Why all the Mormon Bashing?

[dianaiad]

I think on social issues that threaten family values Catholic and Mormons do work together. I have mentioned on this site my admiration of what Mormons did in California with prop 8 - and I have defended the name of Mormons against people who have called them “bigots” for their efforts to prevent the legality same sex marriage.
That being said, the teachings of the Mormon church that delineate from Catholic teachings are false. It doesn’t do anyone any favors to ignore heresy. I do not know the state of the souls of a single Mormon, just I do not know the soul of any Catholics - that is purely up to God to know. However, that does not make their doctrine any less skewed.

Sorry, but we aren’t heretics, nor is what we believe ‘heresy.’

See, in order to be a heretic from Catholicism, one must have been Catholic in the first place.

However, calling us heretics puts those who do in an untenable position; see, one of the requirements for being a Christian heretic is that one must be a Christian. So if you claim that we are not (as Catholicism claims that we are not) then we cannot then be guilty of heresy. You can have one thing or another—but not both, and in our case, you don’t have either one.

 

[dianaiad]

the big joke is, thats not the only reason.and the bashing comes from every religon and non religon group .because its so obvious that their wrong and have no real proof on what they say or read from their author in the early 1900’s.

Interesting.

so…your contention is that the amount of Mormon bashing out there somehow indicates that we are wrong?

You do realize, don’t you, that Catholics and Catholicism are bashed as much or more than we are, by as many different sources, right?

Actually, bashing another religion says nothing about that religion. It says a great deal about the bashers, though—none of it complimentary.

It is one thing to disagree with doctrine, and address that issue with civility and respect for the believer; that is never a problem and always educational for both sides.

I don’t see that very often, though.

 

[rbiaca]

What we are criticizing is Mormon Church teachings. Yes, many Mormons are fine people in spite of their false religion. .

Millions, if not billions of people say the exact same thing about Catholicism.

 

[dianaiad]

Probably Mormons are gullible idiots who believe that God is a man who had actual sex with Mary, that women can only be saved by having as many kids as possible to bring their husbands glory in the after life, and that being black is God’s judgement but if a black person becomes righteous she or he will turn white! I guess that explains Michael Jackson! Finally, at death you’ll be judged by God and Joseph Smith.
As for queer marriage, a woman’s right to choose, and every thing else that keeps the world in progress:
Keep Church and State separate as Jesus commanded: “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things which are God’s”

Religio, I spoiled your fun with the last person who did this sort of thing. I’ll stay out of it if you want to take over…

 

[PaulDupre]

Millions, if not billions of people say the exact same thing about Catholicism.

That’s fine with me. Everyone is entitled to his opinion.

 

[ricko]

Sorry, but we aren’t heretics, nor is what we believe ‘heresy.’

See, in order to be a heretic from Catholicism, one must have been Catholic in the first place.

However, calling us heretics puts those who do in an untenable position; see, one of the requirements for being a Christian heretic is that one must be a Christian. So if you claim that we are not (as Catholicism claims that we are not) then we cannot then be guilty of heresy. You can have one thing or another—but not both, and in our case, you don’t have either one.

I agree. So we have it finally cleared up by your own statement. Mormons are not Christians.

 

[rbiaca]

That’s fine with me. Everyone is entitled to his opinion.

So then, truth is based upon opinion? Interesting…

 

[Eliza10]

Are you referring to Mormon bashing here on this forum? Read the contexts of so-called “bashing” posts carefully. The Non-Catholioc Religions forum is an appropriate place to discuss doctrinal differnces. But repeatedly certain LDS posters accuse those who persist in pointing out docrinal insconsistencie of “Mormon Bashing”. [They will love the topic of this thread and they will all be here to say “Poor Me”.] Tead throughone f the Mormon threads and you will see this pattern. It is a little frustrating if you are trying to make a point, especially when it seems obvious. So in that context things heat up.

And Lady_Diablo’s comments here are harsh, but the things she refers to - Mormon beleifs like Joseph Smiths insane racists doctrines, and an adulterer and scoundrel like Smith being our judge at death - those things do tend to make people’s blood boil. Clearly, that is bashing certain offensive Mormon beliefs, not bashing Mormons. There is a differnce! But its one that some LDS posters refuse to acknowledge, and they will be here on your thread with their “Here, here!”'s.

 

[Eliza10]

Er…this is a specific sub forum of this Catholic website, entitled ‘non-Catholic religions.’

It was formed specifically for the discussion of those religions, not Catholicism. Presumably it was done so in order to get those discussions OFF of forums devoted to purely Catholic topics.

Am I so out of line to think that a little respect for the faith of those non-Catholic religions is in order here? Perhaps not as much as you insist that we respect Catholicism, but, well…some?

