Why do some Catholics lean politically conservative?

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TheLittleLady said:
There are criminals from every country, in every country.

Speaking of people as people, respecting the dignity of the person is so lost when you refer to real human beings as “illegals”.

Jesus knows our sins yet calls us by our names. Satan knows our names yet calls us by our sins.
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So, aside from the language I used, what do you suggest in terms of policy?

If someone is in the country illegally, and commits a crime, what do we do?

Do we report that person and get them deported?

Or do we just look the other way and let that person kill somebody?
 
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Not all criminals are going to commit murder.

If someone commits a crime in the US, they should be tried under the laws of the US. Justice is basic human right.
 
DENNYINMI said:
I still am awaiting an affirmative action within the conservative platform ideal that lends to ease the burden of those in financial hardship, or move them ‘up’…I see a lot of what they believe they don’t need…higher education…welfare…any government assist…but no “how-to”…???
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Labor unions can and DO provide applicable job training.

There are “apprenticeships” available that provide hands-on job training.

My children are hands on trainers. And provide specific skills needed.

Not rare or unusual.
 
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But it’s similar to poverty. You might become impoverished for other reasons, like Disaster Happening, but so many people get into it because you’re surrounded by people who are already in poverty, and you don’t have the skills to escape it. It’s what you know-- it’s normal-- you know how to function in that world-- so why put forth the effort to escape it?
If the government can’t solve meth (over 12 million Americans have used meth), how can we expect them to solve poverty?
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But in respect to poverty, a lot of people are blameless by being born in the wrong family or in the wrong zip code? Why should some people be doomed to circumstance and misfortune? Why not build a path to hope and opportunity and do whatever it takes to at least reach more equitable opportunity. The lottery of life seems rather unfair.
 
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It really is your beauty that you see Christianity as left-leaning because it’s your view. Jesus if He were a politician would be neither right or left so those who really follow Jesus would probably fall more towards the middle. That says there are some issues that are very important that trumps the others and that are in the pro-life category.
 
RCIAGraduate said:
The lottery of life seems rather unfair.
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The one guy who was able to pick and choose what family he wanted to be born to… who did he pick?

The one guy who was able to pick his life and his death… what did he pick?

If he chose that for himself, I think some of us can cope with our ramen years… But at the same time, we strive to overcome them.

I remember crying in the grocery store because I wanted to grill steak, but I couldn’t afford $4/lb for meat. I stuck it back on the shelf and I picked up the 39-cent-a-pound chicken instead. Because that was my state in life at the time.

It wasn’t fair… but it also wasn’t my stopping point. I didn’t want to be someone who cried about not being able to afford steak, or Sunday dinner being a five-cent package of ramen noodles or a frozen pot pie for a quarter. (Prices have increased since then, of course. Ramen now sells for twenty cents a package, and frozen pot pies are north of a dollar each!)

But I didn’t wait for “the government” to step in and fix it for me. I realized it was just one point in my life, and it wasn’t a place I wanted to be, and I did what I needed to to move on.

Compared to the billions of people who pre-existed us, we live better than kings. If we’re one of the 51% of the people of the world who have internet access-- we’re doing well. If we make more than $32k/year, we’re part of the global 1%.
 
TheLittleLady said:
The “pull yourself up by your own bootstraps” plan is workable for a small segment. There are people who have no straps on their boots, others who don’t have boots and a subset who do not even have legs. Complex societal issues need to be approached at many levels.
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We disagree about which is the larger segment, those who can and should succeed through their own efforts versus those who cannot, but we at least agree that both groups exist. An approach that helps the former but not the latter should not be rejected or disparaged. There is no one approach that helps everyone.
 
There are a lot of good human heartfelt concerns here. Which is good.
While I’m not conservative, and certainly not liberal, how well have government
programs succeeded? Not very well.
Yes, we need to foster opportunity for families, and encourage business opportunities,
for successful business for employment. And it is difficult to do these things and truly
be fair to everyone - and it get extremely complicated with all the warring ideologies;
which fight advancement in unity for the sake of their ideologies. They all claim that
if there way would advance, then they can solve the harsh problems of the poor. And history
shows that there re-branded, nuanced ideologies do not work. Do they accept this?
So many are lulled into, well this group or that and their ideas are compassionate and the other side are a bunch of heartless power hungry people.
Why did Japan during the 50 years after WWII, have an over all success?
Why is Venezuela and sections of the West in such dire straits?
Yes, by all means fight corporate ‘welfare.’ But gradually work to foster opportunities, rather than throw money at the problems. John Kennedy did not envision the current situation.
Rather than work out particular situations, (no, I’m not republican or democrat, I’m independent) in requiring available work for food-stamps - so many just liked to cry out, oh, that is heartless - when it makes sense, to help lift out of poverty.
But ultimately, people look at objective revealed morality. The mass murder of helpless children. And realize that, while yes, not all republicans are sincere, they can keep constitutional judges coming up. Just like any mass atrocity in the past; if these children are over looked, and they are placed as not important for all these other concerns; especially with historically proven dubious solutions - (where so many in history in particular, propagandize against the Judaeo Christian ethic revealed by God) to foster,
encourage, and propagandize their bloody agendas that seem to care for one group or another — while legalizing a culture of death — more and more go beyond propaganda;
and legalize silence of speech and conscience — while people just ignore it because they
have been sold, that they are for the poor and the other side is for the rich. While thousands of helpless victims die every single day.
That is why in all things, Jesus Christ Himself, Paul The Apostle and many more said to keep our minds on things above, not to be swayed by things below.
Not the same as totalitarian communism, a lot of their ideas, began universities in the 1920s regarding ‘freedom,’ though really license;
aided by hurtful hypocrisy, which they used to fullest extent for propaganda; so many think
they sell freedom, rights, and help for the oppressed. Yet they haven’t solved anything,
but help with increased Godlessness, an immense debt which the piper will be paid eventually, (like the British Sterling no longer guides), but the worst of all,
they foster and encourage a culture of death, aided by putting those in the judiciary that distort the constitution for their agendas.
 
