Why Do Protestants Shun Mary?

[eazyduzit]

I think it’s mainly ignorance…Martin Luther held our Blessed Mother in much the same way as Catholics do…even John Wesley believed in the perpetual virginity of Mary…yet over time as Protestantism moved farther away from the Catholic faith misunderstanding and straight out false teaching about Catholicism grew…I think it is especially more so today among Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestants…I wonder how some Protestants will react when they get to heaven if our Lord were to ask them what they think of his mother…" well…it’s like this Lord…she may be have been chosen by your father (God) out of all his created beings to give birth to you…his son and our Savior…and she…the one who all generations shall call blessed… your mother…but to me she meant…and means nothing"…I wonder how that would go down with Jesus

It is just one more false perception that Protestants ignore Mary. Pastor Jack Hayford actually wrote a book on her and usually devotes a sermon to her e every Christmas season.
No one objects. People just want a balance. The center of spiritual life is Jesus. He is the one who knew us before the foundation of the world, not Mary. He is the one who loved me so much that He gave his life for me, not Mary. He is the one who promised that I can do all things thru him, not Mary. He deserves all the glory, praise honor, and devotion. That is how Mary would want it .
BTW, Mary’s real name is Miriam.

 

[Adonia]

I’m not sure what you mean by shunning? I don’t purposefully mean to shun her. I just feel that she is not alive and holds no special power, that she was human like everyone else, though of course a very wonderful and blessed person.

As the Scriptures rightly say.

 

[Jeanne_S]

I honestly don’t know. I have a friend who worked as a teacher in a Catholic school for a time, and loved that she has freedom to pray there. There were prayers in the daily assemblies, and she would join in with most, but never the Hail Mary, and her words to me were ‘I’m not praying to a dead woman’. This friend believed in healing miracles and all sorts of crazy charismatic phenomena, but the idea that we could ask saints to pray for us, or speak to Mary as our mother was ridiculous to her.

For myself, I used to listen to preachers talk about her as a bit part player in the story of redemption, almost an after thought, necessary to the Christmas story but largely an irrelevance.

Wow! Hard for me to imagine how anyone can disregard Christ’s mother and our mother too in such a manner!

 

[zz912]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Because of the teaching on this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

“For there is one God, and one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus”
(Douay-Rheims Bible in 1Tim2:5)

Actually shunning is not the correct term, we choose not to worship her. I know RC teaching states it is not worship, but when the frequency and fervency of the focus on Mary is as it is reflected in modern Roman Catholicism, it is seen for all practical purposes as worship. As others have stated, we honor her as the woman chosen by God to carry His Son, but that is generally where it stops.

Was King David or the Israelites worshipping the Ark of the Covenant when they gave it so much attention, honor, and fervor?

 

[zz912]

I just feel that she is not alive

God is God of the dead?

 

[Peebo]

It is just one more false perception that Protestants ignore Mary. Pastor Jack Hayford actually wrote a book on her and usually devotes a sermon to her e every Christmas season.
No one objects. People just want a balance. The center of spiritual life is Jesus. He is the one who knew us before the foundation of the world, not Mary. He is the one who loved me so much that He gave his life for me, not Mary. He is the one who promised that I can do all things thru him, not Mary. He deserves all the glory, praise honor, and devotion. That is how Mary would want it .
BTW, Mary’s real name is Miriam.

Well that is good that Mary is recognized by some Protestants…I can tell you that as a former Pentacostal who attended many different Pentacostal churches over the years that never once was Mary mentioned except to accuse the Catholic Church for "worshipping " her

 

[Charlemagne_III]

What, exactly, do you mean?
I don’t know any Protestants who “shun” her.
Can you be more specific? In what ways do the people you know “shun” her?

