Why do so many protestants not consider church attendance an important part of their faith?

[tweetymom]

I know what you mean about money being spent better. We paid off our chuch a few months back. We are debt free. We are putting more money into doing mission work. Helping those who need the help. Going to poor counties and countries. Giving and not asking for anything in return. It feels good to do for others. We have not had a law suit brought against us. We do a lot of checking out before we jump into organizations. If we feel something is not right we stay out. I bet the pipe organ is beautiful. We have one but its not all that fancy, but sounds great. My church is not fancy, it plain. We have stain glass windows, and a cross but the walls are plain. Don’t need all the fancy stuff, our money is better off helping others rather then going to stuff that reall don’t mean a lot.
Now don’t get me wrong its a nice church and a pretty good sized one. Like I said we do a lot of mission work in our community as well as around the globe. We don’t go on mission trips to bring them to Chrisianity we go to show them God at work and if asked why we are doing this for them then we tell them why and that has to do with God. I guess what I’m trying to say is you can have the nicest church but if you only spend you money on making you church the nicest, you are missing what we are her for and that is to help others in their time of need. I hope that makes sense.

Sounds like a very nice church Rev and I would be very pleased to visit it if I am ever in Texas. God Bless

 

[eucharisteo]

To which “Temples” are you referring? There was only one Temple.

Curiously,
Mick

I want to locate a book about the history of the Divine Liturgy/Mass. Some did meet in the Temple I know and then would meet in homes for the breaking of break [Eucharist]. Later they were chased out of the Temple and thus began to meet entirely in homes. It was not until Constantine that they public office buildings were converted to “churches” or basilicas. This is the history of the Church’s architecture and why we have cathedrals. St. Peter’s Basilica is a prime example of the splendor of the beauty.

The reason the clergy where robes is because it is a visible sign of our long ancient history from where we come. The icons are reminders for us to help contemplate various aspects of Jesus and the early Church. Sometimes we see extraordinary Saints from Old Testament times through recent times. This is an expression of our history and gives us examples of how we also should live our lives. We do this all in the presence of Christ in the tabernacle. Shame on those parishes that scooted the tabernacle in some separate room. This needs to be corrected in at least 2 of the parishes around me that I know about. The sacred music brings us to a heightened awareness of the beauty of God’s love for us. It helps us remember Christ’s passion. There is a certain reverence observable in Catholic churches compared to Protestant evangelical churches that do not have tabernacles or accept real presence. I’ve seen far too many people chatter while people are trying to pray these days. But many years ago I remember hearing priests shhhh peoople for making such noise in a holy place.

 

[Lypher]

It amazes me that a lot of posters seem to think that the Catholic Church is rich in money because of the beautiful Churches. I do audits on offerings for all different denominations and I can tell you that the Protestants give FAR more money. I think a lot of them truly do live the 10% rule. Catholics just don’t. That being said the reason that it appears that the Catholic Church has money is beacuse it is 2000 years old and has built up over many many years. Most Protestant Churches are less then 100 years old. Anyway you can go to Italy and see the effects of the “Modern” age on the material condition of the Parishes. It is truly sad.

God Bless The Catholic Church.

 

[KathleenGee]

Why Catholics don’t tithe 10% is because it is not fair to put on people a certain %. A working man with a family who has to tithe 10% has a far greater burden than an affluent couple.

Also, in referring to St. Justin in #83 here, the rich were asked to donate for the poor but never told to give a certain amount. The Old Testament mentioned the 10% tithing in Deuteronomy and one other time. In my own Catholic-like way, I don’t recall the passage number but the intent.

For sources on liturgy, you can go the present, ‘The Liturgy Documents’ of Vatican II. Mike Aquina has a small book on the early Mass that shows up here on the side of CAF. Edward Foley, Cap, wrote ‘From Age to Age’, that was recommended to me by our archdiocesan head of liturgy. Aquina’s book also draws on St. Justin. He was the first to be asked to explain what the Mass is and what happens there. The Didache draws on practices of early Christians that we practice today. The Maronite Mass uses the ‘Liturgical Eucharistic Prayer of St. John the Evangelist’. In ancient times there were different prayers, but as the Church became established, norms were more and more practiced.

