Why do Muslims hate Israel?

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Muslims and/or Arabs and other applicable parties don’t hate Israel and the Jewish religion/ethnicity; they abhorATROCITIES that the government of Israel has inflicted upon innocent Palestinian women and children who don’t deserve to live in the conditions that they’re in now. These are the things you never hear of in the news. You only hear of “the dirty filthy Arabs” and “those innocent poor Israelis”. My friend the truth has been abrogated. To make myself clear St Paul states in the New Testament that God “is no respector of persons”. That means we are all equal under God whether we be Greek, Roman, Jew Gentile et cetera. This masoschistic genocide must stop. No one hates the Jewish religion, race; The hate is centered towards the human rights crimes of Israel.
This is not true. Sharia laws that are based on the Koran and sunnah, do indeed hate just because they are Jews and they are Jews who do not accept subjugation.

I just posted it in a different post:
The definitive book of Sharia law, Reliance of the Traveller states the following:
Caliph makes war upon the Jews, the Christians, the Zoroastrians……by first inviting them to enter Islam, if no success then pay jizya, if no jizya then kill them (o9.8, p.602).
And this law (o9.8, p602) goes on to quote surah 9:29, **‘Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low.’ **
One of the best books that I have bought to understand where all the violence is coming from is Ahmad ibn Naqib al-Misri’s ‘Reliance of the Traveller’. I will say that there are a few descrepencies between the Arabic and English translations, but it is close enough.
 
I have posted this video before, but I see we have here another thread where it is relevant, so here it is again: Abouna Elias Chacour on relationships in the Middle East

Abouna Chacour is the Melkite Catholic Archbishop of Galilee. He is a proud Arab citizen of Israel. His insights are worth a million pages of back and forth about who is right or wrong, and while he is not a Muslim, I think his analysis is fair regarding the complaints of Palestinians in general against Israel. Muslims may have some other set of complaints which are religiously-based, but I think we’re all smarter here than to buy into that when Jews also have that same set of conflicting claims to the land based on their own religion.

Israel/Palestine is ultimately a political problem, but Islam especially does not recongize a clear division between the religious and the political. I have been told by Muslims on this very website that you will find no wisdom to the effect of “render unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s, and unto God that which is God’s” within the Qur’an.
I am listening to it now. It is close to an hour long, but it is good to hear things from people who lived through history and TELL IT ACCURATELY AS POSSIBLE instead of taking the propaganda as history.

Thanks for reposting. I think that things like this should be reposted for any newbies that join if it applies.
 
The choosen people of God is what The Church is called in the new Testament.

Like here

1 Peter 2:9
But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.

Now we are the children of Abraham and heirs to the promise.

Through him all nations have been blessed. Jesus is the seed of Abraham and those of us who belong to him are also the seed of Abraham.
I totally agree with everything you posted here.
I just want to emphasize my affirmation and blessing to the people whom God first revealed Himself as the Great I Am—the recipient of the First Covenant, our elder brothers the Jewish people.
 
I am listening to it now. It is close to an hour long, but it is good to hear things from people who lived through history and TELL IT ACCURATELY AS POSSIBLE instead of taking the propaganda as history.

Thanks for reposting. I think that things like this should be reposted for any newbies that join if it applies.
You’re welcome, Sgt. I keep that video in my favorites not only because I like it, but to do juast as you’ve suggested and basically keep posting it whenever topics related to Israel/Palestine come up. I think Abouna Chacour has several distinct advantages over any high-profile political analyst:
  1. He was there when all these events were happening, and remains there to serve the community that shares the same land (regardless of their religion).
  2. He is not a Muslim or a Jew, so his claim to the land is not as likely to be infected by religious absolutism.
  3. He proudly sees himself as an equal member of both sides of the conflict (even if, as he says, not everyone on both sides might see him as their equal).
Sadly, these are the types of voices and viewpoints that are being strangled to death in the Middle East as radical Islam runs rampant over non-Muslim minorities.
 
I am listening to it now. It is close to an hour long, but it is good to hear things from people who lived through history and TELL IT ACCURATELY AS POSSIBLE instead of taking the propaganda as history.

Thanks for reposting. I think that things like this should be reposted for any newbies that join if it applies.
I am a little disappointed in this guy because he has a big disconnect as to the cause of the violence. Getting along with the Arabs who call themselves Palestinians won’t bring peace. and yes that is unfortunate. As long as the Muslims who are calling themselves Palestinians have such things as the Sharia laws, Koran and basic precepts that I pointed out there will be violence not only against the Jews but the Christians.

I don’t know why more christians don’t support the Christians living among the Muslims who are persecuting them. I am sure they don’t even know how to go about it.
 