Perhaps shun is not the right word? Neglect might have been a better word? I did not mean to say they shun her as someone who is worthy of being shunned. What I meant, if you go back and read the first post, is that Protestants seem to shun the IMPORTANCE of Mary by the fact that they give her so little honor as not even to recognize that they might announce feast days on the calendar in honor of her, as they might honor Washington, Lincoln, or Martin Luther King for the sacrifice they made on our behalf. Mary is far more important than any national hero because she willingly became the means by which all mankind might be saved. Without her, there would be no Jesus Christ. Do we owe her more veneration than Protestants offer? To many Catholics, Protestants seem to think of Mary as a dead woman with no influence on her son even though she proved at Cana that she was a powerful influence on him, even to altering his will when he protested that his time had not yet come.

 

[QuestLove]

Catholicism has always held a special place of veneration (not worship) for the importance of Mary in Christian theology.

When, why, and who were the first Protestants to begin the shunning of Mary in their theology?

Who says Protestants “shun” Mary? That’s rather a broad statement to make. It’s like asking why do Catholics worship Mary? That we know is not true.

 

[Peebo]

What, exactly, do you mean?
I don’t know any Protestants who “shun” her.
Can you be more specific? In what ways do the people you know “shun” her?

.

Not speaking for CharlemagneIII…shun is to avoid…ignore…reject…most Protestant churches do at least one or more of those…I think high Anglicans (Anglo Catholics) do venerate Mary…to some degree Lutherans hold her in high esteem…most Evangelical churches do ignore her…apart from being the mother of our Lord and that’s about it…it doesn’t mean that Protestants hate Mary so they shun her…she just doesn’t enter into Protestant theology which to many is strictly bible based…so in that regard yes…they do “shun” Mary

 

[Magdalena59]

It is just one more false perception that Protestants ignore Mary. Pastor Jack Hayford actually wrote a book on her and usually devotes a sermon to her e every Christmas season.
No one objects. People just want a balance. The center of spiritual life is Jesus. He is the one who knew us before the foundation of the world, not Mary. He is the one who loved me so much that He gave his life for me, not Mary. He is the one who promised that I can do all things thru him, not Mary. He deserves all the glory, praise honor, and devotion. That is how Mary would want it .
BTW, Mary’s real name is Miriam.

Have you ever wondered why it is only at Christmas time protestants sing a song about Mary. If one thing you would think a children’s song could be sung about her great faith and trust in God to teach children who she is.

There are children’s songs about Moses, Noah, Abraham, Joshua, David, the Hebrew children, Jonah, Elijah, Ezekiel, Zacchaeus, Peter and John, angels, the wise men and more but not Mary. Not Jesus’ mother. Mary is almost a non person to protestants.

Catholics agree with all those things you said about Jesus but because we also choose to obey Christ and He honored his Mother, then we do too. We honor her and that is how Jesus wants it. Mary is always obedient to Jesus and always, always leads us to Jesus.

Mary is a great gift from the Lord. That is how much He loves us.

God bless.

 

[JoeT777]

I can understand your sentiments. I think the important devotion and ‘embrace’ of Mary by Catholics is to first acknowledge her as a unique mother to all of us who follow her Son, to believe she was not merely His biological mother but His dearest disciple, and to believe in the Church’s Teachings as from her Son. It actually does harm to have an outward devotion to Mary yet pick and choose what to follow from Apostolic faith (the Sacred Scriptures and the Catechism).

She is just as alive as me and you, if not more! She holds the most holy petition to Jesus of all mankind This is true.

Mary is a lot more than being just you and me. She is the very first fruit, the very first Catholic, and the very first of the faithful. If she were sinful like us then we’ve got a dilemma we can’t run from, Jesus Christ is not God. It could be said that Christ took on the flesh of sin, nursed on sin, and raised in sin.

Adam’s one voluntary act of disobedience had the effect the whole of mankind deprived of salvation as God’s justice; a punishment, which was a physical death and a privation of God’s love in soul of all born of Adam. Punishment is a physical and spiritual death characterized by the Jews as banishment from Eden, or banishment from “Abraham’s bosom” (Luke 16:22). This is the place where Adam and Eve communed with God, Adam spoke to God and God spoke to Adam, like Moses, they spoke “face to face”. Prior to the fall, Adam having freewill was one with God (oneness such expressed in John 6:57 and John 17:21-22). “God saw all the things that he had made, and they were very good.” God did not, and does not, make evil. Expulsion from Eden is God’s justice for original sin; a privation from an abiding in God and God abiding in us.

