Why are WE here?

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buffalo said:
When one is dealing with opposite opinions they both cannot be true.
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Unfortunately we will never find out who is right…until we die and maybe not even then.😉

On a side note, I never heard a Catholic say that you’re not supposed to enjoy life.
 
Lui said:
Unfortunately we will never find out who is right…until we die and maybe not even then.😉

On a side note, I never heard a Catholic say that you’re not supposed to enjoy life.
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It depends on what you mean. Enjoy or be joy filled?

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/5129VDGLOSL.BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01.jpg

Might be worth a read.

Life After Death: The Evidence

Is death the end? Or, as bestselling author Dinesh D’Souza argues, do the latest discoveries in physics and neuroscience, the most convincing philosophical deductions, and the most likely conclusions from anthropology and biology lend increasing credibility to the prospect of life after death?

Life After Death: The Evidence presents a reasoned, scientifically based case that life after death is more than possible, it is highly probable. Indeed it has far more evidence on its side than atheistic arguments about death marking our complete and utter extinction. In a stunning tour de force, D’Souza reveals:

How modern science lays the groundwork for a science-based belief in life after death
The distinctions between mind and brain—and why it is perfectly reasonable to assume that your immaterial consciousness can survive the dissolution of your material body
The great atheist philosopher who provided one of the most ingenious proofs for the likelihood of an afterlife
How the theory of evolution, far from undercutting the idea of life after death, supports it
The evidence of Near Death Experiences—what it tells us, what it doesn’t
Why the Christian view of the afterlife is the most compelling and best suits the evidence
What the probability of life after death means for our lives before death

Provocative, and combining a mastery of the arguments from philosophy, physics, and biology with an incisive analysis of how the world’s major religions have viewed the afterlife, D’Souza shows why we can expect that what Shakespeare called the “undiscovered country” will be discovered by us all.
 
wanstronian said:
I think it’s desperately sad that anyone is indoctrinated to this way of thinking. There’s no reason at all to believe this, or to belittle yourself and the human race in such a way. This just goes to show how much unnecessary damage religion causes.
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Post Robert Sock’s view is not based on Catholic teaching, in fact it is clearly at odds with it. So you conclusion “…damage religion causes” does not follow.
 
davidv said:
Post Robert Sock’s view is not based on Catholic teaching, in fact it is clearly at odds with it. So you conclusion “…damage religion causes” does not follow.
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Please back up your accusations with facts.
 
wanstronian said:
It would be interesting to see one or two rebuttals from a dogmatic proponent of the superstition which endows matter with the magical power to create* absolutely everything in the entire universe ***
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It must be horrible to be unaware that your entire interpretation of reality is based on substition, i.e. the unjustified assumption that rational beings are derived from that which is subhuman, substandard and** sub**terranean!
How do you think the universe came to be as it is now?
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Certainly not by atoms miraculously making themselves into masters of themselves who proceed to explain themselves as permutations of atoms… :whistle:
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Robert_Sock said:
Please back up your accusations with facts.
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Here is one:

CCC said:
18299 The *fruits *of charity are joy, peace, and mercy; charity demands beneficence and fraternal correction; it is benevolence; it fosters reciprocity and remains disinterested and generous; it is friendship and communion: Love is itself the fulfillment of all our works. There is the goal; that is why we run: we run toward it, and once we reach it, in it we shall find rest.108
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Another:

CCC said:
2500 The practice of goodness is accompanied by spontaneous spiritual joy and moral beauty. Likewise, truth carries with it the joy and splendor of spiritual beauty. Truth is beautiful in itself. Truth in words, the rational expression of the knowledge of created and uncreated reality, is necessary to man, who is endowed with intellect. But truth can also find other complementary forms of human expression, above all when it is a matter of evoking what is beyond words: the depths of the human heart, the exaltations of the soul, the mystery of God. Even before revealing himself to man in words of truth, God reveals himself to him through the universal language of creation, the work of his Word, of his wisdom: the order and harmony of the cosmos-which both the child and the scientist discover-“from the greatness and beauty of created things comes a corresponding perception of their Creator,” "for the author of beauty created them."290
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Highlighting is mine
 
davidv said:
Here is one:
Another:
Highlighting is mine
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I firmly believe in those excerpts. Spiritual joys are joyful, and are never condemned. But still, we live in a world filled with evils of various sorts. We are here in hopes of gaining salvation. We are warned not to take too much physical pleasure from this life.
 
