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Razanir
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How does that refute Jesus not wanting so many churches?
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dronald
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Are you saying that there is only one Church that all Catholics go to? Where is it? Rome?
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chero23
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Yes there is only 1 church. The Catholic Church is the only church to say we are the 1 church, the one established by Jesus Christ. Remember Jesus says one pastor.
Also remember when Paul gets a talk from god, he doesn’t say, we’ll let me start my own church, what does he does? He goes and talks to Peter. Bc Peter was that pastor. Also remember, Paul tells us we are 1 body. It’s kinda of hard when Protestants say that Catholics are not Christians, or other Protestant churches allow abortions, gay marriages, contraceptives, divorce, just to mention a few things.we cannot be one body if the church at the corner preaches one thing, and the church across the street preaches something totally different. I don’t think that is being united under 1 body.
Somebody mentioned read the catechism of the Catholic Church. I think that is a good choice, but also look scripture catholic.com. Plus look at the catholic apologetic videos on YouTube.
Also remember when Paul gets a talk from god, he doesn’t say, we’ll let me start my own church, what does he does? He goes and talks to Peter. Bc Peter was that pastor. Also remember, Paul tells us we are 1 body. It’s kinda of hard when Protestants say that Catholics are not Christians, or other Protestant churches allow abortions, gay marriages, contraceptives, divorce, just to mention a few things.we cannot be one body if the church at the corner preaches one thing, and the church across the street preaches something totally different. I don’t think that is being united under 1 body.
Somebody mentioned read the catechism of the Catholic Church. I think that is a good choice, but also look scripture catholic.com. Plus look at the catholic apologetic videos on YouTube.
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jmcrae
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I am not talking about a building, but an organization that was established by Christ, who appointed the Apostles to be its first leaders. The Bishop of Rome is the successor of the Apostle Peter, and carries in his person the authority that Christ gave to Rock - "and upon this Peter I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."
For hundreds of years, this was universally understood as Christ appointing Peter to be the first Pope of the Church, in a line that was meant to take successors (the “keys” refers to Isaiah 22, which speaks of the King’s steward, an office that took successors).
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Isaiah45_9
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*Philippians 3:8 Indeed I count everything as loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord. For his sake I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as refuse, in order that I may gain Christ 9 and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own, based on law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness from God that depends on faith; 10 that I may know him and the power of his resurrection, and may share his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11 that if possible I may attain the resurrection from the dead.
Pressing toward the Goal
12 Not that I have already obtained this (Resurrection from the dead, which refers to Salvation) or am already perfect; but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own.** 13 Brethren, I do not consider that I have made it my own; but one thing I do, forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus. 15 Let those of us who are mature be thus minded; and if in anything you are otherwise minded, God will reveal that also to you. 16 Only let us hold true to what we have attained.**
Emphasis and blue comments mine.
Matthew 7:21 “Not every one who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers.’
Philippians 2:12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
James 2:18 But some one will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith. 19 You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder. 20 Do you want to be shown, you foolish fellow, that faith apart from works is barren? 21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he offered his son Isaac upon the altar? 22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by works, 23 and the scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness”; and he was called the friend of God. 24 You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone. 25 And in the same way was not also Rahab the harlot justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way? 26 For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.
Belief encompasses many things and a lifetime of commitment.*
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Isaiah45_9
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Nicea325
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Not a physical building, but yes ONE living-organism founded by Christ. Sorry,but the founding of thousands of different churches is not Apostolic in origin at all. That is all the doing of men long after Christ.
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Looney_Toon
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Ok, let’s flesh this out. Please site your sources that support your claim. Which protestant groups/denominations claim to believe what you have said here?
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Razanir
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Looney_Toon
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I belive this to be an unfair assumtion. First of all for what you have said you are basing this idea solely on your coworkers response. Not all protestants believe in the bible only. It would be like someone saying that since one catholic preist did inapropriant things with a child then why do all catholic preists do inapropriet things with a child. Doesn’t work that way.
