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josie_L
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That’s nice but not apropos.
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AnotherAtheist
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How about this then…
“What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence.” -Christopher Hitchens
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lil_flower_luv
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“If you want the answers, then look to Jesus Christ for them.”…but please stop trying to ruffle feathers.
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AnotherAtheist
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When I want answers I look for evidence. When I searched for evidence of Jesus Christ what I found lead me to doubt his very historical existence much less his ability to provide answers.
But that is not what this thread is about. This thread is about why atheists venture onto the catholic answers forum. I think this little discussion is a perfect example of one reason why. josie L made a post accusing atheists of some bad things and a 12 year old girl called her on it. So instead of providing evidence to support her position, sorry josie if you aren’t a female, josie L claims there must be another 12 year old atheist called Annabea. I find that highly improbable so now I’m calling BS. In my opinion either Annabea or josie L is not telling the truth. As the person making the claim the burden of proof is upon josie L. Her claims would be extremely easy to prove by simply providing a link to the thread she reported on. However, she refuses to do so. Why is that?
One of the many reasons atheists come to the catholic answers forum is to defend ourselves against the lies and misconceptions concerning atheists being perpetuated by theists.
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4elise
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All I meant was that I assume that secular humanists have ideals that they too may fall short of, perhaps not?
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4elise
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OK gang, josie believes she has posted something that is true and it may well be - the other individual could simply have the same id name - josie has apologized - and I would recommend that all posts that reference this discussion be removed from the thread by the administrator to assure that no damage is done to anyone’s reputation.
Josie should not share that link with others on this thread because it could damage another persons reputation… let it drop please.
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humble_maid
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Good day to all,
It concerns me when people make assurtions that have no real basis. You claim that you searched for evidence of Jesus and found that He could not provide you with the answers. Please tell me what He left out that made you doubt his very existence; I am prepared to give you plenty of evidence to state otherwise but this would be a waste of time. You have made up your mind not to believe.
Please do not tell me you are here to defend atheists; it is clear that the present society does away with faith and attacks our church most. We for the most part are a people taught to love unconditionally and turn the other cheek. Are you willing and able to do the same?
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Marfran
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We are all at different places in our journey. We must all feel the “truth” and live it. We must all strive to correct “wrongs” in society, and to live responsibly and respectfully toward the earth and to our fellow man.
It is not “wrong” if someone is at a different place in their journey. As Christians we must be models for our brothers and sisters. We should not throw rocks at those who do not share our beliefs, even if they throw rocks our way.
Most agnostics and atheists are law-abiding citizens who also have compassion and concern for their brothers and sisters.
Whether we find God, or he somehow gets lost, or he is supposed to not even exist at all–is for each and every one of us to discover in our own lives. And we can assist each other–offer our perspectives, set an example, share our individual stories…
And when the discussions get heated–take pause everyone–because we are not about beating each other up. If you seek clarification, or understanding a point, or another person’s perspective please be gentle in the asking. It is a difficult journey that we ALL find ourselves on. The journey of LIFE and LIVING.
This thread is about WHY agnostics and atheists come to CAF. I think the answer is as different and as varied as are number of posters. The same question can be asked of Catholics. Why do you come to CAF? The answers will also be different and varied, despite commonalities. This is a place to share, to learn, to exchange ideas and information–and to argue and spit too–if that’s what you’re about. And it’s almost better than “real life” because we can be pretty open in this form of communication.
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AnotherAtheist
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What is an assurtion? If what you are trying to say is assertion then you should be talking to josie L not to me. She is the one making claims that she is not willing to provide the supporting evidence to back up. What I said was that when I searched for evidence of Jesus what I found left me personally less than convinced he existed. That is not the same thing as asserting he did not exist. I’ll leave the making of baseless assertions to you theists.
As far as attacking your church I don’t have to. In my opinion the Catholic Church has been self destructing for years. That is one reason why Catholic Church membership as a percentage of US population is in a slow decline. If it wasn’t for immigration from predominantly Catholic Latin countries into the US propping up the numbers that decline would be even more pronounced. On the other hand agnostic, atheist, humanist and other non-theists are increasing as a percentage of the US population. What does that tell you?
