Why Can't Anyone Have A Different Opinion About The Holocaust?

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I think the problem is that, in my experience, when people have different opinions about the Holocaust, they also tend to have a negative view of Jews, Judaism, and the state of Israel. They see that world sympathy due to the Holocaust has led many nations to recognize Israel and treat the Jews with respect. Thus, they think that if they can somehow prove the Holocaust did not happen or was much smaller in reality, it will cause those around them to adopt their own anti-Jewish views.

Plus, Holocaust denial and Holocaust “reduction” seem to come not from reputable historians and researchers, but rather from conspiracy theorists who read the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and think the Jews are responsible for 9-11.
 
Williamson did a whole lot more than quibble about numbers - he denied that any at all died in gas chambers, which is silly, the chambers existed and were found and documented after the war, same with the bodies of gassed Jews, and containers of the gas used (Zyklon B).
No Lily, he said there weren’t that many gas chambers, he didn’t say there weren’t any. I don’t know why he would say these things if he didn’t have any evidence to it. The Jewish couple who lied and said they were there when they weren’t, only makes matters worse.
 
No Lily, he said there weren’t that many gas chambers, he didn’t say there weren’t any. I don’t know why he would say these things if he didn’t have any evidence to it. The Jewish couple who lied and said they were there when they weren’t, only makes matters worse.
Are you quite sure that WiIlliamson didn’t say "“I believe that the historical evidence, the historical evidence is strongly against, is hugely against six million Jews having been deliberately gassed in gas chambers as a deliberate policy of Adolph Hitler… I believe there were no gas chambers… I think 200,000 to 300,000 Jews perished in concentration camps, but not one of them by gassing in a gas chamber… If anti-Semitism is bad, it’s against truth. But, if something is true, it’s not bad…”

GKC
 
There were 60 million deaths caused by WWII, and I’ll bet there were more catholics killed than jews, they get a country for it, and we get to protect them and die at the hands of those who oppose them… :mad:
 
There were 60 million deaths caused by WWII, and I’ll bet there were more catholics killed than jews, they get a country for it, and we get to protect them and die at the hands of those who oppose them… :mad:
In what manner, though? Were they targeted becuase they were Catholic like the Jews were? How could you attempt to prove this?
 
**I would like to know why people cannot have a different opinion about the Holocaust without being condemned for it. **

It’s because it is such a horrible thing that happened, and so disrespectful to the people who died. That mixed with the fact that someone can not come to that kind of opinion through rational investigation, but only by suspending their intellect in order to find evidence of something they want to believe.

There are all sorts of opinions that people will condemn you for. How about that “church group” who go to the funerals of military people who died in Iraq holding signs that imply that they deserved it because God hates America.

How about if your child was kidnapped and killed and people told you that they think YOU did it. And if they do it just because they don’t like you. What would you think of such a person?

Or what about someone who would go to a women’s shelter and hold up a sign outside it saying “women who get beaten by their husbands usually deserve it”. There are all sorts of ‘opinions’ that make you deserve to be mistreated, IMO.
 
“Ignore” from whom?
I’ve asked OTCA a couple of questions and gotten no response. I wasn’t entirely sure what she meant by “opinion” - whether it happened, whether the numbers are accurate, etc.

She has the right to put me on an ignore list, btw.
 
There were 60 million deaths caused by WWII, and I’ll bet there were more catholics killed than jews, they get a country for it, and we get to protect them and die at the hands of those who oppose them… :mad:
Sorry, that sounds whiney. I can actually visualize you stomping your foot with your hands on your hips and your bottom lip jutting out.
 
What difference does it make who they were? We should mourn the loss of any life

I think in all of this hub- bub this seems to be forgotten…Everyone should matter to us, regardless of who they were , or what religion they practiced ,or even if the were non believers
 
There were 60 million deaths caused by WWII, and I’ll bet there were more catholics killed than jews, they get a country for it, and we get to protect them and die at the hands of those who oppose them… :mad:
Thanks for plainly stating what I suspect people like Bishop Williamson believe. Such beliefs embarrass me, good Catholics do not support such views.

Given Bishop Williamson’s own written words about the Holocaust and about womens’ education, I think he is not a very good person. At all. And I am glad the Pope censured him, and that Argentina showed him the proverbial door.
 
I would like to know why people cannot have a different opinion about the Holocaust without being condemned for it. Many people don’t even believe there were even that many Jews in Germany at that time. If someone else wants to think and believe that the number was different, he has every right to do so without being ridiculed about it.
What about the Jewish couple who lied about even meeting at the Holocaust? They went on to write this wonderful love story about the Holocaust and it turned out they were never even there! They went on Oprah and lied to her and lied to the media about their story. What about them? What about the millions of Christians who were murdered during the Holocaust? Gypsys?
Although I agree the Jews were in fact targeted victims, others also perished. Why not talk about these victims?
Don’t get me wrong, it was a terrible awful catastrophic event that should of never happened and I feel for the Jews, but people have a right to have a different view about it and not be ridiculed for it.
Hitler killed about 10 million people. Of that there were about 6 million Jews that were killed. The rest were Christians, of which many were gays and disabled people. And there were others that were included in that 4 million who died.

All the Jews that were killed were not all Germans. Hitler had Jews from other countries killed too. He invaded quite a number of countries - Poland, Czech…, etc.

He got the idea for his slaughter from the muslims who slaughtered the Armenian Christians about 1914. No one even mentions them. We are not supposed to do so because it might OFFEND muslims. And Hitler was encouraged to do his slaughter by the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem.

The Jews were a majority in Hollywood for years/decades. I don’t know if they still are, but that is why we mostly heard about their plight. They could put it in our faces and so that is why we are so aware of the Holocaust. That really doesn’t bother me so much as their political agenda, but I won’t go into it here.

