Why do non catholics dislike Mother Mary?

[tweetymom]

[SIGN]Guanophore: You are welcome, dear sister in Christ. Perhaps you were so full of bliss, basking in your blessing, you forgot to answer the question?

1 Timothy 2:1: First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men

James 5: 16: Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects

I do not understand why you believe these scriptures don’t apply to you.?[/SIGN]​

Tweetymom, I never saw that you think these verses are not for you. These are wonderful verses. They do help reveal some incomplete or wrong ideas.

I don’t I think they are for everyone of us. Thats just something else to say, God Bless you Dokimas you have helped me to pray about my ugly attitude I get sometimes.So God Bless yoy brother.

 

[tweetymom]

Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man’s servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth.Yea he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

 

[PRmerger]

Actually Pope Pius XII taught that she did in fact die, right in the Bull Most Bountiful God (Munificentissimus Deus). Does that count?

My understanding is that Pope Pius was deliberately vague about whether she died.

The quote I have from that document is: “when the course of her earthly life was finished, (she) was taken up body and soul into heavenly glory…” Pope Pius XII Munificentissiumus Deus (1950)

It seems that he is avoiding stating that Mary definitively died.

Do you have something different, Hesychios, from that document that states that Pope Pius maintains she did in fact die?

 

[PRmerger]

wouldnt she have to be god to hear so many prayers from so many people?

I’ve heard Protestants also claim that Mary would have to be a god to be able to understand all the different prayers in a multitude of different languages.

This indicates a deficient understanding of heaven, MRL.

First of all, in response to the claim I brought up–that is just silly. Do we really think that Mary, in her heavenly existence, couldn’t understand Polish, Tagalog, Hebrew? :whacky:

Secondly, in response to your question:

*If being in heaven were like being in the next room, then of course these objections would be valid. A mortal, unglorified person in the next room would indeed suffer the restrictions imposed by the way space and time work in our universe. But the saints are not in the next room, and they are not subject to the time/space limitations of this life.

[SIGN]This does not imply that the saints in heaven therefore must be omniscient,[/SIGN]as God is, for it is only through God’s willing it that they can communicate with others in heaven or with us…Surely those saints in Revelation understand the prayers they are shown to be offering to God.

The problem here is one of what might be called a primitive or even childish view of heaven. It is certainly not one on which enough intellectual rigor has been exercised. A good introduction to the real implications of the afterlife may be found in Frank Sheed’s book Theology and Sanity, which argues that sanity depends on an accurate appreciation of reality, and that includes an accurate appreciation of what heaven is really like. And once that is known, the place of prayer to the saints follows. *
Source. (BB code added by PRmerger)

 

[PRmerger]

I have a question: Is Virgin Mary so special because she is the mother of Jesus?

-We know Mary is so special because: Scripture tells us so. “All generations shall call me blessed.”

-We know Mary is so special because she most perfectly heard the word of God and obeyed it!

-We honour Mary and call her blessed because of the great things God has done for her, which she humbly and gratefully acknowledges in her canticle of praise. (from poster Good Fella)

 

[BlackJack774]

Speaking for myself I was confused. During my confusion I thought catholics worshipped Mary like a goddess or something. And in some regards maybe placed her above Jesus. But this was strictly because I was ignorant.

After actually educating myself about the Blessed Mother, actually speaking with a catholic and (LISTENING). Coming to understand the devotion to Mary. I now have no problem at all with the Blessed Mother. I now try to say a rosary everyday.

Jesus was a Jew. A very good Jew. Jewish law states to honor thy mother and father. And I know Jesus honored his Mother. If he can honor her so can I.

I think the hold thing is just a misunderstanding.

Christians are not perfect, just forgiven!

 

[Dokimas]

Speaking for myself I was confused. During my confusion I thought catholics worshipped Mary like a goddess or something. And in some regards maybe placed her above Jesus. But this was strictly because I was ignorant.

After actually educating myself about the Blessed Mother, actually speaking with a catholic and (LISTENING). Coming to understand the devotion to Mary. I now have no problem at all with the Blessed Mother. I now try to say a rosary everyday.

Jesus was a Jew. A very good Jew. Jewish law states to honor thy mother and father. And I know Jesus honored his Mother. If he can honor her so can I.

I think the hold thing is just a misunderstanding.

Christians are not perfect, just forgiven!