I’ll save my attacks for the fundamentalists who are trying to force their young earth garbage into our schools. But don’t expect me to sit idly by while the god fearing members of this forum invent whatever kind of stories they want to about people like me just because we don’t share your faith in ancient mythology.
religioustolerance.org/chr_prac2.htm
cara.georgetown.edu/bulletin
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lil_flower_luv
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We will not always be able to provide proof that you can touch or see. After all, faith is something we cannot touch or see. The reason some people deny God is because they don’t feel that real, touchable evidence. Opening your heart is the place to start your search. The evidence you feel of God’s existence will be there.
No, that is man who has been doing that. We are the ones who cause destruction, not our Church.
Blessings,
Therese
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Marfran
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I don’t think it is neccessary to pick on people’s typos.
There is nothing wrong about holding up our faith to the light to see if it has substance. And once we have done that, we may find our faith is weaker or stronger–again it is a personal journey for us all–and no, I don’t agree with hitting everyone over the head with the Bible. We are all in different places at different times.
Everyone, please be tolerant of others…we ALL struggle here with life, and the seeming harshness of it.
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Marfran
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Very good post.
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yankee_doodle
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intelligence is evolving
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humble_maid
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Good day and God Bless,intelligence is evolving
May the spirit of Christ be in all of you. May He grant us true wisdom and intelligence that can only come from Him that is Mercy unbound, all-knowing and pure love.
Good night.
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josie_L
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Did you watch the video?
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yankee_doodle
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I don’t have to, I could never endorse censorship (much less religious pressure to retract or censor speech). It’s an aberration to my core beliefs. I believe in the free market place of ideas; and IMO while time, place, and manner restrictions are acceptable in some instances (when absolutely needed), certainly don’t expect me to sign on with religious boycotts of people who insult them (or their leadership), or whom they may disagree with. Similarly religious organizations have the right to use that same market place of ideas to speak out against its opponents; but of course I’m not religious.
Whether or not I find “pope jokes” in good taste or not is immaterial (that’s why evolution gave us remote controls for our television sets
)!
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josie_L
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Does your free market place of ideas include hate? I’m telling you that this program was hate-filled. Please watch it and you’ll understand (there are many distortions).I don’t have to, I could never endorse censorship (much less religious pressure to retract or censor speech). It’s an aberration to my core beliefs. I believe in the free market place of ideas; and IMO while time, place, and manner restrictions are acceptable in some instances (when absolutely needed), certainly don’t expect me to sign on with religious boycotts of people who insult them (or their leadership), or whom they may disagree with. Similarly religious organizations have the right to use that same market place of ideas to speak out against its opponents; but of course I’m not religious.
Whether or not I find “pope jokes” in good taste or not is immaterial (that’s why evolution gave us remote controls for our television sets
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yankee_doodle
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It absolutely does, yes. I think the KKK are a bunch of racist dirt bags, but I would defend their freedom of speech any day of the week, including what most would view as hate speech (as long as it’s general in nature, and not designed to terrorize a particular individual, and create an imminent threat of harm).
I assume they do have remote controls in Canada?
It doesn’t matter if you view the show as having distortions. They only limitation on this sort of speech is slander (and there’s a very high bar to prove slander when you’re talking about something like a public figure, public corporation, or a global church). Besides that the general rule is time, place, and manner … but with regard to speech that is critical of a particular religion or religion in general; that (and political speech) is the most protected form of speech under American law (and it’s a right I view as more precious than anything).
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josie_L
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But is the KKK allowed to air their racist opinions on T.V. courtesy of a major network, can you imagine the uproar this would cause? You still haven’t seen the video have you?
Yes, but I also have a conscience.
Look, the CC is lambasted all the time and usually I don’t care, but the prejudice against us is growing more radical to the point that this type of garbage was allowed airtime by a major network. There is a danger in allowing such things to be said about a whole institution, this type of talk breeds hate.
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yankee_doodle
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good & fair response; and as far as I know no major network gives the KKK a public microphone to spew their hate.
OK, you convinced me (I’ll watch the video then comment).
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