Why Debating With Jehovah's Witnesses Doesn't Work

  • Thread starter Thread starter DonCameron
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
“Catholic is really a crime”???

What about Islam? What about the Nazi’s? What about Northern Ireland Protestants? What about all witchcraft and Voo Doo who sacrifice babies to the devil?

Catholics? A crime? The one true Church of Christ?

I say to you my atheist friend - HOGWASH! You’re obviously prejudiced against Catholics for no apparent reason!
 
The reason is this: if your leaders tell you to fight and bless the weapons you use then it is not based on the holy bible or on the koran or on any other religious book!

I am raised as an atheist but since i have read the bible i can tell you this: (it openend my eyes)

No use of statues since the creator of the universe cannot be kept in what people make!

The church is not the house of Jah because He lives in heaven and he uses the earth as His foot bank.

No war since jesus tell you to love your enemies! And what do you see when you look at history england bishops blessing their armys and germany had a pact with the pope so killing eachother with the same religion!?

Paying money to come in heaven???

And what if it happens again how many catholics will not fight for their country? but stay true to what jesus tell you about fighting?

How many americains with catholic believe are fighting or have been fighting against moslims in irak or afghanistan? I am living in amsterdam and what do you see on the aircrafts and bombs (television) when the americain soldiers gone fighting? God bless! And in the name of the lord (which lord?) Bush?

Come on people you can recognize a good tree by their fruits and so you can recognize a good religion by their fruits! too many rotten apples in the catholic religion so the teaching must be rotten, otherwise you refuse to fight!

But one thing about religion and politics you actually you cannot talk about it and come to the same point since everybody has his own relation with his party or creator.
 
shurek,

I don’t even understand what you’re saying.

I don’t think you read the same Bible as I have.

And this thread is about debating with Jehovah Witnesses…
 
Shurek,
So I gather from your post that war is always wrong? We should never fight?

Since you live in Amsterdam let me ask you… when the Nazis were all over Europe - killing Jews by the millions we should have just stayed out of it??
 
DonCameron said:
Why Debating With Jehovah’s Witnessed Doesn’t Work

The recent experience with Jaded27 helps to explain why I personally don’t recommend debating with Jehovah’s Witnesses about what the Bible does or doesn’t teach. One of the frustrating reasons is because of the phenomenon that is explained in the book “When Prophecies Fail”… "


We have all experienced the futility of trying to change a strong conviction Suppose an individual believes something with his whole heart [which Witnesses do]; suppose further that he has a commitment to this belief [which Witnesses have], that he has taken irrevocable actions because of it [which Witnesses have done]; finally, suppose that he is presented with evidence,**** unequivocal and undeniable evidence, that his belief is wrong: what will happen? The individual will frequently emerge, not only unshaken, but even more convinced of the truth of his beliefs than ever before."
While it seems easy to see this phenomenon happing to Jaded27, it is likely that she sees it applying to the Catholics on this Forum… As a result, what happened? Both sides end up “even more convinced of the truth of their beliefs than ever before.”

But there is another reason I try not to get into ‘I’m-right-and-you-are-wrong’ about the Bible’s teachings. This is because it isn’t what Jehovah’s Witnesses believe about the Bible that has made them captives of a concept. Rather, it is what they believe about the Watchtower Society that has done it.

In order to escape this concept they need to come to realize that what they believe about the Watchtower Society (i.e. that it is God’s organization) is not true before they can allow themselves to begin to consider that what they believe about the Bible may not be true. This is the usual way it works.

We’ve observed how Jaded27 views herself as the teacher and everyone else on this Forum as students. She didn’t come her to have anyone teach her anything. She was hoping that she might be able to teach everyone else what she believes to be the truth about her religion.

In my book I suggest trying to take advantage of the Witnesses’ desire to do the teaching in the hope that in the process of them trying to teach others that the Watchtower Society is God’s organization, they may teach themselves that it isn’t. It’s a matter of getting them involved in teaching the right subject.

Don at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com

:amen:
 
It is hard to debate with Jehovah’ Witnesses because they base their beliefs in the Bible. If the Bible says " Do not commit adultery"; they accept it. So, there is nothing to debate.
Next time you ask them a question, see if they use the Watchtower to answer it or the Bible.
 