Not ‘belief in,’ but 'respect for."

When a Catholic Forum discusses non-Catholic religions, its appropriate that doctrine is discussed, and its more than appropriate that dispicable practices like those of Smith be disrespected. Outrageous and offensive behaviors and so-called “teachings from God” of Smith and Brigham Young and others are just a fact, and when exposed, are not ever going to elicit respect. Also, when discussing doctrine, remember that from a Catholic point of view, certain Mormon doctrine is offensive.

 

[why_me]

Sorry, but we aren’t heretics, nor is what we believe ‘heresy.’

See, in order to be a heretic from Catholicism, one must have been Catholic in the first place.

However, calling us heretics puts those who do in an untenable position; see, one of the requirements for being a Christian heretic is that one must be a Christian. So if you claim that we are not (as Catholicism claims that we are not) then we cannot then be guilty of heresy. You can have one thing or another—but not both, and in our case, you don’t have either one.

You are too intelligent for this section of the board but your logic will go unheeded…trust me.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Er…this is a specific sub forum of this Catholic website, entitled ‘non-Catholic religions.’

It was formed specifically for the discussion of those religions, not Catholicism. Presumably it was done so in order to get those discussions OFF of forums devoted to purely Catholic topics.

Am I so out of line to think that a little respect for the faith of those non-Catholic religions is in order here? Perhaps not as much as you insist that we respect Catholicism, but, well…some?

Not ‘belief in,’ but 'respect for."

Correct, this is a sub-forum at a Catholic website. It is a place to discuss non-catholic religions. We do not have to show “respect for” beliefs that we know, as Catholics, are wrong. This is a place to discuss them, but we do not have to share the beliefs nor respect the beliefs.

 

[why_me]

I agree. So we have it finally cleared up by your own statement. Mormons are not Christians.

I prefer to let Christ decide in the hereafter. But I tend to go with that they are christian. You might be surprised in the hereafter.

 

[why_me]

Correct, this is a sub-forum at a Catholic website. It is a place to discuss non-catholic religions. We do not have to show “respect for” beliefs that we know, as Catholics, are wrong. This is a place to discuss them, but we do not have to share the beliefs nor respect the beliefs.

Best to follow this poem by Neuman, one of Mother Theresa’s favorite poems.

"Dear Lord, help me to spread you fragrance everywhere I go. Flood my soul
with your spirit and life.
“Penetrate and possess my whole being so utterly that all my life may only be a
radiance of you. Shine through me, and be so in me that every soul I come in
contact with may feel your presence in my soul. Let them look up and see no
longer me but only you, O Lord! Stay with me, and then I shall begin to shine as
you shine, so to shine as to be a light to others. The light , O Lord, will be all from
you; none of it will be mine; it will be you shining on others through me.
Let me thus praise you in the way you love best, by shining on those around me.
Let me preach you without preaching, not by words but by my example, by the
catching force, the sympathetic influence of what I do, the evident fullness of the
love my heart bears to you. Amen.”

Don’t you love this philosophy? It is wonderful.

 

[dianaiad]

Correct, this is a sub-forum at a Catholic website. It is a place to discuss non-catholic religions. We do not have to show “respect for” beliefs that we know, as Catholics, are wrong. This is a place to discuss them, but we do not have to share the beliefs nor respect the beliefs.

How about respecting the fact that those who believe these non-Catholic doctrines are as sincere in their beliefs as you are in yours, and that, well…nobody ever changed religions because his own has been sufficiently insulted?

The thing is, y’all have made it one of the CAF forum rules that we non-Catholic types MUST respect Catholic beliefs and posters. Don’t you think that you would further your purpose better if you behaved as you expect others to?

That doesn’t mean you need to agree with these other doctrines. It doesn’t mean that you can’t criticize them strongly. I think it does mean, however, that it doesn’t speak well for your group if you deliberately invite people into your forum (as you do with non-Catholic religions) and have totally different rules depending upon whether you are Catholic or not; we non-Catholics MUST be polite to you and respect your beliefs, but you don’t have to be either polite or respectful to us.

Has it not occurred to you that sweet reason and polite words are more likely to gain the sort of attention you claim to want than hitting people over the head with a rhetorical club? Of course, if your aim is not to reason or to discuss and learn, but instead it is to condemn, criticize and make certain that those non-Catholic religions STAY ‘non-Catholic religions’ so that you will always have someone to feel more righteous than, I suppose your approach is the correct one.

Think about it.

 

[why_me]

Are you referring to Mormon bashing here on this forum? Read the contexts of so-called “bashing” posts carefully.

Mormons are bashed continously on this section of the forum. And the context ia usually catholics starting antimormon threads and mormons defending their religion.

By the way I am a dad.

