Why do other non Catholic religions always bash Catholocism?

[guanophore]

But you’re church does label people as heretics if they don’t subcribe to transubstantiation.

No, actually. Baptized Catholics who reject this doctrine excommunicate themselves. What the Church does is distinguish for the faithful what is heresy, and what is right docrine.

Transubstantiation is a peculiarly Western (Latin) concept arising from Thomism. It has never been followed by the Eastern Catholic Rites, where the Real Presence is understood differently. Eastern Catholics are not “heretics” according to Rome because they are not Latinized.

 If Rome were more tolerant of the theological opinions of others perhaps unity would be possible.

You seem to have some hostility toward “Rome”. Perhaps you don’t realize that the Catholic Church is not “Roman”?

Theological opinions are really irrelevant to unity. There are a vast array of theological opinions that are not consistent with Church Teaching. Theological Opinions are not the source of the division, but the rejection of Apostolic Teaching.

Oh wait, I forgot Rome is infallible so all other opinions are really errors so Rome doesn’t have to respect them.

This seems to be your hostility talking. How did you get so angry about “Rome”? What “opinions” are causing the difficulty?

Respect for opinions is one thing, embracing errors is another. While differences can be tolerated, the Church is not at liberty to pretend there is unity when it does not exist.

And there it is. It is Roman dogma to not respect the teological traditions of others and one wonders "Why do other non Catholic religions always bash Catholocism?" Funny huh?

I guess I am unclear what you mean by “respect”. If it means to 'agree" then I guess you are right. The Church is obligated to hold fast to the Sacred Traditions (teachings of the Apostles) that have been delivered once for all. The Church is not permitted to agree to error for the sake of ecumenism, or as Tweety would like, warm fuzzy feelings of “peace”.

 

[VARC]

You have thrown out a lot of accusations in one paragraph…all of it erroneous

1. Subscibe to transubstantiation? Either you believe John 6 or you don’t… the Church doesn’t demand that you “subscribe”

John 6 could easily mean co-substantiation or a number of others things. So one can “believe” John 6 and disagree with Roman dogma at the same time.

1. What is “tolerance”? If you mean watering down your own beliefs in order to placate non believers…that isn’t and shouldn’t be considered reasonable.

No, I mean not labeling fellow Christians as heretics for disagreeing with your theological opinion about what happens to the bread during a mass

1. You don’t understand infallibilty as it pertains to our religion

Nobody undrstands it. The formula is so fluid and ambigious it amounts to “Rome is infallble unless they were wrong, then they weren’t infallible that time”

1. If it is “Roman dogma” to not respect the theological traditions of others you should have no trouble citing the dogmatic text which seems to do that. Please…something from the Catechism or some other Church dogma that “disrespects” the religion of others.
   Sir…you are a Catholic baiter pure and simple but not a very skillful one at that…just a good old fashioned mud slinger

It is not rocket science, sir. The idea that your church holds that it cannot be wrong in dogam ever and then insists on ever expanding the list of required dogmas is by its nature exclusive and divisive. It leaves no room for differing opinions on matter so small (like whether or not the Virgin Mary’s body was carried to heaven) because if you don’t tow the line you are a heretic in their opinion.

 

[VARC]

No, actually. Baptized Catholics who reject this doctrine excommunicate themselves. What the Church does is distinguish for the faithful what is heresy, and what is right docrine.

Transubstantiation is a peculiarly Western (Latin) concept arising from Thomism. It has never been followed by the Eastern Catholic Rites, where the Real Presence is understood differently. Eastern Catholics are not “heretics” according to Rome because they are not Latinized.

That’s news to me…

CANON lI.-If any one saith, that, in the sacred and holy sacrament of the Eucharist, the substance of the bread and wine remains conjointly with the body and blood of our Lord Jesus Christ, and denieth that wonderful and singular conversion of the whole substance of the bread into the Body, and of the whole substance of the wine into the Blood-the species Only of the bread and wine remaining-which conversion indeed the Catholic Church most aptly calls Transubstantiation; let him be anathema.