Second, the bible states that we are living in the new testament. This is what jesus wanted for us. He said that he did not disrespect the “law” but that it had become currupt by the pharsies teachings. Therefore he set out to spread the gospel. The bible is a product of God’s design, given to us as guide lines. From there we are expected to go to church, what ever denomination you are, and recieve further teaching on the scriptures.
Thirdly and I think the most important. It is in human nature and satans desire to currupt things of the Lord. Therefore a church no matter the denomination and a denomination itself must have some small form of curruption in it, because it is run by man. This is why every thing you do or church you attend you should spend time in prayer and listen for Gods direct teaching to you.
So while your coworker says that he doesn’t believe in mass, he might simply have a feeling that it is not where God is leading him, that he feels maybe there is some thing in the book you gave him that he disagrees with (maybe percieved curruption), and/or is uneducated.
Sorry for any misspelling, i am working off of a tiny touch screen keyboard.
Second, the bible states that we are living in the new testament. This is what jesus wanted for us. He said that he did not disrespect the “law” but that it had become currupt by the pharsies teachings. Therefore he set out to spread the gospel. The bible is a product of God’s design, given to us as guide lines. From there we are expected to go to church, what ever denomination you are, and recieve further teaching on the scriptures.
Thirdly and I think the most important. It is in human nature and satans desire to currupt things of the Lord. Therefore a church no matter the denomination and a denomination itself must have some small form of curruption in it, because it is run by man. This is why every thing you do or church you attend you should spend time in prayer and listen for Gods direct teaching to you.
So while your coworker says that he doesn’t believe in mass, he might simply have a feeling that it is not where God is leading him, that he feels maybe there is some thing in the book you gave him that he disagrees with (maybe percieved curruption), and/or is uneducated.
Sorry for any misspelling, i am working off of a tiny touch screen keyboard.
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twoshoes
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I’m a catholic who goes to Mass daily, some times more. I receive Jesus everyday if posible, to me the Litrgy of the Mass is Jesus greatest gift to us.
There are people in or chrch who do the same thing. Most say the Rosary or the Stations of the Cross before Mass.There are people in the Morning who recite the Hours, for me I love to meditate in the presents of my Lord. The reason I tell you this is all these ways of worshiping Jesus are correct, I find none superior to others. It is the same for protestants if the Bible fills you in the Love of Jesus who am I to say nay.If the Litrgy of the Mass fills my Soul with Jesus, no one has the right to judge me.
I think Jesus is more affended by our fighting and arguing than anything else, it only seperates us. We all who believe and live as taght are in the church of Jesus Christ, and as the attacks on Christainity continues we need to remember this. This is a young mans argument that feeds the ego and not my Lords.
There are people in or chrch who do the same thing. Most say the Rosary or the Stations of the Cross before Mass.There are people in the Morning who recite the Hours, for me I love to meditate in the presents of my Lord. The reason I tell you this is all these ways of worshiping Jesus are correct, I find none superior to others. It is the same for protestants if the Bible fills you in the Love of Jesus who am I to say nay.If the Litrgy of the Mass fills my Soul with Jesus, no one has the right to judge me.
I think Jesus is more affended by our fighting and arguing than anything else, it only seperates us. We all who believe and live as taght are in the church of Jesus Christ, and as the attacks on Christainity continues we need to remember this. This is a young mans argument that feeds the ego and not my Lords.
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Looney_Toon
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I did not originally post that. I was trying to respond to the person that did and messed up. Not sure how this works
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7_Sorrows
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7_Sorrows
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thank you all for your responses to my thread. I guess what saddens me is that my co-worker left the Church at such a young age I was hoping to plant a seed where he might want to look into the Church he grew up in. I probably am naïve because I know he has done a lot of studying at a Bible college and probably is surrounded by a lot of anti-Catholicism.
I do think we were meant to be One Body in Christ and it is confusing when there are so many denominations and different doctrines. and then you have the non-denominational churches and it is pretty much up to the pastor what is taught and how it is taught.
I will be celebrating my 5th anniversary next month of my conversion to the Catholic faith.
I grew up in the Episcopal church, but always knew the Catholic church was the true church. I don’t have a lot of confidence sitting down with my co-worker to talk with him because he pretty much let me know his mind is made up.
thank you again for your responses. it is interesting to read everyone’s posts.
