WHY are you NOT a Catholic?

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If you actually believe that we cannot know of God in general by reason alone, then you may as well believe in a fairy tale, because every other religion more or less claim they possess the truth, and you reject reason (which is common to all able men) as the primary arbiter to distinguish between truth and falsehood.
 
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Patrick, I read just some more of your replies to me. I’ve actually been on CAF for awhile. Please do not assume what I do and do not know about Catholicism. When I first joined I was an ex Muslim who wanted to become Catholic, but eventually I regained my faith in Islam.
 
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Thanks for the reply,

By Knowing “of” God, in MY understanding, does not necessarily, or even likely likely to know as much as your attribute to knowing God. Knowing God in an absolute sense requires cooperation with His grace, and grace can be, and very often is rejected.

Regards
Patrick
 
Then My friend, you missed out on the opportunity for TRUTH, which can only be singular per defined issie.

BENEDICT XVI
Benedict says: “If we omit the truth, what do we do anything for?”
“Their cannot be your truth and my truth or there would be no truth”

FATHER HARDON, one f the most esteemed theologians of the 20th Century} taught this about TRUTH:

“Truth is the condition of grace, it is the source of grace, it is the channel of grace, it is the divinely ordained requirement of grace.” ….Father was a friend and occasional mentor of mine.

Ps.145 Verses 17 to 18 “
[17] The LORD is just in all his ways, and kind in all his doings. [18] The LORD is near to all who call upon him, to all who call upon him in truth.

Dictionary Definition of “Truth”
  1. The true or actual state of a matter:
    conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement
  2. a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like mathematical truths.
  3. the state or character of being true.
  4. actuality or actual existence.
  5. an obvious or accepted fact; truism; platitude.
  6. honesty; integrity; truthfulness.
  7. (often initial capital letter) ideal or fundamental reality apart from and
    transcending perceived experience:
  8. agreement with a standard or original.
    9… accuracy, as of position or adjustment.
  9. Archaic. Fidelity or constancy. End quotes
In Georges Bernanos’ Diary of a Country Priest, the elderly Curé de Torcy gives his young priest friend a bit of advice about proclaiming the Gospel: “The Word of God is a red-hot iron,” he says**. “Truth is meant to save you first, and the comfort comes later.”**

SEEK truth not convenience friend

Regards
Patrick
 
My friend, is their a reason you choose not to answer the questions I asked of you in my lengthy reply?

Regards
Patrick
 
SalamKhan said:
If you actually believe that we cannot know of God in general by reason alone, then you may as well believe in a fairy tale, because every other religion more or less claim they possess the truth, and you reject reason (which is common to all able men) as the primary arbiter to distinguish between truth and falsehood.
Click to expand...
Reason by itself is blinded by the fallen condition of human beings. It is the Holy Ghost that, by grace, brings us to knowledge of God. By hearing the word, being Baptized, etc.
 
Well; first off my parents are Catholics. They can only tell me the reason why is that dad likes the way it makes him feel and mom says that is how she was raised. I read one post here claiming the Bible is a Catholic book. NOT. The “Bible” is a collection of books which are very Jewish in their authorship. Yes, Catholics were used as a tool by God to pull these books together. And yes there are Catholics that are “Christians”. I’ve been studying the Catechism as well as the instruction in missals, and other authors late and current. There are many many reasons I am not Catholic i.e. Christmas, Easter, Sunday solemnity, innate immortality, purgatory, idolatry. And that is just some of it. What do I admire in Catholics? Their devotion and dedication; the real ones. It’s very easy to lay claim to Christianity, quite another to “be” so.
 
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@PJM To what extent do you believe that reason alone can lead to knowledge of God in general? Keep in mind, Vatican I pronounced anathema on those who say that the existence of God cannot be proven by reason alone. Except Catholic theologians slightly differ on what can be known of God in general, they attribute to Him: simplicity, goodness, perfection, infinity, omnipresence, immutability, eternity, unity, knowledge, power, will, etc.
 