Trent

 

[pismopal]

John 6 could easily mean co-substantiation or a number of others things. So one can “believe” John 6 and disagree with Roman dogma at the same time.
No, I mean not labeling fellow Christians as heretics for disagreeing with your theological opinion about what happens to the bread during a mass
Nobody undrstands it. The formula is so fluid and ambigious it amounts to “Rome is infallble unless they were wrong, then they weren’t infallible that time”

It is not rocket science, sir. The idea that your church holds that it cannot be wrong in dogam ever and then insists on ever expanding the list of required dogmas is by its nature exclusive and divisive. It leaves no room for differing opinions on matter so small (like whether or not the Virgin Mary’s body was carried to heaven) because if you don’t tow the line you are a heretic in their opinion.

I am going to let the readers decide how much sense you are making. Speaking for myself…you make no sense and certainly no case. The Church allows for all kinds of opinions but if you want to be Catholic you should not hold them…that is also not rocket science. If it is “not rocket science” it should have been easy for you to cite some of the “Catholic dogma” to make your case. You won’t because you can’t…adios muchacho:shrug:

 

[OmegaSupreme]

I see way too much hostility in this thread.

Both sides do tend to bash the other. However, these are the actions of individuals, not of their denominations as a whole. To me, the constant bashing that goes back and forth is grating on my nerves. I was raised as a Fundamentalist Baptist, and the constant bashing of every differing viewpoint was one of the many, many things that drove me far away from God.

I will admit that I have a hard time restraining myself from bashing Evangelical Protestantism. That is my weakness mainly due to the fact that my upbringing in such was not pleasant. I find myself feeling more love and understanding with Protestants who are not of the Evangelical/Fundamentalist variety. This is one of my own personal struggles, and I know that must exhibit that same attitude towards those I would otherwise naturally loathe. It is not easy to do the right thing at times, but the reward for doing so is immeasureable.

Now, specifically regarding the comments by tweetymom and many of those responding to her…

I can’t say anything about her own theology, but I do find her attitude towards others to be more of what we all as a whole should exhibit towards one another.

Galations 5:22 - 23

“…the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.”

 

[Shaken]

I see that today is your first day here at CAF. Stick around and you’ll see plenty of bashing by Catholics. My church has been called all sorts of names, immoral, pagan, post-Christian, and that was just yesterday at here CAF!

Your church? What church would that be? If it is not Catholic, then why are you visiting and posting at this Catholic forum?

 

[Shaken]

Many non Catholics are Christian and behave that way. I have many non Catholic relatives and they are the nicest people. But that doesn’t make it any easier to deal with those who are Catholic bashers.

 

[guanophore]

I see way too much hostility in this thread.

I don’t think disagreement equates to hostility.

Both sides do tend to bash the other. However, these are the actions of individuals, not of their denominations as a whole.

This is a good point. Anytime you see “always” it is an overgeneralization.

constant bashing of every differing viewpoint was one of the many, many things that drove me far away from God.

CAF is trying to create an environment where disagreement can happen without driving people far from God. As you correctly noted, sometimes individuals do fall short.

Now, specifically regarding the comments by tweetymom and many of those responding to her…

I can’t say anything about her own theology, but I do find her attitude towards others to be more of what we all as a whole should exhibit towards one another.

Galations 5:22 - 23

“…the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.”

She has posted some statements about her personal theology, hence drawing the criticism.

I don’t think that Truth has to be oppoosed to the fruit of the Spirit. I am sure that Tweety demonstrates these fruits in her personal life (I am willing to take her word for that). Here, however, she comes across as willing to compromise the Truth for warm fuzzies. You can do that just about anywhere but CAF.

 

[VARC]

I am going to let the readers decide how much sense you are making. Speaking for myself…you make no sense and certainly no case. The Church allows for all kinds of opinions but if you want to be Catholic you should not hold them…that is also not rocket science.

That’s whitewashing it a little bit don’t you think? It’s not a matter of the church suggesting that you should not hold some opinions but rather commands that one must repent of certain opinions or else you become an anathematized heretic who can’t licitly receive the Body of Christ. I don’t understand why that fact seems to be lost on you.