I do think we were meant to be One Body in Christ and it is confusing when there are so many denominations and different doctrines. and then you have the non-denominational churches and it is pretty much up to the pastor what is taught and how it is taught.
I will be celebrating my 5th anniversary next month of my conversion to the Catholic faith.
I grew up in the Episcopal church, but always knew the Catholic church was the true church. I don’t have a lot of confidence sitting down with my co-worker to talk with him because he pretty much let me know his mind is made up.
thank you again for your responses. it is interesting to read everyone’s posts.
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Geo17
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**YES… **This is probably the best answer here. Especially the last paragraph. I have been telling other believers for over 20 years that the moment we become angry with each other, and start to argue, rather than to discuss, we are sinning and we are out of the Lord’s Will for us. We must not fight and argue. Satan wants that, not Jesus.
I have much more to say, but I don’t have the time right now.
I am inbetween Protestantism and being a Catholic again. But all the fighting is preventing me from being either one. I’ve been saying for years that anyone who believes Jesus was the son of God and died for our sins that we might receive forgiveness is a Christian. But for some years now God has been making me understand that we must obey God too. Believing alone isn’t enough. And the little book of James is my proof text. That was where God first made me see this. Then I looked at all the words Jesus said, and there it is again. It’s in almost every parable and Jesus ends all 7 letters to the 7 churches in Revelation the same. To he who over comes will Jesus give the gift of eternal life. I don’t know if I can ever over come every sin I have, but I know I best keep trying. My Protestant brothers don’t like me because I have finally started to say this to them. But they don’t believe me. So since I was born and raised Catholic maybe this is where I will finally fit in. Protestants look down on Catholics and that’s wrong. But it’s also wrong for Catholics to look down on Protestants. The time for the age of mankind may be short. We all need to accept each other, and calmly discuss our different opinions. Amen
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chero23
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rfournier103
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I just LOVE this topic!!!
If we go by dronald’s interpretation (please see 2 Peter 1:20-21 regarding personal interpretation) that all we need to do is believe in Jesus, and we don’t need to obey the Commandments, don’t need to go to Mass or services every Sunday, we don’t need to be baptized, we don’t need to be repentant of our sins, and I guess we don’t need the Bible, either.
Is is POSSIBLE, that there could be a little more to Salvation that just believing? What about John 13:34? “I give you a new commandment. Love one another. As I have loved you, so you also should love one another.” Are we to ignore this command and just believe in Jesus?
I love the Bible. It has 99.999% of all things Catholic in it. The New Testament was written by, and compiled by Catholics. Even our Lutheran and Anglican friends agree to that. Since I have been here at CAF, I have come to find out that most of the differences that separate Catholics from Protestants is interpretation and authority.
I guess my short anwer to the OP’s question of why they believe in the Bible only is that they rejected the Church’s authority to interpret the Bible, then rejected the Church itself. If you reject the Church, what do you have left? The Bible.
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Cak7711
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I’m Protestant and the reason most of us believe in sola scripture is because we know it is true. Even though Catholics like to boast about how they put together the bible and therefor are above it, they fail to mention one thing. Those books were choosen because everyone followed them and they were the most commonly used. We know they are true and from reliable resources, unlike many extra biblical texts. Also they are the only texts from the apostles. Many books the Catholic Church uses are man written. The books in the bible were used together in Sherman’s long before the church put them together. The church basically just published them in a single book. It’s not that Protestant think the bible is everything there is, just everything that is needed. We follow it alone because the church cannot be trusted. They have slowly customized the teachings of Jesus and the apostles by using things they call “interpretations”. Me personally actually agree with many of the extra biblical teachings of the Catholic Church, though there are some I don’t agree with; such as needing to confess to a priest, infant baptism, baptism by sprinkalling. The church seems to focus to much on the little things, like Mary. The bible says she is holy among women, but the church goes to far. It just comes down to the point that the church is not infallible and makes mistakes. Their teachings are not more important the Jesus’. We know this from the corruption of the many popes in the Middle Ages.
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