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@JonNC If the human intellect is so fallible and incapable in the way you say it is, then not even divine illumination could save it. And if you say it can, then your words mean nothing due to your perpetual incompetency (from such a fallible and incapable intellect) in discussing unseen matters.
 
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SalamKhan said:
@JonNC If the human intellect is so fallible and incapable in the way you say it is,
then not even divine illumination could save it.
And if you say it can, then your words mean nothing due to your perpetual incompetency (from such a fallible and incapable intellect) in discussing unseen matters.
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I’m not willing to put this kind of human limitation on God.
It is only incapable in terms of our ability to seek God. It takes “divine illumination” (grace) to open the human heart to God.
This was the reason for the Incarnation of The Christ, the reason for His death and resurrection. He loved us while we were still in our sins, before we first loved Him.
 
@JonNC That doesn’t change what I said one iota. How do you know grace, or divine illumination could do this, when you believe your intellect is incapable of knowing these matters? Or are you saying that the intellect is incapable of coming to know of God’s existence and general attributes, yet is somehow capable of knowing His specific operations?
 
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SalamKhan said:
@JonNC That doesn’t change what I said one iota. How do you know grace, or divine illumination could do this, when you believe your intellect is incapable of knowing these matters?
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Well, first, I have experienced grace first hand. Hence, what I was unable to do without grace, I am now capable, by the power of the Holy Spirit.
I’m rather interested why you think our intellectual capabilities are so important.
Or are you saying that the intellect is incapable of coming to know of God’s existence and general attributes, yet is somehow capable of knowing His specific operations?
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What I’m saying I have already said. Because of the fall, we lack the capability to seek God on our own without grace.
And I’d still like to know how it is that your understanding of God’s general attributes is correct.

You made the charge that the Trinity and Incarnation run counter to the general attributes of a God, but you haven’t explained how you know this.
 
@JonNC Many claim to have experienced something first hand in their own religious traditions. In Islam for example, the Sufis claim to have experienced gnosis (ma`rifat) of Allah. To make this the sole arbiter in deciding what is true, today is called phenomenology, in the Medieval West it was Augustinian Illuminationism, whereas in the East it was known as hikmat al ishraq. This makes the truth subjective rather than objective, relative rather than absolute.

Reason, or the intellect, is common to all men, regardless of whether the conclusions you reach with your intellect are right or wrong, you are always using it. You decided that it was the ‘Holy Ghost’ who moved you, after having some sort of experience, and you reached this conclusion with your intellect.

The question of whether God exists, is an intellectual matter. And there are three types of intellectual judgements:

Necessary- the non-existence of which cannot be conceived of in the mind.

Impossible- the existence of which cannot be conceived of in the mind.

Possible- the existence and non-existence of which can both be equally conceived of in the mind.

Understand these three intellectual judgements, and we’ll move further along.
 
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What Vatican 1 taught is the God can and ought to be known through profound beauty and complexity of the Universe…

This is logical and required

Continued Blessings my friend

Patrick
 
My FRIEND,

From your lips to God’s ears [our GOD]😃

Thanks for being on CAF,

The Holy Spirit whom you denied led you here.

STICK AROUND AND BE EXPOSED TO TRUTH
 
Here is the first part of my reply. Your many concerns requires FAR MORE SPACE than the FORUM grants us, so my REPLIES on which I am still working.; i’m up to purgatory, but Sunday & Monday are My MInistry day’s so I’m still completing what your stated -concerns topics of unbelief. .

PLEASE BE LOOKING FOR THEM, READ THEM, ad share your thoughts

My friend there are as many levels of both heaven & Hell as there are of Catholic right understanding of their Faith, and for a GREAT many it’s not ALL their fault as post Vatican II catechesis was for a prolonged period not getting that job done.

Space is severely restricted now so my reply will take multiple [hopefully] consecutive POST in order to respond to all of your points. It would seem that neither parent knows the faith well enough to be able to explain it. Pray for them.

I am the author of the “Bible is a Catholic Book which space prohibited me from fully explaining,

You are correct that it was the Early Catholic Church Fathers, Inspired by the HS who choose the OT text; and it was Early Catholics who authored the entire NT. Hence the Bible is a CATHOLIC-Birthed book; assembled by Catholics & authored by Catholics, and as the Bible was in-total a CATHOLIC work, completed by the end of the 1st Century; it is evident & logically a book exclusively intended FOR Catholics by God’s Inspired intent.