Willful and/or indomitable ignorance coupled with a political philosophy that feeds on itself.
You are just parroting what the western press has been reporting. Ask Palestinian CHRISTIANS, not just muslims how they are treated and you will hear a completely different story.

The Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, and others Christian Palestinians are discriminated against just like the muslims. IF you are not Isreali, you have second class rights.

Christians have been leaving the area in droves. Bethehem used to be 80% Christian, now it is less than 25% Christian. There are no jobs for non-Isrealis. Pretty soon there will be no Christians in the Holy Land, except for the tourists and pilgrims. They are being systematically driven out by the economics and policies of the Isreali govenrment.
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Some of those folks throwing rocks at the tanks and soldiers are Palestian CHRISTIANs including some CATHOLICs. They are not all muslims. The truth is being buried by the pro-Isreali western press. Write to some Christian leaders there and you will hear a different story. Sometimes it takes some digging to find the truth.

The billions of dollars in aid is not getting through to the Palestinian people. Most or all of it is going to the Isreali government or some fat cats living high off the hog.

It’s not the Palestinians who are driving the big cars and building luxury resorts.
 
I am a little disappointed in this guy because he has a big disconnect as to the cause of the violence. Getting along with the Arabs who call themselves Palestinians won’t bring peace. and yes that is unfortunate. As long as the Muslims who are calling themselves Palestinians have such things as the Sharia laws, Koran and basic precepts that I pointed out there will be violence not only against the Jews but the Christians.

I don’t know why more christians don’t support the Christians living among the Muslims who are persecuting them. I am sure they don’t even know how to go about it.
Well, I’m not sure what you were expecting him to say, but I think the point he made about being a friend of Israel or being a friend of Palestine not getting in the way of honestly appraising the actions or attitudes of either side is a very, very good one.

I have not heard so many self-identifying Arab Christians talk much about the Qur’an or Shari’a. I know a few of almost every church where there are Arabs (Orthodox, Catholic…haven’t met any Protestants in person yet), and they are mostly concerned with the welfare of their families and communities, and the surest way to put that in jepoardy would be to say that the Qur’an and Islam are evil or what have you. Most of them want to be left in peace rather than fight with the majority unless they absolutely have to (as was the case in the Lebanese civil war, for instance). I don’t doubt that Abouna Chacour probably had his community in mind with every word he said in front of the microphone. You can say it is servile and disappointing, and maybe you’re right, It is also, rightly or wrongly, a fact of life that comes with being a minority. If you think this is sad, you should see some of the videos available of interviews and public statements from Pope Shenouda III of the Coptic Orthodox Church…by no means is it a church of wimps, but the position they’re in (which is not all that unlike that of the Palestinian Christians, despite the Copts’ much larger numbers) is absolutely soul-crushing, because there is very little being done or that can concievably can be done in the future. They are outnumbered, and not by reasonable people, but by a bunch of crazy idiots like the Islamic terrorist groups that are the cancer of their part of the world.

I agree with your other point about how Christians everywhere should support each other. I sign the petitions, donate to some organizations (and spread them around as much as I can; see signature), but what else is there? Should I pick up a gun and kill a Muslim? I don’t want to do that. A million dead Muslims doesn’t change the dynamics of power in the terrorist-occupied Middle East. It just makes us as bad as the terrorists are to begin with. It is not the Christian way. As I wrote in another thread where you raised the same point (see forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=5895390#post5895390), it is definitely a fine line we walk all the time (and when I say “we”, I mean Christians all around the world, not pampered Westerners like me), but we should try to stay on the right side of it. Support Christian relief organizations, support the upkeep of churches and the rebuilding of communities, support the struggle for basic human rights that are denied…other than that, what can we do? I know it probably doesn’t mean much to you as an atheist, but the FIRST answer I would give if I were talking to a fellow Christian is to pray. Pray all the time. That’s the sum of all that we can do.
 
Dzheremi,

I just finished watching the whole video. Thank you for posting. His message is very powerful.

What would be nice is to see Palestinian muslims say the same from their end. Is there anything like that on youtube that you know of?
 
Generally speaking it is much more simple than that. They displaced their brethren from the land they had possessed for over 1,000 years at the point of the gun, two times beyond the extent that they were even granted by the United Nations. You would probably wind up hating someone if they did that to you.
But didn’t the land first belong to the Jews and didn’t the Muslins first take it from them. They were only give back what God had promised them.
 
You are just parroting what the western press has been reporting. Ask Palestinian CHRISTIANS, not just muslims how they are treated and you will hear a completely different story.

The Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, and others Christian Palestinians are discriminated against just like the muslims. IF you are not Isreali, you have second class rights.

