Why are you not Catholic?

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crai7 said:
This is what I’m not understanding regarding what PRmerger is saying. I don’t understand what the issue is - especially given that many non-Catholics accept transubstantiation?
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There may be some non-Catholics who accept transubstantiation but Lutherans do not. We believe that the Real Presence is there during communion but the elements are not turned into Jesus - Body, Soul and Divinity. When I am at the communion altar and receive the elements I am receiving the blessing from this Sacrament of the “forgiveness of sins which Christ’s body and blood have won for us on the cross.” (Luther’s Small Catechism 296)

God bless

Rita
 
spedteacherita said:
There may be some non-Catholics who accept transubstantiation but Lutherans do not. We believe that the Real Presence is there during communion but the elements are not turned into Jesus - Body, Soul and Divinity. When I am at the communion altar and receive the elements I am receiving the blessing from this Sacrament of the “forgiveness of sins which Christ’s body and blood have won for us on the cross.” (Luther’s Small Catechism 296)

God bless

Rita
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Okay I see. I think this makes it pretty clear: patheos.com/blogs/standingonmyhead/what-do-we-mean-by-the-real-presence
 
PRmerger said:
I don’t think you should judge a church on how welcoming it is.

That would be like dismissing Jesus because one of his disciples didn’t smile at you.

Good luck on your faith journey, but I would caution you from “church shopping”, glad2bhome. That’s the epitome of creating a god after your own self.

Don’t find a church that conforms to your views.

Find the Church Christ established, and the conform your views to His.

For it stands to reason, that if there is a God, then His Ways are not going to be your ways.

As Pastor Tim Keller says, paraphrasing, “If your god happens to agree with everything you believe, then you may just be worshipping an idealized version of yourself.”
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The “smile” analogy. That’s pretty much a fall back saved for every situation where an individual states they didn’t feel welcome…I haven’t been lurking too crazy long. Just want to make sure we’re on the same page.

Feeling “welcomed” goes much deeper for some people than just a “smile”…we all understand that, right?
 
TC3033 said:
The “smile” analogy. That’s pretty much a fall back saved for every situation where an individual states they didn’t feel welcome…I haven’t been lurking too crazy long. Just want to make sure we’re on the same page.

Feeling “welcomed” goes much deeper for some people than just a “smile”…we all understand that, right?
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Yes, we all understand that.

And you can understand how incredulous it is to think that someone would base the choice of what Church is Christ’s Church on how welcoming it is.

I mean, we all understand that a church can be the most awesome church at welcoming, but be preaching some bizarre doctrines, yes?
 
PRmerger said:
Yes, we all understand that.

And you can understand how incredulous it is to think that someone would base the choice of what Church is Christ’s Church on how welcoming it is.

I mean, we all understand that a church can be the most awesome church at welcoming, but be preaching some bizarre doctrines, yes?
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Yep, but if one steps foot into a Church for the first time and are treated like they don’t belong, even in front of their family, and again…and again…and at a different Church…and again…at a function…may cause a person to not want to investigate said Church any further. I mean, I would think one must be able to understand that. 🤷
 
TC3033 said:
Yep, but if one steps foot into a Church for the first time and are treated like they don’t belong, even in front of their family, and again…and again…and at a different Church…and again…at a function…may cause a person to not want to investigate said Church any further. I mean, I would think one must be able to understand that. 🤷
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Certainly.

But it would be like leaving Jesus because of Judas.

And one could certainly see how wrong that would be, yes?
 
PRmerger said:
Certainly.

But it would be like leaving Jesus because of Judas.

And one could certainly see how wrong that would be, yes?
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Unless one believes that they don’t have to be Catholic to be with Jesus.
 
@TC3033

you are who you are…if you don’t smile does it might mean that they are sad. or for other reasons… people in catholic church work hard to achieve a contrite heart. and some need to focus on this, it might mean they are not ignoring you or not being welcoming.it might be their heart and mind might be doing other things.

my mother would never talk going to mass at all. she said her prayers hours before mass and during mass in deep prayer. not being biased here but after mass and through the week she had time for everybody. how,ill never know. but she did.
 
Doormouse said:
@TC3033

you are who you are…if you don’t smile does it might mean that they are sad. or for other reasons… people in catholic church work hard to achieve a contrite heart. and some need to focus on this, it might mean they are not ignoring you or not being welcoming.it might be their heart and mind might be doing other things.

my mother would never talk going to mass at all. she said her prayers hours before mass and during mass in deep prayer. not being biased here but after mass and through the week she had time for everybody. how,ill never know. but she did.
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This is absolutely true.

Some folks may be in deep prayer, or aware of grave sin and at that point, not feeling so chatty.

Not to mention that when one is in the Presence of the Holy of Holies, it doesn’t lend itself to chattiness. Rather, awed silence ought to be the default.

Nevertheless, it’s true that Catholics are horrible at welcoming others, and it is something we ought to learn from our Protestant brethren.
 
Doormouse said:
@TC3033

you are who you are…if you don’t smile does it might mean that they are sad. or for other reasons… people in catholic church work hard to achieve a contrite heart. and some need to focus on this, it might mean they are not ignoring you or not being welcoming.it might be their heart and mind might be doing other things.

my mother would never talk going to mass at all. she said her prayers hours before mass and during mass in deep prayer. not being biased here but after mass and through the week she had time for everybody. how,ill never know. but she did.
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I would never expect ones to be “chatty” during mass. Do Catholics believe non-Catholics sit and shoot the breeze during service?

My experience was not that of not being “shot a smile”, but from other observances and how I believe I’m being looked at.
 
TC3033 said:
Actually no, no I’m not, PR.
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Here’s the analogy:

Jesus :Judas :: Catholic Church : unsmiling people.

Take this simple analogy:

Christmas tree : ornament :: earlobe : earring

What you are doing when you mix the metaphors is saying, “The analogy is false because earlobes don’t appear only at Christmas”.
 
I understand but do not agree with your feelings. Some people have told me they don’t like children crying in mass, The list could go on. but like PR says, we do need to work on the way we welcome people into the Church.
 
PRmerger said:
Here’s the analogy:

Jesus :Judas :: Catholic Church : unsmiling people.

Take this simple analogy:

Christmas tree : ornament :: earlobe : earring

What you are doing when you mix the metaphors is saying, “The analogy is false because earlobes don’t appear only at Christmas”.
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I understand the analogy you are attempting to make, I just don’t find it applicable.

And why the condescension utilizing “unsmiling people” over…and over… I don’t believe I ever used that verbiage, but it keeps being brought up.
 
Doormouse said:
I understand but do not agree with your feelings. Some people have told me they don’t like children crying in mass, The list could go on. but like PR says, we do need to work on the way we welcome people into the Church.
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Don’t agree with my feelings…so how should I take the way I was/am treated as an outsider and feel?
 
TC3033 said:
I understand the analogy you are attempting to make, I just don’t find it applicable.

And why the condescension utilizing “unsmiling people” over…and over… I don’t believe I ever used that verbiage, but it keeps being brought up.
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Because, as we already agreed, we understand that it’s a condensed way to say, “People who are not welcoming to non-Catholic Christians attending Mass”
 
TC3033 said:
Don’t agree with my feelings…so how should I take the way I was/am treated as an outsider and feel?
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You should recognize it as people not living out their faith.

And then move on and investigate which Church is the one Christ established, join it, and conform your views to Christ’s, and then make sure that you welcome everyone in the proper way, given the presence of the Blessed Sacrament in close proximity.
 
try sitting a bit nearer to the front.they seem to have a smile from ear to ear. 👍
other than that im afraid ive said my part.
 
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