I think it is correct to honor Mary.​

However …​

Does that mean to you that she is the mother of all of us? Does that mean she is the spouse of the Holy Spirit? Does that mean she never had ‘relations’ with Joseph? Does that mean she couldn’t have more children?

 

[guanophore]

Originally Posted by guanophore
I can see how this would happen, since you have been given to believe a deficient understanding of “church” as the body of believers on earth.

-That’s your opinion.

Please correct me if I am wrong, Doki. Do you believe the church is something other than the body of believers on earth?

-His church is FAR bigger than the CC.

This is Catholic Teaching, and therefore, correct.

• If you notice I did not respond to a few of your post above. IMO, the don’t require any thought or time thinking about them. I’ll respond to your posts that are helpful and good for thought.

Since I am not sure which posts you are speaking of, or why they are not worthy of response, I will just accept that there are some topics you don’t wish to discuss.

 

[guanophore]

Speaking for myself I was confused. During my confusion I thought catholics worshipped Mary like a goddess or something. And in some regards maybe placed her above Jesus. But this was strictly because I was ignorant.

After actually educating myself about the Blessed Mother, actually speaking with a catholic and (LISTENING). Coming to understand the devotion to Mary. I now have no problem at all with the Blessed Mother. I now try to say a rosary everyday.

Jesus was a Jew. A very good Jew. Jewish law states to honor thy mother and father. And I know Jesus honored his Mother. If he can honor her so can I.

I think the hold thing is just a misunderstanding.

Christians are not perfect, just forgiven!

Thank you BlackJack for this precious testimony. I think you are right, it is misunderstanding.

 

[tweetymom]

I think it is correct to honor Mary.​

However …​

Does that mean to you that she is the mother of all of us? Does that mean she is the spouse of the Holy Spirit? Does that mean she never had ‘relations’ with Joseph? Does that mean she couldn’t have more children?

It is very correst to honor Mary and I do.No, No,No, ,No.

I think that Jesus had great respect for His mother and great love too. But I do not think He put her in charge of praying to her to get His attention. I think that we should pray direct.

 

[guanophore]

I think it is correct to honor Mary.​

However …​

Does that mean to you that she is the mother of all of us?

I think it is possible to honor the Mother of Jesus without realizing that He has given her to all of us as Mother. He is generous, and always shares the best He has with those He has adopted.

• Does that mean she is the spouse of the Holy Spirit?

I think that many honor Mary without realizing that the phrase “HS shall overshadow you” is a Hebraism that reflects the man “overshadowing” the woman in intercourse.

• Does that mean she never had ‘relations’ with Joseph?

Rejecting the perpetual virginity does dishonor Mary. It means that she went back on her vow to God, which is a faithless thing for anyone to do. It means she gave herself to Him in service and devotion, then took back her gift to use it another way.

-Does that mean she couldn’t have more children?

No. There was nothing physically preventing Mary from having children. Joseph accepted that she was consecrated to God as a sacred vessel.

 

[guanophore]

I don’t I think they are for everyone of us. Thats just something else to say,

This is interesting, Tweety. How do you determine which verses apply to you, and which to not?

Are you saying that some of the Scriptures are “just something else to say” and are not really relevant to you?

Do you mean that the writers of scripture are just babbling on, and witing things that are not relevant?

 

[tweetymom]

This is interesting, Tweety. How do you determine which verses apply to you, and which to not?

Are you saying that some of the Scriptures are “just something else to say” and are not really relevant to you?

Do you mean that the writers of scripture are just babbling on, and witing things that are not relevant?

I did not say that in the context you are applying. I meant that I never said that they did not imply to me Dokimas asked if I ever said they didn 't and I was answering him that it was just something else for you to say period.

 

[Dokimas]

Originally Posted by guanophore
I can see how this would happen, since you have been given to believe a deficient understanding of “church” as the body of believers on earth.

Please correct me if I am wrong, Doki. Do you believe the church is something other than the body of believers on earth? No. As I’ve said often, the church is the Body of Christ which is all true believers.

This is Catholic Teaching, and therefore, correct.

Since I am not sure which posts you are speaking of, or why they are not worthy of response, I will just accept that there are some topics you don’t wish to discuss. The ones or parts of ones I have not responded to. I’d say they are quite obvious why I’m not responding to them

 

[graceandglory]

Ok I feel a little silly for not thinking of that. when I ask a friend to pray for me its fair to assume there arent 5 million people asking that friend to pray for them at the same time.