Christians have been leaving the area in droves. Bethehem used to be 80% Christian, now it is less than 25% Christian. There are no jobs for non-Isrealis. Pretty soon there will be no Christians in the Holy Land, except for the tourists and pilgrims. They are being systematically driven out by the economics and policies of the Isreali govenrment.
.
Some of those folks throwing rocks at the tanks and soldiers are Palestian CHRISTIANs including some CATHOLICs. They are not all muslims. The truth is being buried by the pro-Isreali western press. Write to some Christian leaders there and you will hear a different story. Sometimes it takes some digging to find the truth.

The billions of dollars in aid is not getting through to the Palestinian people. Most or all of it is going to the Isreali government or some fat cats living high off the hog.

It’s not the Palestinians who are driving the big cars and building luxury resorts.
The Israelis don’t believe that killing them will get them to their paradise. And if they let the Muslims have equal rights they will be outpopulated in a very short time. That is the reality of the situation. It is their land and the Christians lost the one country that was theirs and that is Lebanon by not getting their stuff together. They just recently lost it and most of that was due to not only the Hezbollah and the Arabs who call themselves Palestinians but also because of the help of their liberals. During the 1980s Israel tried to help the Lebanese Chrstians out by training some of them. Little help that did though.

This same phenomenon of outbirthing the host populations is also going on in Europe and the UK. Geert Wilders, some books and articles have been written about what the Muslims are doing to the lands where they migrate.

The so called second class citizenship is in no way close to being subjugated under Sharia laws either. I have already printed some laws on my previous posts that show the barbaric treatment or consideration they give to non-muslims.
 
Dzheremi,

I just finished watching the whole video. Thank you for posting. His message is very powerful.

What would be nice is to see Palestinian muslims say the same from their end. Is there anything like that on youtube that you know of?
Unfortunately, no. I’m not the king of Youtube or anything, so it’s likely that such a thing is out there somewhere and I just can’t find it (probably because I’m searching in English, not Arabic). What I did find when I put in “Muslim cleric talks about Palestine and Israel” is garbage like this, obviously not from a cleric or anything positive or commendable. This clown says the “solution” is to implement Shari’a on all of Palestine and to start aiming guns at everybody. Personally, I agree with the most recent commentor that this guy needs to get a job and quit dressing up like a bedouin, but whatever.

Unfortunately, that’s far from the worst of what’s out there. Somehow, for some reason, when looking for videos of great progressive voices in Islam like this guy (I think user inJESUS originally posted this; thanks, inJESUS!), I eventually was recommended this absolutely heartbreaking and shocking video. God help us all! Oh, God…the state of this world… 😦
 
Well, I’m not sure what you were expecting him to say, but I think the point he made about being a friend of Israel or being a friend of Palestine not getting in the way of honestly appraising the actions or attitudes of either side is a very, very good one.

I have not heard so many self-identifying Arab Christians talk much about the Qur’an or Shari’a. I know a few of almost every church where there are Arabs (Orthodox, Catholic…haven’t met any Protestants in person yet), and they are mostly concerned with the welfare of their families and communities, and the surest way to put that in jepoardy would be to say that the Qur’an and Islam are evil or what have you. Most of them want to be left in peace rather than fight with the majority unless they absolutely have to (as was the case in the Lebanese civil war, for instance). I don’t doubt that Abouna Chacour probably had his community in mind with every word he said in front of the microphone. You can say it is servile and disappointing, and maybe you’re right, It is also, rightly or wrongly, a fact of life that comes with being a minority. If you think this is sad, you should see some of the videos available of interviews and public statements from Pope Shenouda III of the Coptic Orthodox Church…by no means is it a church of wimps, but the position they’re in (which is not all that unlike that of the Palestinian Christians, despite the Copts’ much larger numbers) is absolutely soul-crushing, because there is very little being done or that can concievably can be done in the future. They are outnumbered, and not by reasonable people, but by a bunch of crazy idiots like the Islamic terrorist groups that are the cancer of their part of the world.

I agree with your other point about how Christians everywhere should support each other. I sign the petitions, donate to some organizations (and spread them around as much as I can; see signature), but what else is there? Should I pick up a gun and kill a Muslim? I don’t want to do that. A million dead Muslims doesn’t change the dynamics of power in the terrorist-occupied Middle East. It just makes us as bad as the terrorists are to begin with. It is not the Christian way. As I wrote in another thread where you raised the same point (see forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=5895390#post5895390), it is definitely a fine line we walk all the time (and when I say “we”, I mean Christians all around the world, not pampered Westerners like me), but we should try to stay on the right side of it. Support Christian relief organizations, support the upkeep of churches and the rebuilding of communities, support the struggle for basic human rights that are denied…other than that, what can we do? I know it probably doesn’t mean much to you as an atheist, but the FIRST answer I would give if I were talking to a fellow Christian is to pray. Pray all the time. That’s the sum of all that we can do.
Don’t get me wrong, I really liked what the guy had to say. I just think that there is a big disconnect between what people want and what they are facing.