The Association between Naziism and Arab Antisemitism

The above goes into the anti-semitism tie between Hitler and the muslims. This is also how this current radicalization of muslims got started. We wiped out, for the most part, the nazis but we did nothing to stop the muslims from continuing their radicalization. And this is where the muslim brotherhood started and they have many organizations - the MSA (muslim student association), CAIR, etc. Also Al Qaeda, hamas, hezbollah, Saddam Hussein, wahabbism, Arafat, etc are some well known people or groups that are tied to this movement.

And besides that the muslims have not stopped in their slaughters of Christians worldwide. But, that is barely mentioned. The muslim’s victims are usually given different names other than ‘Christian’ to make it sound more political, or whatever the agenda of the media is and it is basically a one of indifference to hostility to Christians while appeasing muslims.
 
It matters to me when people are talking about the bishop who claims that the numbers are quite smaller than thought. That’s all. He has a right to his opinion,…
Yes. He is entitled to his opinion.

That being said, others are entitled to the opinion that he is an ignorant, self-deluded, anti-semetic bigot. This idea that everyone is entitled to an opinion cuts both ways. If you want to defend the AB’s right to his opinion, then you must also defend the right to of others to have an opnion about his opinion, as it were.

Another factor, and one that the Holy Father is pointing out, is that when one holds themselves out as a cleric of the Church, their opinion is no longer their own. In the interview, AB Williamson was wearing his clerical attire. Most organizations do not allow opinions to flow freely when done in an official capacity.
 
Yes. He is entitled to his opinion.

That being said, others are entitled to the opinion that he is an ignorant, self-deluded, anti-semetic bigot. This idea that everyone is entitled to an opinion cuts both ways. If you want to defend the AB’s right to his opinion, then you must also defend the right to of others to have an opnion about his opinion, as it were.
How does the saying go? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts.
 
Now Stalin and Mao - EACH - killed more than Hitler and the Grand Mufti killed. (oh, and notice that there is barely a mention of this Grand Mufti in any history.)

Mostly they killed their own peoples and they usually killed Christians, or people of some religion. And then they replace religion with themselves. Stalin was the best example of this. He had people take down any religious pictures, crosses, stars, etc and replaced those with his picture.

Out of all of these characters, and that is including mohammed, for me it isn’t that there is a nut that hates and wants people killed - but it is the seemingly sane people who follow these nuts and do their bidding. They kill, and then they condemn their future generations to this brainwashed fascist systems.

The most successful of these fascism are the ones who replace the religion with a god of their own. mohammed, I think, is the most successful. They are even invading Russia and are increasing in numbers. This is one of their strategies in our Western countries too - increase their birth rates and immigration to increase their numbers. We already are experiencing their demands for us to change to their ways. It is only the fools who stand by and acquiesce to these demands and we have a lot of fools in our institutions!

% of muslims and % of violence directed against non-muslims

You can have a different opinion on the holocaust - just be prepared to defend your opinion.

What happened to the Jews was bad and the Europeans have not learned from history. With the growth of muslims in Europe there is another trend of anti-semitism going on and they are mostly in full appeasement mode with the haters - the muslims. Jewish children have to have guards with them in order to go to school in some areas. Jews were attacked in this last round of riots when the muslims defended their hamas terrorists.

And we are seeing this anti-semitism in our own Universities. The UC system - UCIrvine and UCBerkeley’s MSA organizations have protested and in these protests there was an attack on Jews in one of the instances and signs and yelling against Jews in the others.

I know that I wrote our California government about this - but I got no response and I don’t know how many others wrote about this! It is a shame so many people are in a slumber until something really bad happens!

Jews attacked on UCBerkeley campus

MSA and UCIrvine - hate, anti-semitism, anti-USA

and more UCIrvine hate fest in Jan 2009
 
In what manner, though? Were they targeted becuase they were Catholic like the Jews were? How could you attempt to prove this?
They were not targeted because they were Catholics. The others who were killed were mostly gays and disabled peoples. Yes, there were also nuns and priests in that group, but not like the Jews and then the gays and disabled.

Gays are also a hated group in the muslim world. (yeah, they still have a heaven full of little boys for them - but hey! The muslims ignore all that when we point out their own texts on that subject) Although with slavery still being practiced in the muslim world - there are little boys that are enslaved just for the ‘closet’ gay muslim.

Slavery in islam
source: The Third Jihad DVD
Abu Mujahid, spokesperson ITS (in USA and a muslim brotherhood ‘tool’)
‘Sometimes we are blunt when the … ruling system is established we give them a choice we will consult them, give them choice of therapy and tell them to abandon the homosexuality lifestyle and if they don’t - either leave and if you want to be here then you got to face the punishment as a criminal.’
He was asked what is the punishment.
He said, ‘Throw them off a cliff.’
Middle East - Iraq- gays are shot, burned alive, beheaded, beaten to death.
  • Iran - flogs them and hangs them
 
If you are interested in the ties between Nazism, Communism and islam - here is a book for you:

Fascism and Paganism: A brief comparison of Nazism, Communism and Islam
 
  • EACH - killed more than Hitler and the Grand Mufti killed. (oh, and notice that there is barely a mention of this Grand Mufti in any history.)
That is because not everyone derails every thread in an anti-Islamic direction.
 
I’ve asked OTCA a couple of questions and gotten no response. I wasn’t entirely sure what she meant by “opinion” - whether it happened, whether the numbers are accurate, etc.

She has the right to put me on an ignore list, btw.
Luke I would never put you on ignore…what were your questions again?
 
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