It is hard to debate with Jehovah’ Witnesses because they base their beliefs in the Bible. If the Bible says " Do not commit adultery"; they accept it. So, there is nothing to debate.
Next time you ask them a question, see if they use the Watchtower to answer it or the Bible.
But they have their own NWT Bible which is not the same as KJV etc. and is slanted to support their teachings.
 
It is hard to debate with Jehovah’ Witnesses because they base their beliefs in the Bible. If the Bible says " Do not commit adultery"; they accept it. So, there is nothing to debate.
Next time you ask them a question, see if they use the Watchtower to answer it or the Bible.
What about divorce and remarriage, the Bible says “no”, what about the JWs? Last I checked they allowed it.
 
I’m not staying. And I"ve already tried discussing all this. Everyone just wants to hate JWs so I will continue to let you. It just proves my point further - “and you will be objects of hatred by all the nations”. Now watch everyone say “oh we dont’ hate JWs” just so I won’t be right. :eek:
we don’t hate JWs…🙂
 
It’s hard to debate with people when the honestly believe what they say.

People have been taking the Bible out of context for centuries, there is nothing new about this.

Saint Peter even said this was going to happen:

“His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.” (2 Peter 3:16)
 
There are debates about the trinity,hellfire,etc; trying to identify the true religion. We overlook many times what Jesus said in John 13:35
" By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another" (NIV).
That would the subject to debate.
 
It just proves my point further - “and you will be objects of hatred by all the nations”.
This applies to the Catholic Church. The JWs bent on persecuting the Church with its lies concerning the Whore of Babylon - which is a better description of their False Religion.
 
This applies to the Catholic Church. The JWs bent on persecuting the Church with its lies concerning the Whore of Babylon - which is a better description of their False Religion.
Thats right. This quote was used to describe Christianity. Not the JW religion. This would be like a Muslim saying this quote applied to him. And we don’t hate you, we just believe that you are wrong.
 

Jehovah’s Witnesses are a cult because they try to cut you off from others who do not have the same beliefs, including family.
The Watchtower is a truly Orwellian world.

Danny Haszard born 1957 as a 3rd generation Jehovah’s Witness
jehovahwitness.vox.com/
I was in the cult and now I’m out
 
I’m not staying. And I"ve already tried discussing all this. Everyone just wants to hate JWs so I will continue to let you. It just proves my point further - “and you will be objects of hatred by all the nations”. Now watch everyone say “oh we dont’ hate JWs” just so I won’t be right. :eek:
I hate JWs. Not necessarily as individuals but as a group–oh yes I do. And you will never be a better JW than I was. I was third generation, father of the annointed, grew up near Brooklyn, sat on Freddie Franz’s lap, quit school to pioneer and pioneered without cheating on my time for 15 solid years when I walked away and never looked back literally losing everything and everyone I ever had. And I hate JWs for it and probably will until I die–which won’t be at armageddon any time soon. If you are interested in why I left finally after giving them my whole youth, all my strength and health and gifts, here is my deconversion story:

disc.yourwebapps.com/discussion.cgi?disc=46743;article=2853;title=Searching%20for%20Long%20Lost%20JWs%20and%20Ex-JWs

I DARE JWs to read it and tell me it could not have happened.
 
I hate JWs. Not necessarily as individuals but as a group–oh yes I do. And you will never be a better JW than I was. I was third generation, father of the annointed, grew up near Brooklyn, sat on Freddie Franz’s lap, quit school to pioneer and pioneered without cheating on my time for 15 solid years when I walked away and never looked back literally losing everything and everyone I ever had. And I hate JWs for it and probably will until I die–which won’t be at armageddon any time soon. If you are interested in why I left finally after giving them my whole youth, all my strength and health and gifts, here is my deconversion story:

disc.yourwebapps.com/discussion.cgi?disc=46743;article=2853;title=Searching%20for%20Long%20Lost%20JWs%20and%20Ex-JWs

I DARE JWs to read it and tell me it could not have happened.
Could you tell us more on the Rev 7 crowd thing. I know a little about it (ie how the crowd is not limited to 144k), but the more details the better I can discuss it.