St. Paul was referring to the rich homes who held Masses where the lower class were out in the courtyard. The homes had tall walls enclosing them, so they were private. Fr Foley’s book basically covers how the churches evolved from the homes. The Nazarene Jews worshipped in their own synagogues, and the Breaking of Bread, a Jewish custom, is still practied among Palestinian Christians.

So as Christ did not look the same from infancy, so with the Church, liturgy, morality. A protestant woman was raised in an anti-Catholic family. She got hold of ancient catechisms. Then when she read ours and saw the same teachings, she converted.

Early Christian history is converting. The blood of the martyrs of ancient times are still efficacious.

But what the Catholic Church is lacking today is our separated brethren and all their gifts.

 

[Libertarian_FL]

I had to respond to this idea being MODERN, it in fact predates the Reformation led by Luther and others by one great theological scholar of the Chrisian Anarchist Movement that wrote earlier.

Petr Chelčický

He taught much of what your all complaining about if Catholic and Protestant but I will note just that I beleive and do so strongly that we have ,thanks to the Reformation, the Bible in common languages and the Gnostic Texts that could be recovered. We also have God who we reach through Jesus and the authority of the Holy Spirit the one teacher - who needs more than that?

And I will note the major criticism of the one church being the Roman Catholic Church claim that is this. If one judges a worker of God as being as Christ as we should then explain the many crimes the Roman Catholic faith did and supported over its history either openly or by its silence. If that is what Jesus wished then I will find another savior He is not then true. Protestants are not much better their lust for money and power is just as strong the fact ministers of both faiths are educated elitists that now think they are better than the laity is just plain evil. Jesus NEVER thought He was better than anyone touching lepers, beggers and sinners all the time.

So yes give me my Bible, God and let them teach me and when I choose to join othrs in prayer it will just happen.

 

[KathleenGee]

Our priests teach us all the time not to be hypocrites. The writing of the saints say the same and no one is better than others.

The problem is the falling away from ancient disciplines, be it attached to money and power and its subsequent and greatest problem of not reproving and dealing with errant priests. And those who are in very serious sin and refuse to change need to be removed.

We are always exhorted to pray very much for our priests and with good reason. The scandal they can bring can last for centuries and I am seeing this more and more on CAF.

But how far can go as well in ignoring the vast majority of faithful bishops, priests, religious and laity? The numbers speak very loudly.

And the saints also warn us by succumbing to scandal as well. It can make one very self-righteous in the eyes of sinner and then those who only focus on scandals of Catholic clerics while ignoring the faithful ones are then repeating the same problem of phariseeism.

You can’t separate the Bible from the Church because it was first of all assembled and put together by the Catholic Church, and secondly, the Bible is also the history of the People of God as well. You can’t separate the Bible from the Church and its people. Tbey are inseparable.

The popes have gone out to the world to ask its forgiveness for the Church’s sins, and it will continue to be forthcoming.

As the world gets smaller and smaller because of the internet, we are all carrying each others sins, be they ecclesial or secular. As a bishop said, in this world of imposing pornography and debased sexuality, it is hard for those to be celibate. It is the secular world that is imposing its lacking on the church and the rest of society.

We are all no better than the other, we all affect each other, be it church or secular, we are all in it together for the long run.

 

[SSTeacher]

SSTeacher;6548606:

To which “Temples” are you referring? There was only one Temple.

Curiously,
Mick

I want to locate a book about the history of the Divine Liturgy/Mass. Some did meet in the Temple I know and then would meet in homes for the breaking of break [Eucharist]. Later they were chased out of the Temple and thus began to meet entirely in homes. It was not until Constantine that they public office buildings were converted to “churches” or basilicas. This is the history of the Church’s architecture and why we have cathedrals. St. Peter’s Basilica is a prime example of the splendor of the beauty.

