The clergy are literally speaking, “servant of the servants of God.” The Pope holds this highest title, but generally speaking all priests and religious can also be called as such.So you’re only referring to the priesthood, and you would seem to be inferring that the only power in the Church belongs to the clergy?
Not at all.
The latiy are the reason the clergy exist
Cardinal John Henry Newman said regarding the laity, “The Church would look foolish without them.”
Do we agree that i am correct that the catholic church does disqualify married men from leadership roles such as a bishop because they are married?
No doubt the laity do have some leadership roles. What i’m referring to areas where doctrines and practices are made. For example, when there is a church council are there ever any pronouncements or declarations from married men?So you’re only referring to the priesthood, and you would seem to be inferring that the only power in the Church belongs to the clergy?
Not at all.
The latiy are the reason the clergy exist
Talking about leadership, we must first distinguish into what service that Jesus called us. In the Catholic Church I believe, someone can be called to serve Christ as a member of a clergy, or as a member of a community (married people, go to work, and raising a family). The differences in the clergy and us is the specialisation of service, just like differences of professions. Both calls, whether as a clergymen or as a laymen (I hope that I use the correct terminology as english is not my native language), are the same in the eye of God. If we talk in the realm of the church, of course that is the profession of a clergymen. They have the right education, sets of ethical standards (such as celibacy) and training to carry the tasks. In the realm of us, a married man can become and excellent leader too. One can become a president of the United States of America (John F Kennedy, for example). Yes Sir, a political leader is also an important position in the eye of God. See… a clergy and a layman, both can become excellent leaders. In what service they are is not the main issue. But, how they carry the leadership is. It is interesting however, that according to the canon law, any catholic has the chance to be elected as a pope, eventhough such occation is really-really small. (Am I correct??) Crossing the realm?? I do not know the facts in advance country like yours. In a country such as mine, a clergy who left the service and work to make a living, tends to perform less than the fellow workers of the same profession (I know some of them personally). And the vice versa, an accountant by profession such as me, for instance, will find it difficult to make a living in the church realm, since we do not have time to re-educate and re-train ourselves in order to perform our duty in the new service (lets set aside the issue of marriage in my point).
Your thought on this issue, and your command of English are both excellent and commendable. We hope to hear more from you, since all we hear of Indonesia seems to be about Islam and not Catholicism. God bless you.
Of course, Paul was not a hypocrite. All available evidence suggests that Paul was not married-thus the forerunner of the modern priesthood. So, if Paul remained single with heavenly blessing, what does that say about the priesthood, except that it follows a blessed, Divinely authorized example? Remember, Christ Himself chose Paul for that service-so is the Catholic church wrong to follow it?
You have it backwards. Bread and wine are just that. Once the Holy Spirit gets hold of it, THAT is when it becomes spiritual food and drink. If you cannot see the Divine command to take and eat His Flesh and drink His Blood in John 6, we here cannot help you. In short, this is THE problem of Protestantism. Once bread and wine are consecrated, they cease being just bread and wine. They are given under the APPEARANCE of bread and wine, as Jesus came to us under the APPEARANCE of man. As we know, Jesus was and is God, although He had a human nature. The consecrated Body and Blood have the appearance of bread and wine, but the SUBSTANCE is Christ. The bread and wine have become, through the power of the Holy Spirit, His Body and Blood. Bread has no saving power. Wine cannot cleanse of anything. However, once it is blessed and broken, it becomes our Lord and Savior. Recall the disciples on the road to Emmaus-they recognized Him only when He had blessed and broken the bread. Christ disappeared, leaving the bread for them to eat. This practice seems unusual only to Protestants. In western and eastern churches, it has been practiced for 1974 years. This is precisely what was lost in the reformation. The faith was partially dismantled, the baby thrown out with the bath water.
The catholic church has circumvented the qualifications for leadership by denying married men. Even though Jesus and Paul were single, they never used that as a criteria for leadership.
We know the eurachrist is not mention in John 6 nor is any kind of consecration either. Jesus is teaching something else here.
Think about what you are claiming here. Jesus not only appeared as a man (Phil 2) but now appears as bread and wine in thousands of places throughout the world. He now has a human nature and a bread and wine nature.
Not so. Actually its a return to what Christ meant.
Because there is no evidence for it and it leads to absurd conclusions as i’ve shown above.
If you believed in the scriptures as i do, you would not be catholic for the mere fact that there is much in them is not in scripture.
I would take this as it stands. Are you thinking that this is some kind of basis to believe in a celibate leadership?
It may be able to change it and there are some married priests. I don’t deny that. What i’m saying is that if there is a married catholic man who has children, bringing them up in the catholic faith etc, has the characteristics of a leader is disqualified from being a priest for the mere fact he is married. Would you not agree with this?
Would you not agree that that man would rather spend time with his own children than suddenly dedicate himself to a whole other ministry?
Not know for sure? You doubt scripture? We have less in common than I supposed. I thought you at least trusted that Scripture was inerrantly inspired. Don’t know if we really have much more to discuss if you can have any other interpretation of this than that Paul was unmarried. My saving Grace sermon in which God grabbed ahold of my heart was you believe the Bible “cover to cover including the cover, or we have nothing else to talk about”, and if you can read those words and still say “we can’t know for sure” if Paul was unmarried, as the Pastor said, “we have nothing to talk about”
Paul only MAY have been single when Paul himself tells us this in God’s inspired word?
So do you believe Paul was single or only MAY have been single? And when did you change your mind on this and why?
No, married men may become bishops. You are incorrect. The Catholic Church is made up of many rites. In some of those rites, married men may become bishops.
They are one and the same, justasking. There is only One Church, and One Kingdom, which the Church Jesus founded represents here on earth. Jesus set the example, and taught that those who were given the gift of celibacy for the sake of the Kingdom should receive it.
YOu say these kind of things because you are uneducated about your own family history. The Catholic Church produced the Scriptures, and nothing She teaches is contrary to them. If you think there are contradictions, it is because you do not understand what is written.
If you are absolutely right in every aspect of faith, just what is your purpose here? We are praying for you. As much as you resist those who love you here, you cannot resist the power of prayer. We couldn’t.
I´m protestant and charismatic and because of that I know that there is some errors what some christian circles is believing- I mean just this salvation doctrine what is saying that when you get saved then you are saved forever. But it
s not true. When we not follow Christ then its no matter if you did this prayer or not. I believe that after this prayer also we must follow Christ, it mean to live as Bible says and it`s not always simple for us because our bodies wants to do something else.Would you happen to know which rite in the Roman Catholic church that allows this?
Does context matter in understanding something? Using verses out of context will not support the assertions made about a celibate leadership.
So long as you believe this you never be able to discern false teachings and practices in your church. The very thing the scriptures command us to be on guard about you will be incapable of doing.
Do you think the catholic church is right in everything it says and teaches?