Why did God make us in the first place?

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Here’s that quote from Sheed:

From F.J. Sheed, “Theology for Beginners,” p.49:
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God needs no being other than himself. He not only contains within himself the sufficient reason for his own existence, but every other sufficiency. To his limitless perfection, nothing whatever is lacking; there is no need of his nature that some lesser being could supply; there is no luxury, even, that some lesser being could bring him. In his own nature is all being, all perfection, all bliss.
Why then did he create a universe? There can be vast theological discussion here but it can be reduced, not too crudely, to the single statement that he knew we should like it. Creation brings him no gain, but it brings us tremendous gain: it means that we are something instead of nothing, with all the possibilites of life and growth and happiness instead of the mere blankness of nonentity.
It is a new light upon the love of God that our gain could be a motive for his action. He knew that beings were possible who could enjoy existence, and he gave them existence. By existing they glorify him - but who is the gainer by that? Not God, who needs nothing from any creature. Only the creature, whose greatest glory is that he can glorify God.
Wow.
 
Thanks Brad

Mr. Sheed explains things so well Theology for Beginners and Theology and Sanity are my two favorite Catholic books. 👍

Scott
 
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cteslak:
That response tells me what God want us to do not why He made us. See my problem? Is this simply one of those unanswerable questions?
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No, it isn’t unanswerable. Love is God’s nature. He made us to love, and to love Him in return with a soul and a consciousness that He made uniquely like unto God’s. Love is not just what God does–like a hobby. Love is what God is. Love is what God intends us to become, too.

If you become a parent, and love your children not because of what they can do for you or have done for you or because you were lonely (or afraid of being lonely) but only because of who they are and because of the loving nature God gave you, then you start to understand. Because we are made in the image and likeness of God, children are the natural outcome of marriage. Love is our nature, too. It is a mystery, not in the sense of being unknowable, but in the sense that knowing it through words does not approach knowing it by experience. In that sense, the more you love, the more easily answered the question becomes.
 
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Peg:
The Holy Trinity being infinite love did what is natural to love. They shared it. They created us because they loved us.
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But how is that possible if we weren’t created yet. We didn’t exist.

If we didn’t yet exist how could God love us so much he created us?
 
See CCC #1.

“God, infinitely perfect and blessed in himself, in a plan of sheer goodness freely created man to make him share in his own blessed life. For this reason, at every time and in every place, God draws close to man. He calls man to seek him, to know him, to love him with all his strength. He calls together all men, scattered and divided by sin, into the unity of his family, the Church. To accomplish this, when the fullness of time had come, God sent his Son as Redeemer and Savior. In his Son and through him, he invites men to become, in the Holy Spirit, his adopted children and thus heirs of his blessed life.”

A friend of mine (non-Catholic minister) once told me:
You know what God wants the most? He wants us to be like Jesus. As many of us as possible. And each as much like Jesus as possible. That is most pleasing to Him. Years ago, an Eastern Orthodox priest told me my friend was correct.
 
This, (and original sin) are precisely the kind of questions that makes me flee from the faith every time I try to answer them. He created us to love and serve him? Okay, but what does that mean, exactly? I certainly don’t think he needs someone to do his dishes. Does it imply that there are things he can’t do without us? If so, we’ve got the wrong god.

If I MUST try to answer the questions for whatever reason, the best I can do is say “we won’t know until we make it to Heaven or Hell.” Because as far as I can tell, there’s no good reason at all. And when you start thinking that God’s human experiment means he created billions of humans, a large chunk of whom would opt for hell out of ignorance or a genuine lack of faith, you’ve got to wonder what kind of monster we’re talking about. God doesn’t need us for anything, but he created us knowing many would spend eternity in suffering.

The best thing is to ignore the question, as I do. I know–I can already hear the theophiles among you cringing already…

But, I was probably anticipating a return to these questions because I just bought Theology and Sanity two days ago. I’ve put it off for ten years because this stuff is like live wires for me. I’ll either be energized or incinerated.
 
Brad Haas:
Here’s that quote from Sheed:

From F.J. Sheed, “Theology for Beginners,” p.49:

God needs no being other than himself. He not only contains within himself the sufficient reason for his own existence, but every other sufficiency. To his limitless perfection, nothing whatever is lacking; there is no need of his nature that some lesser being could supply; there is no luxury, even, that some lesser being could bring him. In his own nature is all being, all perfection, all bliss.
Why then did he create a universe? There can be vast theological discussion here but it can be reduced, not too crudely, to the single statement that he knew we should like it. Creation brings him no gain, but it brings us tremendous gain: it means that we are something instead of nothing, with all the possibilites of life and growth and happiness instead of the mere blankness of nonentity.
It is a new light upon the love of God that our gain could be a motive for his action. He knew that beings were possible who could enjoy existence, and he gave them existence. By existing they glorify him - but who is the gainer by that? Not God, who needs nothing from any creature. Only the creature, whose greatest glory is that he can glorify God.

Wow.
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Wow is absolutely called for here. :clapping:
Thank you for sharing that quote!
 
