a dragon.

Of course the serpent was Satan. Nahash is the word for serpent. Throughout the Old Testament nahash is used to refer to powerful, even gigantic, evil creatures.

**On that day, The LORD will punish with his sword that is cruel, great, and strong, Leviathan the fleeing serpent, Leviathan the coiled serpent; and he will slay the dragon that is in the sea. (Isa 27:1)

With his angry breath he scatters the waters, and he hurls the lightning against them relentlessly; His hand pierces the fugitive dragon as from his hand it strives to flee. (Job 26:13)**

Satan in the garden was not a garden variety snake. Which is why he is depicted as a dragon in the book of Revelation.

The huge dragon, the ancient serpent, who is called the Devil and Satan, who deceived the whole world, was thrown down to earth, and its angels were thrown down with it. (Rev 12:9)

The claim that Adam was with Eve when she fell is an unsupported claim; it is not found in Tradition, Scripture, or the teachings of the Magisterium.

In the Hebrew, every time the serpent says the word “you” he is saying “you all.” And the end of the story reveals that Adam was with her all along.

The woman saw that the tree was good for food, pleasing to the eyes, and desirable for gaining wisdom. So she took some of its fruit and ate it; and she also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. (Gen 3:6)

Also, Adam was not a priest. The ordained priesthood began with Christ, not Adam. The Jewish priesthood began with Divine Revelation to the Jews.

Don’t forget the ancient patriarchal order of priesthood that functioned during the long stretch of pre-Mosaic history. Adam and Jesus both belonged to the order of Melchizedek. Jesus was not called the “new Adam” only because he was God’s first born son.