 

[SSTeacher]

dianaiad;5562514:

Er…this is a specific sub forum of this Catholic website, entitled ‘non-Catholic religions.’

It was formed specifically for the discussion of those religions, not Catholicism. Presumably it was done so in order to get those discussions OFF of forums devoted to purely Catholic topics.

Am I so out of line to think that a little respect for the faith of those non-Catholic religions is in order here? Perhaps not as much as you insist that we respect Catholicism, but, well…some?

Not ‘belief in,’ but 'respect for."

Correct, this is a sub-forum at a Catholic website. It is a place to discuss non-catholic religions. We do not have to show “respect for” beliefs that we know, as Catholics, are wrong. This is a place to discuss them, but we do not have to share the beliefs nor respect the beliefs.

By contrast, Saint Peter declared this in his first general letter to the Church.

But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect.

Helpfully,
Mick

 

[rbiaca]

How about respecting the fact that those who believe these non-Catholic doctrines are as sincere in their beliefs as you are in yours, and that, well.

Excellent point, but it is lost on many of the religious. That is one of the few areas where you cannot penetrate into the religious mind.

That a Hindu, is just as sure in his convictions and beliefs, as the Christian.

It goes right over their heads…they believe that they alone worship the correct God.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

Mormons are definitely bashed on this forum and usually the hardest by former Mormons who have converted to Catholicism, and frankly, it makes Catholics look bad. Why ex-Mormons hate practicing Mormons so much is totally beyond my comprehension. It’s really weird.

 

[SkinnyJay]

Sorry, but we aren’t heretics, nor is what we believe ‘heresy.’

See, in order to be a heretic from Catholicism, one must have been Catholic in the first place.

However, calling us heretics puts those who do in an untenable position; see, one of the requirements for being a Christian heretic is that one must be a Christian. So if you claim that we are not (as Catholicism claims that we are not) then we cannot then be guilty of heresy. You can have one thing or another—but not both, and in our case, you don’t have either one.

You, in fact, were Catholic. Every single Christian religion sprouted from the Truth of the Catholic Church. But having cut away roots in Apostolic Tradition every single Christian religion has also cut itself away from the life giving branch.

Here is a paragraph from the Catholic Encyclopedia:

St. Thomas (II-II:11:1) defines heresy: “a species of infidelity in men who, having professed the faith of Christ, corrupt its dogmas”. "The right Christian faith consists in giving one’s voluntary assent to Christ in all that truly belongs to His teaching. There are, therefore, two ways of deviating from Christianity: the one by refusing to believe in Christ Himself, which is the way of infidelity, common to Pagans and Jews; the other by restricting belief to certain points of Christ’s doctrine selected and fashioned at pleasure, which is the way of heretics. The subject-matter of both faith and heresy is, therefore, the deposit of the faith, that is, the sum total of truths revealed in Scripture and Tradition as proposed to our belief by the Church. The believer accepts the whole deposit as proposed by the Church; the heretic accepts only such parts of it as commend themselves to his own approval. The heretical tenets may be ignorance of the true creed, erroneous judgment, imperfect apprehension and comprehension of dogmas: in none of these does the will play an appreciable part, wherefore one of the necessary conditions of sinfulness–free choice–is wanting and such heresy is merely objective, or material. On the other hand the will may freely incline the intellect to adhere to tenets declared false by the Divine teaching authority of the Church. The impelling motives are many: intellectual pride or exaggerated reliance on one’s own insight; the illusions of religious zeal; the allurements of political or ecclesiastical power; the ties of material interests and personal status; and perhaps others more dishonorable. Heresy thus willed is imputable to the subject and carries with it a varying degree of guilt; it is called formal, because to the material error it adds the informative element of “freely willed”.

I believe that you have, like in St. Thomas’ definition, professed a belief in Christ, therefore making you Christian. However, you, the LDS faith, have corrupted who if fact you are believing. The same words are used but the meaning of those words have changed.

It is just important to note that the LDS faith have taken, like many, what was the traditional Apostolic teachings of who Christ was and picked and chose the concepts wanted. Diverging from what was True, cutting those roots. That is what a heretic does.

 

[Religio71]

Probably Mormons are gullible idiots who believe that God is a man who had actual sex with Mary, that women can only be saved by having as many kids as possible to bring their husbands glory in the after life, and that being black is God’s judgement but if a black person becomes righteous she or he will turn white! I guess that explains Michael Jackson! Finally, at death you’ll be judged by God and Joseph Smith.
As for queer marriage, a woman’s right to choose, and every thing else that keeps the world in progress:
Keep Church and State separate as Jesus commanded: “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things which are God’s”

Ok, I don’t agree with LDS teaching, but I think the difference between us that I don’t agree with the ACTUAL teachings.

Where did you get your information from? Surely not an actual LDS source…