The Golden Key to Heaven
by Saint Anthony Mary Claret

The death of the just: Death will reach everyone, the good and the bad; but the destiny of each one is quite different. The just man sees himself in this valley of tears as a prisoner, serving a very hard term. He considers himself a slave in this world, suffering an extremely distressing servitude. He regards himself a sailor caught in a horrible storm. And as death means an end of his confinement, an end of his slavery, and is the port of his salvation, he ceases not to cry with David, “Woe is me that my sojourning is prolonged!. . .” (Ps. 119:5). He ceases not to ask with the Apostle, “. . . Who shall deliver me from the body of this death?” (Rom. 7:24)
 
Robert_Sock said:
I firmly believe in those excerpts. Spiritual joys are joyful, and are never condemned. But still, we live in a world filled with evils of various sorts. We are here in hopes of gaining salvation. We are warned not to take too much physical pleasure from this life.
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So will you retract this statement that you made that started this sidetrack?
Robert Sock:
…We were never meant to enjoy this life.
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We experience the spiritual joys in this life, not just in the life hereafter.
 
davidv said:
So will you retract this statement that you made that started this sidetrack?
We experience the spiritual joys in this life, not just in the life hereafter.
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No, I can’t retract anything. All I can do is add that spiritual joys are to be enjoyed to their fullest. The joy in charity is a part of spiritual joy.
 
Robert_Sock said:
I firmly believe in those excerpts. Spiritual joys are joyful, and are never condemned. But still, we live in a world filled with evils of various sorts. We are here in hopes of gaining salvation. We are warned not to take too much physical pleasure from this life.
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The world is certainly a vale of tears but it is also a source of joy and delight. To regard this life as merely a test is to play into the hands of those who ridicule Christians for putting pie in the sky before happiness on earth!
 
tonyrey said:
The world is certainly a vale of tears but it is also a source of joy and delight. To regard this life as merely a test is to play into the hands of those who ridicule Christians for putting pie in the sky before happiness on earth!
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Who regards this life as merely a test? Where do I state that?

And how can this life be viewed as both a vale of tears and a source of joy and delight? Isn’t it better to see that we live in a miserable and corrupt world and postpone the joy and laughter to the Hereafter?
 
Robert_Sock said:
The world is certainly a vale of tears but it is also a source of joy and delight. To regard this life as merely a test is to play into the hands of those who ridicule Christians for putting pie in the sky before happiness on earth!
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You implies it with your statement “We were never meant to enjoy this life”.
And how can this life be viewed as both a vale of tears and a source of joy and delight?
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There is good and evil, love and hate, success and disaster, beauty and ugliness…
Isn’t it better to see that we live in a miserable and corrupt world and postpone the joy and laughter to the Hereafter?
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Saints are not sad! 🙂
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Kismetji said:
Is this a genuine inquiry or do your Catholic presuppositions commit you to an answer a priori?
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Actually…scratch that. I suppose not all Catholics assume a priori there must be a purpose for humanity. My bad.
 
tonyrey said:
You implies it with your statement “We were never meant to enjoy this life”.

There is good and evil, love and hate, success and disaster, beauty and ugliness…

Saints are not sad! 🙂
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I backed up my position using prayer (Post #100), a biblical verse (Post #100) and the writing of a great saint (Post #110). If you wish to refute me, I think you would need to address my sources.
 
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