To start with we need to be telling the truth to each other. I read on some of the posts how distorted people think the Mid East situation is. Even the Israelis want peace when it isn’t going to happen. A few Churches and very few Jews that I know, are getting it correct but not the majority.

The Jews need to start learning how to do as much propaganda as the Muslims do. They need to learn Sharia laws, the Koran and every other distasteful thing about Islam. Islam is their enemy. No matter how distasteful it is. It is too bad they didn’t learn that lesson when the effects of the ‘Protocols of Zion’ caused the deaths of so many Jews and that book is right up there with the Koran and Mein Kampf in the Middle East.

The Muslims in our country not only have a lobby in Washington, but they have organizations that effect the media (news, TV, documentaries, movies, etc) called MPAC or Muslim Public Affairs Council. It is the reason why we see never see Muslim terrorists on TV, or the usage of the word ‘muslim’ hardly ever being used. Well, at least for the movies and TV shows made after 2001. For example, when there are honor killings that sharia laws sanction we only hear about Muslims denying it is an Islamic thing when in fact it is being carried on by Islam because of their Sharia laws.

The movie that came out ‘Kingdom of Heaven’ was a train wreck but it shows a point of view that Osama bin Laden holds about the Crusades. The TV show ‘24’ and many documentaries are directly affected by MPAC. We have the MSA in our schools and MPAC in the media and both are Muslim Brotherhood front groups. CAIR is also associated with that group and some in Congress want them out. We should all want MPAC and the MSA out of our institutions but we just idly sit by and wonder why things go the way they do until it is too late.
 
I agree with what you say, Sgt., but much of it is outside the scope of Abouna Chacour’s talk, which wasn’t really about Islam in the USA (or really Islam at all, since most of it was about relationships with Israel, Palestine, and the United States).
 
I agree with what you say, Sgt., but much of it is outside the scope of Abouna Chacour’s talk, which wasn’t really about Islam in the USA (or really Islam at all, since most of it was about relationships with Israel, Palestine, and the United States).
And what do you think the biggest obstacle to any relationship is?
 
I can see what you’re driving at here, Sgt. He should have talked about the role that Islam plays in exacerbating (maybe you would say “creating”?) the problems between the Palestinians and the Israelis. I agree. But to the extent that this was not really a discussion about Islam (that is to say, to the extent that he, as a Christian, has a certain set of ideas about the problem in the holy land that aren’t based in Islamic thinking), I think this would have drawn the talk onto a different set of issues that would not have been as effective as the ones he did choose to focus on. I would think that the vast majority of Christians, especially in his part of the world, recognize the danger inherent in Islam, but that does not mean that it must always be at the forefront of our thinking. He is not a Muslim. His problem with Israel, to the extent that he has one, is not a “Islamic problem”. In a way, I think we do ourselves a disservice as Christians whenever we frame our arguments so that they are relatable to Islam, because that just validates the Islamic idea that Muslims and what they think and feel about things ought to be of foremost importance in the world, and to hell with whatever anyone who isn’t Muslim thinks. This is not at all the case. This man is a Christian, talking from a Christian viewpoint about how he feels about Israel and Palestine. He mentions Muslims because they are a huge majority, but he doesn’t argue one way or another against Muslim propaganda (such as the myth of the “Islamic state of Palestine” that you might see in some places), probably because as a Christian he doesn’t see that as a viewpoint that is worth addressing to begin with. Or at least I am assuming as much, given his line about supporting peacemakers on all sides instead of fostering extremes on any side.

So, yeah…he should say “and the people who are trying to make Palestine an Islamic state aren’t helping matters, either”, but at the same time I can see why he might not want to even start going down that road.
 
There is a very simple explanation to this question. Those muslims hate the True God of the Bible. They don’t believe that this God has made a covenant and that prophetic word has come to pass.
:banghead:
 
The choosen people of God is what The Church is called in the new Testament.

Like here

1 Peter 2:9
But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.

Now we are the children of Abraham and heirs to the promise.

Through him all nations have been blessed. Jesus is the seed of Abraham and those of us who belong to him are also the seed of Abraham.
Amen! 👍
 
I totally agree with everything you posted here.
I just want to emphasize my affirmation and blessing to the people whom God first revealed Himself as the Great I Am—the recipient of the First Covenant, our elder brothers the Jewish people.
And yet you continue to call them the chosen people of God in your signature. That is inconsistent with what East Anglican said in his post.
 
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