The RCC is the actual Church & Faith founded by Christ which is historically provable] and the ONLY TRUE Faith and church to call themselves “Christians” until the 16th Century and the Reformation/Revolt & the body of newly invented human, not HS guided faith beliefs it spurred & continues to spur. Each of which is in denial of God’s TRUTH which can be nothing other than SINGULAR per defined issue, & God’s TRUE Faith had already been known. Defined, & accepted as guided by the HS for some 1,400 years. Luther himself was an apostate RCC priest.

For the record: ALL Catholic’s are “Christians”

Friend I want to answer all of your concerns, but don’t know if I fully understand them

Easter Sunday: Christ Rose from the DEAD 3 days after Good-Friday = Easter Sunday. It is the highest religious feast of the year, because it was not Christ Birth and Life [as essential as they are], but Christ Resurrection that OPENED heaven’s gate after it had been locked, due to the Original Sin of Adam & Eve, thus making it NOW-possible for Souls to merit their salvation.

Christmas is celebrated because it was on that feast that GOD [Creator of the Universe] literally became a human being. Like US in every way but sin. ALMIGHTY GOD choose for many reason to put on the mantel of human flesh, & enter into the realm of human suffering & SORROW. That friend is a WOW!

SEE NEXT POST REPY.
 
REPLY PT

I can see from your objections that you have been studying other Christian faiths as well, & that is a good thing. You need to be sure; BUT never lose sight of the fact that TRUTH has to be; can only be, singular per defined issue.
TRUTH
Benedict XVI irrefutable human logic teache:
“Their cannot be your truth and my truth or there would be no truth”

FATHER HARDON, one f the most esteemed theologians of the 20th
Century} taught this about TRUTH:

“Truth is the condition of grace, it is the source of grace, it is the channel of grace, it is the divinely ordained requirement of grace.” MEANING without God’s grace His intended understanding is impossible to grasp.

Which firmly explains the thousands of Protestant churches & the multiplicity of faith beliefs. They are blocked from right understanding.

Rom. 9:15 “For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”

2nd. Cor. 4:3-4 “And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled only to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the likeness of God.

Eph. 4: 17-18 “Now this I affirm and testify in the Lord, that you must no longer live as the Gentiles do, in the futility of their minds; they are darkened in their understanding, alienated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them, due to their hardness of heart”

Ps.145 :17 - 18
The LORD is just in all his ways, and kind in all his doings. The LORD is near to all who call upon him, to all who call upon him in truth.

Definition of “Truth”
  1. The true or actual state of a matter:
    conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement
  2. a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like mathematical truths.
  3. the state or character of being true.
  4. actuality or actual existence.
  5. an obvious or accepted fact; truism; platitude.
  6. honesty; integrity; truthfulness.
  7. (often initial capital letter) ideal or fundamental reality apart from and
    transcending perceived experience:
  8. agreement with a standard or original.
    9… accuracy, as of position or adjustment.
  9. Archaic. Fidelity or constancy. End quotes
Georges Bernanos’ Diary of a Country Priest, the elderly Curé de Torcy gives his young priest friend a bit of advice about proclaiming the Gospel: “The Word of God is a red-hot iron,” he says. "Truth is meant to save you first, and the comfort comes later."

GOD, not man determines HIS Truths.

Please look for my future post to you More to come as I work on answering your other concerns
 
Please feel free to message me! I’ll love to hear from you!! God bless, jim
 
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@JonNC I was, in case you missed it:

"The question of whether God exists, is an intellectual matter. And there are three types of intellectual judgements:

Necessary- the non-existence of which cannot be conceived of in the mind.

Impossible- the existence of which cannot be conceived of in the mind.

Possible- the existence and non-existence of which can both be equally conceived of in the mind.

Understand these three intellectual judgements, and we’ll move further along."

I take it you are not yet ready to move on to the next stage of my answer?
 
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