Why are there a lot of misinformed and frankly uneducated Catholics that frown upon orthodox Church teachings and Traditions that were otherwise belov

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Based on your reply , I think you misread or at least misunderstood my post.

I wasn’t judging or condeming any one. I was just acknowledging that there are some traditionalists that do that (especially on the internet) and it repels people rather then attract them.

I also said that I dont belive the vast majority of TLM faithful are like that. Most all that I have meet are wonderful devote Catholic people
 
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Do fans of the NO Mass feel comfortable with the change of definition to the Mass? Officially, it is no longer the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. It is now a memorial of the Last Super.
 
As a new Catholic, I love the traditions of the Church. I know my Parish used to do Latin Mass on a Tuesday evening but don’t do it any more. I have attended this before and it was an amazing, beautiful Mass. It is sad to see this dying out.
 
I find the argument that ‘saints’ understood the ‘old Mass’ because it was a part of their culture, but we don’t’ argument less than compelling because, frankly, we are only 50 years into a change, the "old Mass’ was never abrogated so any artificial ‘revocation’ can be easily changed, and there are still quite a few people ‘out there’ who remember, as well as more and more coming in and learning today.

IOW, the vast majority of the saints, including Pope St. John Paul 2, who is a ‘new saint’ or a ‘modern saint’, still had knowledge of the old rite.

In fact, I don’t think you can find many saints of the Church who weren’t familiar with the ‘old rite’ (or, of course, with the various Eastern Catholic rites which are likewise a valuable part of Church liturgy).

In fact, I don’t think you can count on one hand the numbers of saints who have only been familiar with the OF.

Plus, the OF when done as the documents of Vatican 2 themselves called for WOULD include plenty of Latin; the Greek Kyrie, the Gloria (in Latin), the Creed (in Latin), the Sanctus and the Agnus Dei (Latin), and various responses (Et cum spiritu tuo), the Pater Noster, etc. in Latin.

When one comes to think of it, that’s a pretty fair amount of Latin that would be a unifying force now (as it had been for centuries) while still allowing for readings and prayers of the faithful etc in ‘the vernacular’.
 
Mac said:
I dont understand how a Catholic can not love the beautiful traditional liturgy. It is a masterpiece, and a treasure !!!

But I do understand how many never give it a chance do to their dislike of condeming judgmental , uncharitable, and self righteous attitudes they experience from some traditionalists. Especially on the internet.

Although I belive this attitude is rare and doesn’t reflect the majority of TLM faithful , it’s a problem that is not helping the noble cause of restoring the holy , faith building traditions.
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I think it is very beautiful also and do not understand why there are those that dislike it but interest toward the TLM certainly is growing, especially among the youth, which to me is very promising for the future of the Church. I’m pretty sure that uncharitable and judgemental attitudes can be found everywhere.
 
Well I asked for a source. You provided a Wikipedia link that says “this article has no source.”

In the link, it says things, but not where they are found, or who said what.
 
Bataar said:
Do fans of the NO Mass feel comfortable with the change of definition to the Mass? Officially, it is no longer the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. It is now a memorial of the Last Super.
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Paul VI quoted the Council of Trent at the beginning of his encyclical on the Eucharist:
At the Last Supper, on the night when He was betrayed, our Savior instituted the Eucharistic Sacrifice of His Body and Blood. He did this in order to perpetuate the Sacrifice of the Cross throughout the centuries until He should come again, and so to entrust to His beloved Spouse, the Church, a memorial of His Death and Resurrection: a sacrament of love, a sign of unity, a bond of charity, a paschal banquet in which Christ is eaten, the mind is filled with grace, and a pledge of future glory is given to us.
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That definition has not changed, indeed is the basis for all of the Reform.
 
Bataar said:
Do fans of the NO Mass feel comfortable with the change of definition to the Mass? Officially, it is no longer the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. It is now a memorial of the Last Super.
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I feel comfortable and right with the upper room rite in the presence of Jesus. It is fitting to anticipate His coming again in the flesh in these eschatalogical times.
 
stpurl said:
find the argument that ‘saints’ understood the ‘old Mass’ because it was a part of their culture, but we don’t’ argument less than compelling
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Because Latin was part of the culture…
 
I think the state of the Church and Catholics in the pews is an extremely complex situation to analyze. What we need more than anything else is the grace to be charitable with those who have different views than our own.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
I understand this post was likely born of your frustration but there is always going to be somebody who disagrees with you no matter what the subject is.
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I think the point is that there shouldn’t be so many who disagree on non-controversial matters within the Catholic fold.
 
Bataar said:
Officially, it is no longer the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass
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Emeraldlady:
I feel comfortable and right with the upper room rite in the presence of Jesus
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It IS still the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. I have never heard it called the “upper room rite”.
Emeraldlady said:
not really dislike of the Latin Mass though.
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To many it is a dislike.
Emeraldlady said:
The pomp and ceremony aspects aren’t conducive to conditions everywhere.
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Everything considered pomp and circumstance is prayer and has meaning and most all can be found in correctly done NO Masses, though shortened versions
 
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MagdalenaRita said:
I think it is very beautiful also and do not understand why there are those that dislike it
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It’s not really dislike of the Latin Mass though. It’s more just not needing to recreate the past ways to participate in the Eucharist. The pomp and ceremony aspects aren’t conducive to conditions everywhere. It’s impractical in many ways.
 
MagdalenaRita said:
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Bataar:
Officially, it is no longer the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass
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Emeraldlady:
I feel comfortable and right with the upper room rite in the presence of Jesus
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It IS still the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. I have never heard it called the “upper room rite”.
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That is what the new order of the Mass is recreating though. Jesus present to us at the memorial table in the upper room at the Pascal Supper.
 
That is only a part. The Mass is the re-presentation of the Sacrifice of Christ, whether a TLM or an NO.

The Last Supper was only the beginning of His passion.

We are partaking of His sacrifice at Calvary.

This is why there is always to be a crucifix on the altar table.

Please do not confuse people into thinking it is not the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
 
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