 

[gamewell45]

I used to be a Baptist until someone actually told me the real truth about the church, since Catholics were the first true church and all. I’m just not sure if other religions that BROKE off of the catholic church and decided to do their own damn thing are taught to disrespect Catholics? Just throwing that out there, I never see a Catholics disrespect other church’s…

Well lets see what you say in a week after you’ve read some of the posts in here.

so why do other non catholic religions always bash catholicism? Probably for the same reason that catholic’s bash non-catholics; there are people on here who believe their church or faith is the only true religion and are intolerant of others who differ from them in beliefs.

 

[guanophore]

That’s whitewashing it a little bit don’t you think? It’s not a matter of the church suggesting that you should not hold some opinions but rather commands that one must repent of certain opinions or else you become an anathematized heretic who can’t licitly receive the Body of Christ. I don’t understand why that fact seems to be lost on you.

I don’t understand why you find that offensive?

 

[VARC]

I don’t understand why you find that offensive?

Well, personally I really don’t care what Rome or anybody else thinks about what I believe. But the OP is painting a picture that the poor RCC is the innocent victim of constant bashing. When you have the disposition that you are always right and that everybody outside your church is in an impaired state of communion with God at best or hellbound heretics at worst, it does make the RCC a magnet for resentment.

 

[Javl]

Well, personally I really don’t care what Rome or anybody else thinks about what I believe. But the OP is painting a picture that the poor RCC is the innocent victim of constant bashing. When you have the disposition that you are always right and that everybody outside your church is in an impaired state of communion with God at best or hellbound heretics at worst, it does make the RCC a magnet for resentment.

I understand your statement and that of other Protestants and I tend to agree with you up to a point. Keep in mind, though, it is not the Church that does all this but individuals with in the Church that may take it upon themselves to “speak” for the Church. This,
sadly, happens on both sides. The ones that do the bashing really do not know the full
story and are usually grossly mis-informed. All, regardless of denomination, should stop
and use that bit of matter that God has placed within our skulls and follow Jesus’
command to love one another. Then the bashing should stop, useful dialogue should
occur, and we would all become one as Jesus prayed and asked of His Father.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[tweetymom]

Blessed are the truth makers, are you one?

Try as hard as I can to be one!

 

[russell007]

You won’t here it from this Southern Baptist. But, in answer to your question, mostly due to ignorance. You must admit, Catholicism is a dizzying array of terms, offices, charges, and rituals. You can’t expect one raised in, or converted to, a typical American protestant church (I despise the term protestant) to know the meaning of much of this. There simply that kind of time.

I would suggest a little patience with my brethren, and some gentle instruction. Though don’t expect any in return. Perhaps this is your vocation for the church?

Hoops,

My definition of a protestant is your spacific religeon having its origans in the reformation.
The rest I just call by the name or non-catholic.Like Mormons for example.

I think the Catholic bashing is because of the reformation. Its a remnant attitude, a reason for not being Catholic.

The day protestants stop bashing the Catholic Church then I think we need to worry!

You dont talk about something you dont care about.

For example I dont care what the Lutherns,Baptist,Church of Christ etc… do or how they worship so I have no need to call them out or talk bad about them.

Now if they draw first blood so to speak and say Catholics are going to hell then Ill speak up Otherwise I have better things to do. Why bash other Christians?
I dont need to feel better about my religeon perhaps they do.

Like a highschool bully he/she picks on the other kids makes fun of them etc… Why? his/her own short commings

 

[credoinunum]

As I thought about the topic of this thread, it amuses me to think about the notion of non-Catholic religions bashing Catholicism for several reasons.