The reason the clergy where robes is because it is a visible sign of our long ancient history from where we come. The icons are reminders for us to help contemplate various aspects of Jesus and the early Church. Sometimes we see extraordinary Saints from Old Testament times through recent times. This is an expression of our history and gives us examples of how we also should live our lives. We do this all in the presence of Christ in the tabernacle. Shame on those parishes that scooted the tabernacle in some separate room. This needs to be corrected in at least 2 of the parishes around me that I know about. The sacred music brings us to a heightened awareness of the beauty of God’s love for us. It helps us remember Christ’s passion. There is a certain reverence observable in Catholic churches compared to Protestant evangelical churches that do not have tabernacles or accept real presence. I’ve seen far too many people chatter while people are trying to pray these days. But many years ago I remember hearing priests shhhh peoople for making such noise in a holy place.

Not all Jews lived in Jerusalem. There were three feasts that were compulsory for every able male Jewish adult and which meant a long trip to Jerusalem: Passover, Feast of Weeks (Pentecost) and Feast of Tabernacles. The necessity for synagogues thus becomes apparent although I must admit I haven’t done much research into their history. I seem to recall reading somewhere that there had to be a minimum of ten people for worship in the synagogue to take place. Less than that meant the Jews simply prayed and ate in their homes. I may have that statistic wrong, though.

What is fairly probable, however, is that the Jews at that time – whether they worshipped in the Temple or in the synagogue or in their homes – always maintained the reverence and respect for the LORD God that appears to be so lacking in many churches in Christendom today.

Respectfully,
Mick

 

[PRmerger]

We also have God who we reach through Jesus and the authority of the Holy Spirit the one teacher - who needs more than that?

Because without the Church as the authority you get each individual claiming his own interpretation of Scripture is the final authority. That has led to the obscene 40,000 Christian denominations. , each claiming “the authority of the Holy Spirit”.

If one judges a worker of God as being as Christ as we should then explain the many crimes the Roman Catholic faith did and supported over its history either openly or by its silence.

There is a very old philosophical principle which addresses that: *Abusus non tollit usum: * Abuse does not take away use, i.e., is not an argument against proper use.

 

[SSTeacher]

Why Catholics don’t tithe 10% is because it is not fair to put on people a certain %. A working man with a family who has to tithe 10% has a far greater burden than an affluent couple.

As he looked up, Jesus saw the rich putting their gifts into the temple treasury. He also saw a poor widow put in two very small copper coins. “I tell you the truth,” he said, “this poor widow has put in more than all the others. All these people gave their gifts out of their wealth but she out of her poverty put in all she had to live on."

Comparatively,
Mick

 

[chrisman27]

I have wondred why protestants don’t always attend their services as faithfully as SOME catholics. Again, this is not ALL protestants.

But I have a relative with a weird situation…she is catholic, her husband Lutheran. He attends almost every sunday with her at her cc.
BUT
he rarely, if ever attends his lutheran church.
But he has no interest in joing the cc.
AND he goes every two years for his picture in teh LUTHERAN directory!
don’t get it man.

 

[crazzeto]

Amongst Evangelicals, I’ve encountered Acts 2:42–47 (with much emphasis on verse 46b) being adduced in order to endorse this notion. I’ve no doubt that in such company you’d find people who would assert that the idea is “biblical.”

Cordially,
Mick

It’s funny they would use this verse to support such a counter-christian principal:

Act 2:46 And continuing daily with one accord in the temple and breaking bread from house to house, they took their meat with gladness and simplicity of heart:

The Apostles at no time skipped the “organized religion” in order to have a meeting at someones house (ironcially notice the “to break bread” in there, what are the chances they reject the Eucharist too? ). Rather, they worshiped at the temple, on the 7th day (Saturday) like good Jews, then on the 8th day (first of the week) they celebrated the breaking of the bread (Eucharist) on the Lords day.

Further highlights how problematic sola scriptura is.

