Who's Going to Pay the Bills?: Purpose-Driven Coronavirus Business Shutdowns Cause Economic Catastrophe

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AlNg said:
False. Sweden is ignoring calls to quarantine.
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And they’re seeing over twice the mortality rate (currently 175 per million) as Denmark (64 per million) and seven times that of Finland (25 per million).

Hey, if one nation imposes less onerous sacrifices than another and yet somehow has a lower mortality rate, that’s good news. I’m not wishing this on anybody. We can hope that when this is over the public health researchers can sort out which interventions worked better than others and why. I don’t see any merit in heroic measures after we have evidence that they’re not worth the sacrifice. Before we know that, though, we do have enough information to see that doing nothing could have very devastating effects. Public health officials can only do their best in the meantime.
 
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JoeFreedom said:
I hope you are joking. Just start your own business. Sure that’s realistic. Oh and grow all your own food and raise some cows and chickens.
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No, I am not joking. The service sector economy is a fairly new concept in the scope of humanity. The art of self reliance or somewhat self reliance is a dying art. If you think owning your own business, or growing or raising your own food is a foreign concept, don’t know what to tell you. Again, if you don’t like being affected by others decisions, those are options for you. As of 2018 there were 30 million small businesses. That is a pretty large portion of the workforce.
JoeFreedom said:
I do not trust the health care sector to make decisions on the economy. If it were up to the CDC, they would shut us down completely until there was a vaccine.
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Do you trust the economic sector to make decisions on health issues? If it were up to them, they would take little to no precautions and let nature take it’s course all in the name of the almighty dollar.

Please don’t blame the states for not being prepared. Yes they had some responsibility, but there was a national response plan developed 15 years ago under Bush that was pretty much ignored. I guess states should be on their own for natural disasters as well. Lets just shut down FEMA, HHS, CDC, and all the other federal departments that are part of a national response plan.

When the feds are bidding against states for PPE, and in some cases ripping it out from under them, that is a terrible plan, or lack of plan.
 
farronwolf said:
No, I am not joking. The service sector economy is a fairly new concept in the scope of humanity. The art of self reliance or somewhat self reliance is a dying art. If you think owning your own business, or growing or raising your own food is a foreign concept, don’t know what to tell you.
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What I find unfathomable is that you insist people simply pick themselves out of this mess by “just starting a business and growing their own food”. I’m all for self-reliance, that’s why I am small-government conservative, but to suggest people, including myself, and considerably the poor, the elderly, those living in crowded cities, should all just go back to land farming and producing the own wealth is beyond reproach.

I had my own business once, but the regulatory and taxing burden was so heavy I gave it up. Entry to industry is overly difficult. We also grow our own vegetables, but county won’t let me have cows and chickens.
 
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Alas no. I see you are in a different part of the country than I. But hey, there are 50 governors, some men, some women, some idiots and some not. 😃
 
PetraG said:
We’re on a Catholic web site saying that if you lose your job or business or go through a terrible instance of real suffering that your life is ruined ? No. We can’t be implying that despair is a reasonable response to a disaster, even a very devastating disaster. That is not what our Faith teaches.
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Amen to that.

I haven’t read the entire thread but I see very little of Catholic social teaching in a lot of these responses. I could be wrong, apologies if I am.
 
Well I wouldn’t advise that now is the perfect time to start a new business, that is where folks should have planned previously if they don’t like someone telling them they can’t go to work or whatever.

As you stated in a previous post, the governors should have had a plan. Just substitute the “people” should have had a plan.

If you can’t have cows and chickens, move to where you can. In a few months, housing market may be a buyers market. Start looking.
 
AlNg said:
And much less than Spain, Italy the UK or the Netherlands.
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My state issued a stay at home order, but only dictated which businesses and activities must shut down–dine-in restaurants, theaters, salons, etc–rather than which ones are essential and are allowed to continue to remain open. The condition on those remaining open is that they could continue to operate if they could do so with physical distancing in place. That probably eliminates likely sources of large clusters and yet keeps a lot more of the economy open. I think it is a much more attainable set of restrictions in the longer term, at any rate.
 
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JoeFreedom said:
Alas no. I see you are in a different part of the country than I. But hey, there are 50 governors, some men, some women, some idiots and some not. 😃
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Even the best of us could make some over-cautious or under-cautious decisions at a time like this. It doesn’t take someone without the intellectual capacity to govern to make decisions the whole state would like to have back.

Pray for all of our leaders, especially now!!
 
PetraG said:
My state issued a stay at home order
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The politicians have torn up the constitution which gives you certain rights before they decide to order to imprison you in your own home. And what happened to the right to assembly. Or the right to practice your religion in the church of your choice. The politicians have shut down the churches.


You are arrested if you conduct a prayer service in church? Where does it say that in the US Constitution?
 
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Incorrect. The churches are still fully open.

They simply have restricted how many can attend the service.

The Bishop’s have determined that parishioners can not attend the Masses that are being held. At least our Bishop has. Along with canceling all meetings, and other parish activities.

Should we file law suits against our own Bishops?
 
AlNg said:
The politicians have torn up the constitution which gives you certain rights before they decide to order to imprison you in your own home
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And just to be clear to all our friends who say this is a different time… Fauci and Birks and Trump and Pence keep saying guidelines… because,

There is no constitutional authority by governors to disallow freedom of speech (shutting down peaceful protests), freedom of religion (closing up houses of worship), closing up restaurants and determining essential businesses willy nilly by decree and arresting people who come closer than 6 feet.

None

No constitutional authority.

And most don’t care, dont understand, and worse yet support the very destruction of the constitution that protects their rights.
 
Has the US Government made any law which has stopped the assembly?

No.

Each state has made the determination itself, and each church has also done the same. Hopefully folks realize that the Constitution of the US, is about the US Government, not the states.

As long as the states didn’t simply say churches can’t have service, but folks could go to the theater, or what not, there is no Constitutional challenge. This is a temporary order, not permanent, for the public safety.
 
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farronwolf said:
As long as the states didn’t simply say churches can’t have service, but folks could go to the theater, or what not, there is no Constitutional challenge. This is a temporary order, not permanent, for the public safety.
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The politicians say that you can disregard the Constitution for this reason or for that reason which in this case is supposedly for the public safety. But it has not been proven that imprisoning people in their homes promotes public safety.

Universal Declaration of Human rights:

Article 20.​

(1) Everyone has the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and association.

The American politicians have decided to throw this out the window and prohibit the peaceful assembly of more than 10 people in a place of worship.
 
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So now you are using the UN for confirmation of your position.

You are not imprisoned in your home. Is there anyone at your door with a gun or other measure of force to keep you from leaving?

You do realize that no UN or foreign law may supersede the US Constitution.

Are you Catholic? Has your Bishop suspended Mass attendance and given dispensation from such? If so, are you wearing out the phone line, the email, or snail mail to your Chancery?

If not, why?
 
farronwolf said:
So now you are using the UN for confirmation of your position.
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The USA signed the Universal Declaration of Human rights. “During the first half of the 20th century, the United States was an active proponent of establishing a universal human rights system. It was one of the leaders in creating the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which was signed in 1948.”
farronwolf said:
Has the US Government made any law which has stopped the assembly?

No.

Each state has made the determination itself,
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That is in violation of the 14th amendment: “No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;”
The politicians are abridging the privilege and the right of free assembly. By ordering businesses to shut down and by ordering people to stay at home the are depriving a person of the liberty to run a business deemed non-essential, such as selling guns, without due process of law. It is just an order to lock down without due process of law.
 
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