1. Catholic isn’t a religion, despite what some individuals on both the Catholic and non-Catholic Christian side may think. I know this is probably just a slip of the keyboard and do not intend to imply that the OPer holds the view that Catholicism is a distinct religion from Christianity. This comment was merely a side point to note that we can sometimes behave that way.
2. My own experience doesn’t support a lot of non-Christians bashing Catholics. There are plenty of people who dislike christians in general, but I haven’t seen many non-Christians who say…“I love the Methodists, but hate the Catholics.”
3. This conversation seems like it is Catholics and non-Catholics butting heads forgetting about the fact that Christian unity doesn’t require that we all agree. But if folks want to bash one another, we can always just turn the other cheek and let it bring us into solidarity with Christ.

 

[tweetymom]

As I thought about the topic of this thread, it amuses me to think about the notion of non-Catholic religions bashing Catholicism for several reasons.

1. Catholic isn’t a religion, despite what some individuals on both the Catholic and non-Catholic Christian side may think. I know this is probably just a slip of the keyboard and do not intend to imply that the OPer holds the view that Catholicism is a distinct religion from Christianity. This comment was merely a side point to note that we can sometimes behave that way.
2. My own experience doesn’t support a lot of non-Christians bashing Catholics. There are plenty of people who dislike christians in general, but I haven’t seen many non-Christians who say…“I love the Methodists, but hate the Catholics.”
3. This conversation seems like it is Catholics and non-Catholics butting heads forgetting about the fact that Christian unity doesn’t require that we all agree. But if folks want to bash one another, we can always just turn the other cheek and let it bring us into solidarity with Christ.

Amen to that!

 

[josie_L]

But you’re church does label people as heretics if they don’t subcribe to transubstantiation. If Rome were more tolerant of the theological opinions of others perhaps unity would be possible. Oh wait, I forgot Rome is infallible so all other opinions are really errors so Rome doesn’t have to respect them. And there it is. It is Roman dogma to not respect the teological traditions of others and one wonders “Why do other non Catholic religions always bash Catholocism?” Funny huh?

If they are Catholic, yes (but the Church doesn’t “label” them; they are excommunicated by their own disbelief), but if they are not, no. The reason being is that the Catholic Church cannot impose it’s views onto other denominations, furthermore, the Catholic Church calls all those who are Christian but not in full communion with her, separated brethren (read the encyclical “lumen gentium”). Furthermore, Rome is tolerant with other denominations but not to the point where she will sacrifice truth for ecumenical reasons, that you disagree with her is your perogative, that you should judge her for holding fast to the teachings of Christ is ridiculous.

p.s. I am not asking you to become Catholic therefore do not force me (or my Church) to become Episcopalian (or reformed, or liberal, or evangelical . . . etc.).

 

[Javl]

I am going to let the readers decide how much sense you are making. Speaking for myself…you make no sense and certainly no case. The Church allows for all kinds of opinions but if you want to be Catholic you should not hold them…that is also not rocket science. If it is “not rocket science” it should have been easy for you to cite some of the “Catholic dogma” to make your case. You won’t because you can’t…adios muchacho:shrug:

I tend to agree with you, but not so much in that way. Too many Protestants do not know about the Catholic Church ( both Western and Eastern ). What they do know is mostly hearsay, myths, and what is read about Catholicism by mostly biased Protestant authors. Also a lot is mind set ( “don’t bother me with facts, my mind is made up” ) If they would stop and learn about Catholicism in the true way it is possible that they may change their minds. Also there is a lot of bashing of Protestantism by Catholics too.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[John_Pascendi]

If one digs back into history the cause is there. The RCC churchs were plundered and the wealth taken by the revolutionarys! If you were part of that group of plunderers would not you pass down thru your families the ‘fact’ of the horrors of the RCC…this thus gives you credibility and thus just cause for the plunder…consider: knights and counts etc would leave gold and silver and paintings to the RCC …when the protestants took over the churchs and monasteries they stole all of this wealth and claimed to the parishioners when they returned to an empty church that all that Romish stuff was shipped back to Rome etc…yeh sure! Italy was taken over by the Marxists back in 1870…the Papel lands numbering some one million acres (and its wealth) were taken and only some 106 acres left to Rome…since called the Vatican…after world war 2 was over Italy had the largest number of communists than all other nations outside of Russia itself…evil begets evil…Pas