Original Sin is that men are born without the fear of God and without trust in God, is to be entirely rejected, since it is manifest to every Christian that to be without the fear of God and without trust in God is rather the actual guilt of an adult than the offence of a recently-born infant, which does not possess as yet the full use of reason, as the Lord says “Your children which had no knowledge between good and evil,” Deut 1:39. (Johann Eck, The Confutatio Pontificia)

If we have Mary understand that Mary was anything less than Immaculately conceived you have the Incarnate Life of the flesh of sinful women and thus God born of sin. God repulses sin, sin does not enter his sight. If Mary were to sin after Christ was born, then sin would not only be in the sight of God but joined to Him by virtue of the flesh.

Consequently, the Blessed Mary must be Immaculate as imperative to Christian faith (beyond Papal decree), for any Christian faith that confesses the Holy Trinity. As you know, the Holy Trinity is three Persons in the one essence of God. God has the nature of God the father and the Holy Spirit has the nature of the Spirit of God. Christ is One of Person with two natures, God and Man. Christ is God (uncreated) and we know Jesus was born of woman, i.e. man. Thus the Person of Jesus Christ is wholly God and wholly man, God/man. The prophecies of the Old Testament require the Messiah to be God (uncreated) and the prophecies require him to be born of woman (creature). The ONLY way Christ can be wholly God, and perfectly a whole man is to be born of the flesh of a woman who is the new Eve – sinless, i.e. the Immaculate Mary. Thus to deny the Blessed Virgin Mary as Immaculate is to deny Christ as either God or man and fails to acknowledge Him as Theandros.

JoeT

 

[Eruvande]

Wow! Hard for me to imagine how anyone can disregard Christ’s mother and our mother too in such a manner!

Yes, it’s quite unpleasant. I actually heard someone say she was no more important to the plan of God than a donkey.

 

[rcwitness]

Mary is a lot more than being just you and me. She is the very first fruit, the very first Catholic, and the very first of the faithful. If she were sinful like us then we’ve got a dilemma we can’t run from, Jesus Christ is not God. It could be said that Christ took on the flesh of sin, nursed on sin, and raised in sin.

JoeT

Can you please provide Catholic Teaching to support this? From my understanding, the Church does NOT Teach what you are saying.

I thought the Church explained that the Lord saw it was ‘fitting’ that Mary be free from sin, yet not explicitly necessary.

In other words, we are not strictly dependent on Mary’s Imaculate Conception or her perseverence in the grace given to her, yet we still benefit from her love for her Son. She could not love her Son in Truth and not love and embrace His mission to forgive the world. She received a peircing pain in her heart out of this love, that she submitted her Son to His passion.

“The Spirit and the Bride say, ‘come’.”

Mary only Taught one thing… “Do whatever He tells you.”

 

[ChurchSoldier]

Mary is a lot more than being just you and me.** She is the very first fruit, **the very first Catholic, and the very first of the faithful.

This is sort of what I meant by the fervency.
…22For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming, 24then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father,

Jesus Christ is not God. It could be said that Christ took on the flesh of sin, nursed on sin, and raised in sin.

I want to say this as nicely as possible, but this concept you listed is a major heresy which lies outside Trinitarian Theology. Maybe you didn’t quite mean it that way. If so, please feel free to clarify.

I appreciate the RCC wanting to lift Mary to a special place. I think she should be, after all God chose her to bear Jesus. But the level to which folks go to lift her up from a Protestant point of view crosses the line into places a Christian shouldn’t go. This is what I meant in my original post the the fervency & frequency" of honoring Mary, as practiced, soon leads to places which are “grey areas” .

I don’t mean any animosity by my comments, but the original post was asking for reasons Protestant did not engage lifting Mary the same way RC’s do. I thought I’d give a viewpoint.

PAX

 

[Petaro]

Very interested in this topic.

Lifelong Catholic with some issues myself about the “co-mediatrix” title.

That’s all I have to say for now.

