Why Do Roman Catholics Kneel?

[simple_soul]

I ask the Eastern Catholics if they ever kneel and if they did not why? They in turn asked me why did the Latins start kneeling. So that is what brings me here. Whene did kneeling start and why. If some one knows the history that would be great or if some one could guide me in the right direction as to where I can find out the history that would be great too.
Thank you for your time.

 

[PJM]

=simple soul;5563028]I ask the Eastern Catholics if they ever kneel and if they did not why? They in turn asked me why did the Latins start kneeling. So that is what brings me here. Whene did kneeling start and why. If some one knows the history that would be great or if some one could guide me in the right direction as to where I can find out the history that would be great too.
Thank you for your time.

Catholics STAND for praise, worship and sometimes for prayer [the Lords prayer]

***Catholic SIT for instruction [the homily]

Catholics KNEEL in “Latria” worship, which is reservered for Divine Worship of God especially durring the Eucharist Prayer, Holy Communion and the time after Communion to Thank God for the gift of Jesus.

Love and prayers, ***

 

[lil_flower_luv]

We kneel out of reverence for Our Lord.

 

[Joe_Kelley]

Romans 14:11

for it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise * to God.”

 

[HyeDetroit]

What a weird thing to think about! lol
but…
After I read the question I started to wonder why people kneel also!

Maybe because you don’t normally do it during the day & is reserved for prayer? Think about how many times you kneel during a normal day, I counted 0 for myself.

Maybe it puts you in a vulnerable and humble position while praying?
Who knows, maybe it was more comfortable than sitting or standing?

 

[brigid12]

Romans 14:11

 

[John_Larocque]

What a weird thing to think about! lol
but…
After I read the question I started to wonder why people kneel also!

Maybe because you don’t normally do it during the day & is reserved for prayer? Think about how many times you kneel during a normal day, I counted 0 for myself.

Maybe it puts you in a vulnerable and humble position while praying?
Who knows, maybe it was more comfortable than sitting or standing?

Unleavened bread was introduced into the Latin Rite around the 9th century, but when did they switch from standing to kneeling?

Western-rite Orthodox (see of Antioch) have adapted Western liturgical texts, but do they stand or kneel in them?

 

[Rawb]

In the west, kneeling is a traditional posture of respect, trust, and devotion (such as a vassal kneeling to their Lord), love (such as a groom kneeling to his bride), and petition (“on my knees, begging”). As such, it is very appropriate for us to make this position during the Liturgy.

If this isn’t the same in the East (I really don’t know) then yeah, it doesn’t make much sense for them to kneel, (ie; the same symbolism attached to the posture isn’t there.)

 

[Linuse]

Kneeling (not genuflecting) started here in America. My guess is that when we as Catholics saw the puritans and quackers put pews AND kneelers in their meeting halls, we thought that was a neat idea. The irony is that we kept both the kneeler and the pew and the protestants did not.

 

[Filioque]

Some Eastern Catholics and Orthodox have what is called, kneeling vespers. They kneel at various points during the Office on the days appointed for kneeling vespers. Not a daily practice, but not unknown in the East.

 

[simple_soul]

In the west, kneeling is a traditional posture of respect, trust, and devotion (such as a vassal kneeling to their Lord), love (such as a groom kneeling to his bride), and petition (“on my knees, begging”). As such, it is very appropriate for us to make this position during the Liturgy.

If this isn’t the same in the East (I really don’t know) then yeah, it doesn’t make much sense for them to kneel, (ie; the same symbolism attached to the posture isn’t there.)

But this does not answer my original question.
When was kneeling introduced?
Also, as far as I understand it the act of standing in the East is out of respect, trust, devotion, and in some cases petition. It is also done out of love and a wanting to be as close to God as one can possibly be understanding the whole time how unworthy one really is. So what is the difference? Or does it just go to the old saying “Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder”.

 

[diggerdomer]

In the west, kneeling is a traditional posture of respect, trust, and devotion (such as a vassal kneeling to their Lord), love (such as a groom kneeling to his bride), and petition (“on my knees, begging”). As such, it is very appropriate for us to make this position during the Liturgy.

If this isn’t the same in the East (I really don’t know) then yeah, it doesn’t make much sense for them to kneel, (ie; the same symbolism attached to the posture isn’t there.)

Standing was an earlier posture of respect, trust and devotion in the west. Kneeling came later.

 

[brigid12]

Romans 14:11

 

[Frosty]

I ask the Eastern Catholics if they ever kneel and if they did not why? They in turn asked me why did the Latins start kneeling. So that is what brings me here. Whene did kneeling start and why. If some one knows the history that would be great or if some one could guide me in the right direction as to where I can find out the history that would be great too.
Thank you for your time.