I was thinking about prayers to Mary today and I got to thinking that I dont pray as much as I should pray so what if I split my prayers betwene God and Mary then it would be half of not enough. then I though. maybe catholics pray to God alot and then say a few words to Mary.

Would any catholics mind telling me what % of time in prayer is to God compared to Mary and the Saints? I apologize if this is to personal.

In a Mass for example, Mary is mentioned once. “And I ask Blessed Mary, ever Virgin, all the angels and saints, and you, my brothers and sisters, to pray for me to the Lord our God.”

It might take a second. The rest of the prayers are directed toward God.

 

[Dokimas]

I think that many honor Mary without realizing that the phrase “HS shall overshadow you” is a Hebraism that reflects the man “overshadowing” the woman in intercourse. ** I’m confused in my understanding of what you mean here. Are you saying the Holy Spirit intercourse with Mary? That would make her an adultress; she was espoused to Joseph.**
Rejecting the perpetual virginity does dishonor Mary. It means that she went back on her vow to God, which is a faithless thing for anyone to do. It means she gave herself to Him in service and devotion, then took back her gift to use it another way. **You have not proven such a vow from Scriptures. **

 

[graceandglory]

Why would anyone hate Catholics? I know people who disagree with Catholic doctrine, but to say people hate Catholics makes no sense from a Christian perspective does it?

Catholic hatred and bigotry is alive and well.

catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0103bt.asp

 

[tweetymom]

Dokimas:
God Bless you dear fried and brother in Christ and Happy New Year to you and your family. Prayers continue for MIL.

 

[Good_Fella]

To answer all the questions its called interceeding on the behalf of or for someone else.
They don’t pray to me for this, like you pray to Mary to interceed for you.
They come to me and ask me or I ask them. Human to human asking for prayer.

What they do is earnestly approach you with a request for what they desire: God’s grace or favour. This is a form of prayer. They come to you with* a special entreaty and zealous supplication* seeking God’s grace. This is a form of prayer. Could it be that they approached you because they deemed you a righteous person, whom like Abel offered a pleasing supplication to God in friendship with Him?

If Catholics need never pray to Mary then why do you?

A good question. Maybe we should pray to Rev Kevin, since Mary is no longer human.

“Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners.”

Personally, I have more confidence in entreating the Mother of our Lord than I would Rev Kevin.
Pax vobiscum :harp:

 

[BlackJack774]

I think it is correct to honor Mary.​

However …​

1Does that mean to you that she is the mother of all of us?
2Does that mean she is the spouse of the Holy Spirit?
3Does that mean she never had ‘relations’ with Joseph?
4Does that mean she couldn’t have more children?

BlackJack774answers below:
1 Yes as stated above John 19:26,27 “When Jesus therefore say his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thy son! Then saith he to the disciple, BEHOLD THY MOTHER! and from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.
Thinking of the context of this passage. Jesus dying on a cross. Looks and see his mother and entrusts his mother to John. Not an older sibling. Jewish law would have commanded the former. Jesus had no other siblings.
If we take this in conjuction with Matthew 28:19-20 Jesus said, 19” Go ye therefore and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Fatther, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you …
Jesus commanded John to take the Blessed Mother as his mother. I believe it is only fitting that this is a part of the teaching passed on. We should take her as our mother too.

2 I believe she was filled with the Holy Spirit and born without original Sin. As in Luke 1:30 The angel Gabriel called Mary Full of Grace. Never before had that been used to address a human on earth. Jesus was conceived by the holy spirit through Mary. Joseph was her spouse.

3 Yes. Matthew 1:25 is emphasizing the virgin birth.

4 I’m not saying she couldn’t, but the scripture reveals that she didn’t. There are instance however where it says his brother Mt 13:55-56 for example, but this is due to a translation issue with aramaic and Hebrew. There is no word for cousin. You see Mary was used for God’s purposes. For what was holy. To bring the living Word in to this world in the form of a Man. Jesus Christ. In the Old testament the items of the Temple were used only for what was holy. Joseph knew this and would not have slept with Mary. There is also the ideal that Joseph being much older then Mary, had children from a previous marrage before Mary.

Hopefully that helps.

Please forgive my poor spelling.