The Catholic Church has never accepted Our Lady as co-mediatrix, nor should it. There is only one mediator between God and ourselves and that is Jesus Christ, Our Saviour and our God. Mary, for whom I have the greatest love and devotion, would want it no other way.
I can only agree with your “issue” with this proposal by some over zealous Catholics.

 

[GaryTaylor]

she was human like everyone else, though of course a very wonderful and blessed person.

The thinking is common but the thoughts contradict each other. Mary is human but not like everyone else in that there is only one Mother of Jesus Christ=God.

The issues proceed from here with the Nature of Christ-Incarnation. When we reach the fringe realm of Christianity and encounter dispensationalism, which isn’t so fringe anymore but is dangerous, and in many ways aside from the Nature of Christ and Incarnation. However I would consider this…

Hardon: I would say that Swaggart has created his own form of Christianity and, I would add, his own form of Protestantism. And I would have to say that the fundamental error of Jimmy Swaggart is his erroneous understanding of who Christ is. And this is the cardinal error of Lutheran Protestantism.

therealpresence.org/archives/Protestantism/Protestantism_042.htm

Homoousios became a consistent mark of Nicene orthodoxy. They safe guard the Trinity, Incarnation from antiquity.

 

[rstrats]

I’m not aware of any scripture where the Messiah pays any special homage to His mother. In fact He seems to be somewhat put off when her name comes up.

Matthew 12:46-50 - - 46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee. 48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? 49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

John 2:1-4 - - 2 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: 2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. 3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. 4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.

 

[benotagoat]

A genuine Non-Catholic Christian would not explicitly be “shunning” Mary. They would be shunning the Catholic Teachings (and resulting devotions, whether approved or not) regarding her.

Some Catholics try to justify “worship” of Mary on the basis of the wide use of the term. I dont agree with this theology. But I recognize that ‘within’ our worship of God alone, we recognize, admire, receive inspiration through, learn of Godliness, and honor all the saints of the Lord. This is what veneration means. And within the veneration of saints, we hold a unique place for His mother. This unique place is understanding that she has merited (upon the foundation of her Son’s grace) motherhood to all who keep His commandments.

The most important and fundamental example we can have for a devotion to His mother is the Apostle whom He gave us all His mother through… St John! John followed Jesus to the cross and comforted His mother in her agony. Jesus, then, gave His mother to us through the faith of His dear Apostle. To have this faith is to gain His mother as our own.

There are those who think they have a pure devotion to Mary because they have the outward practices of devotions, but really practice superstition in their religion. Some protestants honor Mary more than some Catholics who have rosary beads, images on their walls, etc.

Thankyou very much for this post .

 

[GaryTaylor]

I’m not aware of any scripture where the Messiah pays any special homage to His mother. In fact He seems to be somewhat put off when her name comes up.

Matthew 12:46-50 - - 46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee. 48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? 49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

John 2:1-4 - - 2 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: 2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. 3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. 4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.

Immature argument that avoids the Trinity and Incarnation and has led to “another Christ” clearly explained above. Had the Church not defended and defined, you would be quoting Arius in relation to the Bible or “another Christ”.

 

[benotagoat]

I’m not aware of any scripture where the Messiah pays any special homage to His mother. In fact He seems to be somewhat put off when her name comes up.

Matthew 12:46-50 - - 46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee. 48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? 49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

John 2:1-4 - - 2 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: 2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. 3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. 4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.

I think that we have to remember that Jesus was often replying to some specific situation ,and in this one I think he was adressing the idea that his family would come before others in His mission ;He was saying as the Saviour(God) all are equal in My eyes .

I do not pray to Mary ,but believe that she is the most special of women,and that as His mother he loved her in a special way .
As a man he loved her and honoured her or he would be breaking his own law.
Exodus 20 :12
Ephesians 6 :02 and of course the first commandment .

I would like to say here that it is also a cultural thing . Cultures which were very masculine ,brutal ,and materialistic ,who created ‘capitalism’ for example, saw God as
fearful ,angry and often unforgiving ,a bit like the British ,American model ,before it was softened ,by Irish ,Italian and Spanish immigrants who are less invidualistic and don’t see softness as a fault .