 

[SSTeacher]

I have wondred why protestants don’t always attend their services as faithfully as SOME catholics. Again, this is not ALL protestants.

I’ve generally supposed it was because the rule for ALL Catholics is that if they don’t attend Mass on a Sunday and they have no good reason for staying away they will be in a state of mortal sin and for a Catholic that’s an extremely serious situation. No such Sword of Damocles exists outside Catholicism.

Cordially,
Mick

 

[Roy5]

After reading the postings, some brief thoughts.

1. As a person who is of dual heritage (French-Canadian Catholic, Yankee Protestant), I have to say that I personally tend to enjoy less formality in worship than heavy liturgy. For example, I prefer folk masses to high masses. When I attend Protestant services, especially less liturgical ones, I find them more spontaneous, worshipers sing much better, there is less routine. In the more liturgical churches (Catholic, Episcopal, Lutheran and some Methodist) just about everything is pre-ordered, handed down from on high, with certain readings designated for every Sunday and such. I do not agree with Pentecostalists, but certain of their churches have a liveliness and spirit that I like. You know that they are there because they want to be and not because of tradition, pressure, or whatever.
2. Beautiful sanctuaries are impressive, but I approved of the push to remove some of the too-often-garish statues that cluttered the front of too many churches before Vatican II. They seemed to conflict with the commandment against graven images, even though that was not their intention. I have been to India, and all those statues up front resembles what I saw in many Hindu temple.
3. Catholics historically were much better at attending worship than Protestants, though I believe this has changed over the past 50 years, Now both have a roughly 35% attendance. It never was a sin within Protestantism to miss Sunday worship. Ironically, most Protestants I knew as a child were more observant of Sunday in other ways - no movies, etc. My Protestant kinfolk went further and permitted no cards, no shopping, and other such activities. It was for them a strictly family day within the home, unless you went o visit relatives. a common Sunday habit.
4. As for converts, it goes both ways. Several of the Protestant churches around here seem to be full of ex-Catholics, including several pastors with good Italian surnames. Some end up in evangelical churches where the preaching and music is likely to have a special appeal. Others go to mainline churches where doctrinal differences usually are accepted - ‘big tent’ congregations which do not fret about heresies and independent thinking is allowed and even encouraged.
5. Different strokes for different folks. It doesn’t trouble me at all that people have different preferences in religion like they do in music, politics, food, clothes, and much more.
   “Variety if the spice of life” and I am proud to live in a country where the multiplicity of faiths means that no one religion is in a position to reign over other religions. I believe that God smiles upon all people of genuine faith who do their best to live by the Golden Rule. The emphasis on doctrinal conformity increasingly turns some people away from the church.

May God bless Catholics, Protestants, Jews and people of every creed, color and country.

 

[PRmerger]

Different strokes for different folks. It doesn’t trouble me at all that people have different preferences in religion like they do in music, politics, food, clothes, and much more.

Except, of course, those that you’ve deemed unacceptable, right, Roy?

I believe that God smiles upon all people of genuine faith who do their best to live by the Golden Rule.

Based on what? How do you know that “God smiles upon all people of genuine faith who do their best to live by the Golden Rule”? Because that’s what the Scriptures tell you? Because of a feeling you’ve gotten while in prayer? Because it sounds good?

Where do you get your understanding of what God likes or dislikes?

 

[chrisman27]

well , last i heard, God loves everyone

 

[tweetymom]

well , last i heard, God loves everyone

That’s what I heard:thumbsup:

 

[KathleenGee]

But He also warns us as well…we don’t want to compromise our faith, that the kingdom of Christ is the Pearl of Great Price…

 

[jmcrae]

well , last i heard, God loves everyone

Not all love Him, though, and as a gentleman, He does not force Himself (nor His Heaven, nor His blessings and graces) on those who find themselves more interested in something else than in Him.

 

[chrisman27]

???

 

[PRmerger]

???

What do the question marks refer to, chrisman? Whose post do you not understand?