Why are there mutterings of discontent within the Catholic clergy towards our Pope?

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Absolutely… I know too many Catholics who hang on his every word as absolute truth.
 
Hell is not a place. Saint Pope John Paul II made that sarcastically clear.
 
The Church does not take a position any particular man is in hell.
 
Does it?
How about another verse:
Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.
Was that limited to a few soldiers? Romans? Pharisees?
Or those responsible?
 
Maximus1 said:
Does it?
How about another verse:
Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.
Was that limited to a few soldiers? Romans? Pharisees?
Or those responsible?
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Yes. The Pagans who knew no better. Judas Iscariot was with Jesus the entire time and knew exactly what was said would happen to Him. That he betrayed Him is the ultimate sentence to hell. Maybe if he repented and asked Jesus for forgiveness as Peter did after his denial, it would have been different. But just as selfishly as Judas betrayed Him for 20 pieces of silver, so he also selfishly took his life. If anyone is damned to hell it is Judas. And Jesus implied it would have been better he not been born.
 
CTBcin said:
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englands123:
He mentioned recently not to believe there is no hell.
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I’ve never heard Pope Francis claim there is no hell. In fact, he speaks quite strongly and openly about hell and Satan.
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also noticed this link in the thread

www.americamagazine.org

Why do some Catholics oppose Pope Francis?

Pope Francis does not aspire to fulfill his role as a theologian but as a pastor.
www.americamagazine.org www.americamagazine.org

and given the issue,…
niceatheist said:
Catholics in Mainland China have been persecuted for decades precisely because they were viewed as people whose first loyalty was to Rome.
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find it interesting no one mention Laudato si’ thus far in this thread which touches upon global leadership/politics by the Holy See

http://w2.vatican.va/content/france...-francesco_20150524_enciclica-laudato-si.html

since the americamagazine story said,…
…His [2016] encyclical “Laudato Si’,”on the care for our common home, shows a lack of scientific and ecological competence.
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just saying seems Laudato si’ is the metaphorical, elephant in the room, reading various catholic news media stories (which reflects politics here in the USA)


cruxnow.com

California’s bishops call for ecological conversion on ‘Laudato si’ milestone

California’s Catholic bishops have released a pastoral statement calling for ecological conversion in the state.
cruxnow.com cruxnow.com

said another way seems there is a battle for hearts/minds which is reflected in the wide chasm between left leaning news reporting on TV such as CNN/MSNBC,… AND right leaning social media sites like brightbart

one big question is who do your trust for sound teaching?
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Who in our age can we trust to listen to for sound teaching? Catholic Living
How can we tell these days who within the Church to listen to? With the ease of social media, I see a lot of Bishops and Cardinals opposing one another and often the Pope. Ill be honest, I get overwhelmed. Ill hear something that draws me to one person & then someone else points out how “wrong” they are. I think some times living in the age of information is a cruel curse. There is so much information everywhere, and it seems there is often no good reliable source to verify against.
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basically given catholic dogma about “hell” have to wonder if the reason there is “discontent towards our pope” is in reality denying what basic science is saying (because of economic or political bias) and/or refusing to care for creation (i.e. the position of our pope in Laudato si’)

…in other words the two sides battling over the issues like climate change, church sex abuse claims, abortion, etc., are afflicted

http://www.cgg.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Audio.details/ID/992/Why-Are-We-Afflicted.htm

by “confirmation bias”


anyway given Greta Thunberg and school students lead climate crisis protests, anyone have thoughts on if mortal sin is involved because the conflict over Laudato si’ might be viewed as the free will of “deniers” (influenced by social media) is putting “believers” (who watch TV news and follow that narrative) in harms way?!

bccatholic.ca

Catholics among top climate-change skeptics: scientist

Special to The B.C. Catholic Climate science is nearly 200 years old. For about 168 of those years scientist have known that adding more gases to the earth’s atmosphere leads to a warmer planet....
bccatholic.ca bccatholic.ca
 
Reminds me of Martin Luther. Could have been St. Martin Luther, but he decided to go completely off the rails.
 
Prodigal1984 said:
Maybe if he repented
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We don’t know if he repented. Repentance is an internal disposition. If you say that he went to Hell because he commited suicide and couldn’t repent after, then we are working under the false logic that all suicidal persons go to Hell. God is not bound by moral theology.

Maybe he is Saint Judas, and we don’t know.
 
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And what exactly did he do to be a saint besides steal money from the collection bag and sell out the Son of God for money?
 
You don’t earn sainthood (i.e. being in Heaven). You just have to repent from your sins and God will forgive you (if we get technical, this is trough Confession, Baptism, Perfect Contrition or any other mean that God may use). That’s why the worst of sinners can be transformed and be send to Heaven by God.
Though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow
Isaiah 1:18
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ConcernedConvert said:
Absolutely… I know too many Catholics who hang on his every word as absolute truth.
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A lot of Catholics today are different to Catholics in general when I was growing up. We had complete conviction that Christ promised that He would be with the Church until the end and that the Church could be accepted and believed in as our authentic teacher. Too many Catholics today actually pride themselves on disagreeing with the the Popes teachings and revel in spreading doubt about his authority. It’s such a strange phenomena for people who’ve been faithful Catholics for the last 40, 50, 60 years and more.
 
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But being faithful to the church does not mean hanging on every word the pope has said as absolute truth. (The dogma of papal infallibility itself is very clear about the authority the pope has and when he uses it) We, as the Catholic Church, have truth. Very little is left undetermined or undefined. Past councils, popes and saints have already defined Most of the truths we hold. So when modern popes make comments that contradict historical practices and teachings it is our duty to hold onto the truths that have already been established and stand up for those truths and for the Church.
 
ConcernedConvert said:
. So when modern popes make comments that contradict historical practices and teachings it is our duty to hold onto the truths that have already been established and stand up for those truths and for the Church.
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It has never been our ‘duty’ to determine that a Pope is ‘contradicting historical practices and teachings’. The whole purpose of the Church is to convey the Truths of Christ to the generation that they are responsible for. When Pope St John Paul II taught various things that some Catholics deemed contradicting the historical teachings, sedevacantism spiked to the greatest level since the reformation. These people considered themselves more learned than the Pope. Yet we all know that every Pope is just expounding on previous teaching in the light of revelation.
 
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Let me ask you this. Are you a part of the Catholic Church? If you are, then it is and always has been your duty to protect the teachings of the church. By holding onto the truths that have already been taught and knowing when error is being taught elsewhere. Who else is responsible for this.
 
ConcernedConvert said:
Let me ask you this. Are you a part of the Catholic Church? If you are, then it is and always has been your duty to protect the teachings of the church. By holding onto the truths that have already been taught and knowing when error is being taught elsewhere. Who else is responsible for this.
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Yes I am part of the Catholic family in Christ. The Pope or ‘papa’ is my father in faith and I trust him to lead me by his charism under the protection of the Holy Spirit as promised. As a child, I’m in no position to question the papa on matters that I’m not trained for or authorised in.
 
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At one point in history there were three lines of claimants to the papacy, so it might not have been easy to know which claimant was the real pope. But in practice, Catholics worldwide don’t have much contact with the papacy; they just follow the constant teaching of the Church.
 
And did Judas ever confess? Did he go up to Jesus and say forgive me?. No he did not. He is in hell. I cannot believe you are defending the traitor of the Lord.
 
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