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YinYangMom:
Wow is absolutely called for here. :clapping:
Thank you for sharing that quote!
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Any time. I think every Catholic should read Sheed’s Theology for Beginners and then Theology and Sanity, which I’m reading right now. It’s just amazing stuff.
 
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montanaman:
This, (and original sin) are precisely the kind of questions that makes me flee from the faith every time I try to answer them.
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A Catholic friend told me original sin is not actual sin, but rather the natural inclination to sin.
 
A Catholic friend told me original sin is not actual sin, but rather the natural inclination to sin.
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Maybe this is for another thread, but the madness is growing–not to be confrontational about this, but what good then is Baptism, practically speaking? Obviously I need to brush up on the official Church teaching, but what does Baptism DO if it doesn’t wash away our inclination to sin?

See, I’m a baptized, confirmed Roman Catholic in a state of grace, and I still very much want to sin. (No, of course I don’t WANT to, but you know what I mean). If Baptism was supposed to wash away that inclination, or whatever Original Sin is, I guess the priest missed me. Or if it’s just a symbol that I’m in Christ’s family “again,” well, that’s very nice but very unfulfilling.

Like I said, these questions, for me, are better left unanswered. They drive me into a seething rage.
 
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montanaman:
Obviously I need to brush up on the official Church teaching, but what does Baptism DO if it doesn’t wash away our inclination to sin?

See, I’m a baptized, confirmed Roman Catholic in a state of grace, and I still very much want to sin. (No, of course I don’t WANT to, but you know what I mean). If Baptism was supposed to wash away that inclination, or whatever Original Sin is, I guess the priest missed me. .
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Baptism and the other sacraments give us the grace to continue to live according to the Church. A life of sanctity may be made easier with God’s graces and many of us know it is impossible to do without God’s graces.

The graces given by the sacraments are like armor in the battlefield. We are not removed from the battlefield (i.e. our natural inclination is not totally removed) but our chances of survival are much greater. God gives us the spiritual armor we need to preservere … some choose to use the armor and some do not.

We are different after the sacraments are given to us. Not so much physically different but spirtually different. Our very souls are marked by God himself.
 
God didn’t have to make us, He is all powerful, all knowing, and He is love. He didnt’t need to make us, He had everything He would have needed. He chose to make us because he wanted people to love and for the people to love Him. He desired to love people, so He created humans in His image and likeness. God made us so we could love Him and Glorify Himm all of our lives. Does that make sense?
 
Sheed’s quote is awesome, and I think is a great way to go. Once a person has faith, it is reasonable to understand “To know Him, serve Him, and love Him.” But to a child, or a searching mind still looking for faith, I suspect it just doesn’t cut it.

I would ask the following question:
Are you glad you exist? If you go to heaven, do you think you will be glad you exist? Using Sheed’s train of thought, the answer then boils down to God wishing for us to feel the very joy of His being, if only because He is so generous and loving that He wishes to share it.

A simple analogy for a 7 year old may be the following: Suppose you have a lot of cookies. They are the best cookies you have ever tasted, and you have an endless supply of them. You don’t have to give any to anyone else, but you know others would like them too. So, just because you want others to share in your enjoyment, you give some to others. They didn’t know you had them, and would not have known about them otherwise. They wouldn’t have missed them if they didn’t get them, because they didn’t even know about them. But now that they received them, they realize how good they are, and they are thankful and happy that you gave them some cookies.

God gives us life, and not only that, an opportunity to share our life with Him. Sure, had it never been given, we wouldn’t know that. But since it has been given, we can be truly thankful for this opportunity, and realize how good of a thing life is.
 
Peg’s answer has to be as good as any and better than most. I still have an Old Baltimore Catechism from about 1954. I think the 2ed or 3rd question was , “WHY DID GOD MAKE US?”

The answer was as Peg said,“To Know, To Love and To Serve Him in this world and the next”.

To Love you have to Know first, and if you know and Love then you will serve Him.
 
All the answers to this question seem to point in the direction that God created us as a manifestation of his love. He gave us a free will. With that free will, we should choose to love and glorify Him out of love and thanks for creating us.

But, just as the ironic flag burners defile the symbol of freedom that gives them the right to burn the flag despite the respect that ought to flow, God can and does create individuals that He knows will ultimately die in sin and, by their own free choice and rejection of God, spend eternity in Hell.

If He is so loving, why would God allow such an indivual to come into existance. If He doesn’t create out of self need, if He creates us so that we would benefit from existence somehow, how can the misery of an evil life on earth followed by eternal damnation be a good thing? for anybody?

–cteslak
 
“If He is so loving, why would God allow such an indivual to come into existance. If He doesn’t create out of self need, if He creates us so that we would benefit from existence somehow, how can the misery of an evil life on earth followed by eternal damnation be a good thing? for anybody?”

He does it that way because any other way would take away our free will, and a person without free will cannot love at all. As for the “misery of life on earth” it’s good to keep in mind that God loved us so much that He subjected Himself to that same “misery,” becoming one of us and suffering death in order to save us.
 
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threej_lc:
God created us because he was in love with us.
“Before I created you in the womb, I knew you.”

Josh
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Jerimiah 1: 1
 
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