The whole concept of shunning by family members is un-Christian at its very core. Apart from rampant/defiant physical abuse or promiscuity no family should ever “shun” (and even then phone calls and such should be allowed).
 
Jehovah’s Witnesses beliefs and who are they?

The Watchtower is big money, being one of the top 40 New York City Corporations making nearly one billion dollars a year. That’s just from one of their many corporations.

Unlike in the case of Christians who are persecuted in other lands for talking about Jesus Christ, Jehovah’s Witnesses are largely persecuted for following the teachings begun during the second presidency of the Watchtower, when Joseph F. Rutherford took over in a corporate flap and began changing doctrines quickly in the Watchtower belief system. He claimed that angels directly conveyed truth to some of those in leadership. He coined the name Jehovah’s Witnesses to make them stand out from being witnesses of Jesus, a typical evangelical expression (and a Biblical one).

Rutherford dumped holidays, birthdays and the 1874 date for the invisible return on Christ, **and invented an earthly class of Witnesses, since only 144,000 can go to heaven in their teaching. The rest, meaning all 99.9% of Witnesses still alive, will live forever on a cleansed earth, under the rule of the Watchtower leaders in heaven, who will keep them in line by local elders known as ‘Princes’. **
If you have been witnessed to by Jehovah’s Witnesses and you reject their message, you will likely die shortly at Armageddon with all the other non-Witnesses, since theirs is the only true religion, and (if they can live up to all the rules) they are the only ones to inhabit this new earth. If you believe Witnesses seem rigid now, any non-conformist during the future cleansed earth will be directly destroyed by Jehovah. Even now a Witness will be disfellowshipped for any one of many gaffs, such as smoking, taking a blood transfusion, or even voting.

To even vocally question the teachings of the Watchtower will result in complete cutting off, with family and friends usually being forbidden to talk to them. The Watchtower is a truly Orwellian world, in a time when Orwellian societies are nearly obsolete.

By their own Yearbook accounts,Witnesses are shrinking in number in many Western countries as of the last few years, as the internet facilitates the spread of information (much of it critical of the Witnesses). Witnesses are cautioned against creating JW-related websites, largely to prevent their members from discovering the history and dirty laundry of this organization on other websites. (There are literally hundreds of former members pages in many languages.)

The Watchtower strives hard to control the flow of information to the individual Witness, and prefers that all instruction come through the magazines they carry door-to-door. Without this form of control, even as they themselves admit, they would believe just the same as other Bible believers.

My hope is that there will be a day in each of their lives when the Watchtower magazine is no longer needed, and they can go to college, vote for office, and contribute money and time to other, more vital causes in their community. More than likely they will then cease to be persecuted, except in a few societies more authoritarian than their own.

Sincerely,

Danny Haszard
Reference
freeminds.org
 
I’m not staying. And I"ve already tried discussing all this. Everyone just wants to hate JWs so I will continue to let you. It just proves my point further - “and you will be objects of hatred by all the nations”. Now watch everyone say “oh we dont’ hate JWs” just so I won’t be right. :eek:
or you simply have not learned how to make friends and influnce people.

As far as I see, no one here hates you. We hate false doctrine of the watchtower.

We all would love to see you come to the truth which is the real Jesus of the Trinity.
 
or you simply have not learned how to make friends and influnce people.

As far as I see, no one here hates you. We hate false doctrine of the watchtower.

We all would love to see you come to the truth which is the real Jesus of the Trinity.
Thank You. We hate the sin not the sinner.
 
Could you tell us more on the Rev 7 crowd thing. I know a little about it (ie how the crowd is not limited to 144k), but the more details the better I can discuss it.

The whole concept of shunning by family members is un-Christian at its very core. Apart from rampant/defiant physical abuse or promiscuity no family should ever “shun” (and even then phone calls and such should be allowed).
JWs believe that only 144,000 (the ‘little flock’) will go to Heaven, a remnant of which is still alive today (according to their numbers when I left about 5000-6000) and the great crowd will be the ‘other sheep’ who survive the Great Tribulation and Armageddon and live on to see the New World paradise. So the vast majority of JWs hope to be survivors–or Great Crowd.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top