You might like to check out this article from the old Catholic Encyclopedia:

newadvent.org/cathen/06423a.htm

 

[Rawb]

So what is the difference? Or does it just go to the old saying “Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder”.

Standing was an earlier posture of respect, trust and devotion in the west. Kneeling came later.

This is an example of that ‘organic development’ that Traditionalists are always talking about. It changed in the West; kneeling came to encompass all these things, especially in feudalistic societies (which is what our culture developed from, and what our Church strongly resembles in the best ways, with Christ as Our Lord).

The Liturgy matched the culture of that time, and of our current time actually; when we, today, see someone kneel it means much the same as it did then. To revert back to standing in the Western rite (which may be an earlier posture of respect, devotion, and supplication, though the article in New Advent seems to dispute this) would be a denial and rejection of all the traditions and culture that have grown from that time. Standing in the west does not mean the same thing as kneeling, at least not any more despite what may have once been.

That’s the difference. In the west, the posture for respect, love, and supplication changed. Apparently in the east, it did not. Why do they cross themselves ‘backwards’ (from our POV)? Why do they have more incense? Why do they not have pews? Why are Icons more common than statues? These are all just cultural differences between the Rites. One is not more ‘right’ in the other except within that Rite.

It’s late, I don’t know if I’m explaining myself well, but I’ll leave it at this for now.

 

[bpbasilphx]

Catholics STAND for praise, worship and sometimes for prayer [the Lords prayer]

***Catholic SIT for instruction [the homily]

Catholics KNEEL in “Latria” worship, which is reservered for Divine Worship of God especially durring the Eucharist Prayer, Holy Communion and the time after Communion to Thank God for the gift of Jesus.

Love and prayers, ***

PJM, your reply SHOULD read “LATIN Catholic Stand…Sit…Kneel…”

Eastern Catholics are just as Catholic and just as traditional.

This forum is NOT entitled “Traditional Latin Catholicism” and there’s no reason to assume it means this.

 

[Jacafamala]

I was at nuptial Mass recently where just prior to the Sanctus, the priest to the congregation NOT to kneel, then went into a mini lecture on how no one kneeled for the first 400 years of Catholicism so we needn’t either. Oh, I thought that was too, too much.

 

[palmas85]

PJM, your reply SHOULD read “LATIN Catholic Stand…Sit…Kneel…”

Eastern Catholics are just as Catholic and just as traditional.

This forum is NOT entitled “Traditional Latin Catholicism” and there’s no reason to assume it means this.

This is the OPs original question

I ask the Eastern Catholics if they ever kneel and if they did not why? They in turn asked me why did the Latins start kneeling. So that is what brings me here. Whene did kneeling start and why. If some one knows the history that would be great or if some one could guide me in the right direction as to where I can find out the history that would be great too.
Thank you for your time.
Reply With Quote

Since PJM responded to that question specifically it is pretty obvious that the response was directed towards it.

The Traditional Forum is described in the following terms from the forums main page

Traditional Catholicism
Forum for discussion of traditional Roman Catholic spirituality

Since there is already a forum on the Eastern Churches and since this one is specifically identified as being for issues of Roman Catholic Traditional Spirituality there is indeed every reason to believe that it refers to traditional Latin Catholicism since Latin Catholicism refers to Roman Catholicism.

I wonder why you feel the need to constantly interject Eastern Catholicism onto a forum dedicated to traditional Roman Catholic issues.

 

[RNRobert]

When Paul was on his way to Jerusalem, he met with some disciples in various towns; and on two separate occasions, they all knelt and prayed (Acts 20:36, Acts 21:5). Earlier, when Peter raised Dorcas from the dead, he knelt and prayed first (Acts 9:40).
So it seems to me that kneeling in prayer is a tradition that can be traced back to the Apostles. Jesus knelt and prayed in the Garden of Gethsemane (Luke 22:42), and Solomon knelt during the dedication of the Temple (2 Chron 6:13).

 

[simple_soul]

That’s the difference. In the west, the posture for respect, love, and supplication changed. Apparently in the east, it did not. Why do they cross themselves ‘backwards’ (from our POV)? Why do they have more incense? Why do they not have pews? Why are Icons more common than statues? These are all just cultural differences between the Rites. One is not more ‘right’ in the other except within that Rite.

It's late, I don't know if I'm explaining myself well, but I'll leave it at this for now.

OK if I understand you. The issues of “irreverence” and “disrespect” that alot of Traditionalists have are directed at those in there own Rite and not at the Eastern Rites?