so many are programmed to 2, 4, and 6 year cycles. It will take consistent education and teaching as many as possible, constitutional persons in the Judiciary for one thing. It will not happen overnight. But if the vast majority of educators, media, those in arts and entertainment - who have honed propaganda skills to incite the masses — it looks like the war of attrition is far from over. I hope and pray for many to see through that is someone promotes the culture of death; sometimes in very heartless ways, then how can they be for anyone?
 
Hi everyone, good morning.
I continue to follow the thread and other than an outrage for abortion (albeit without discussion on the underlying reasons a woman seeks them) a lot of talk about communism and Fox news talk show talking points and an utter love for boot strapping…I still cannot find one pro-active policy from a conservative ideological school of thought.
I DID see truth regarding labor unions, ah…that was refreshing. Have a great day, 😄
 
DENNYINMI said:
I still cannot find one pro-active policy from a conservative ideological school of thought.
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I doubt if you will if you watch this for a thousand years.

Conservatism is about the people ruling themselves instead of a gigantic government imposing its will with a comprehensive action program of any kind.

It counts on people to do the right thing on their own, and provides the means for them to do so by reducing the yoke of government. The idea is that without the imposition of government will, the people will produce more.
 
Augustinian said:
It counts on people to do the right thing on their own, and provides the means for them to do so by reducing the yoke of government. The idea is that without the imposition of government will, the people will produce more.
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We don’t live in the garden of Eden with all men doing right at all times. Not all people will do the right thing “on their own” which often suffers the children or common man. If anyone considers government an evil, then I would say it is a necessary one. Government needs to defend the rights of all and because of the evils of men left to their own devices, government has needed to grow into what it is today.
It is unfortunate that many view government programs or regulations as attempts to thwart the prosperity of the few. Man, when left alone without judicial check proves fallen prey to the vice of consumerism where enough is never enough. Wealth at the expense of others with the lack of concern for living wages is one of the greatest evils that can befall any society. This evil consumerism can eat like moth at the fabric of a society, hence we have had to be re-active. This means that regulations and “more” government have had to come into play not because someone “might” try to exploit persons under the banner of laborers…It has come into play because someone “did”. Yes, we are a re-active society. Also, as Chesterton said…“The problem is not too much capitalism, the problem is too few capitalists”…how true.
Monopolies, large corporations and sects of the work force that have enormous foot-holds on our most basic needs and essentially runs our economy is big government in reverse. It’s big corporations, concentrated wealth, and even a nod to corporate “welfare” at times with the bailing out of institutions that have bore the name “too big to fail” and this should be feared all the more. It undermines our democracy when wealth can determine the fate of a nation.
 
One idea I support as a conservative is food and/or monetary assistance when needed, with a strict time limit and work requirements and/or job training so that the person can succeed and then support themselves. Where I live, this is the case, the state will pay for something called vocational rehab while you are receiving welfare. The only way it goes wrong is the strict cut off once you earn a certain amount. That’s not a conservative policy in itself, it may be a federal thing. And it traps people into trying to stay within the limit. Who can blame them when if you earn $50 more you lose $300 of assistance. What they should do is for every dollar you earn over The “limit”, your assistance should be cut by Maybe $0.40, then the next milestone cuts it by $0.60, etc so that you don’t feel it by the time you don’t need it anymore. This is just common sense in my opinion. I think that private charity should play the biggest role but the government would do well providing job training.

The liberal supported idea of welfare assistance doesn’t help at all and in fact only breeds dependence. It has sapped the work ethic out of entire swathes of people, and has become generational. Honestly, besides this false idea that the left helps people more, their entire platform is evil. It’s the party of death and immorality.
 
Extreme sadness that thousands of children (along with the sick and elderly forced to die by eugenics, now) — are not treated as persons with solidarity with us.
Why can’t we love them both?
I’m not conservative, liberal, nor republican nor democrat — but the only chance on the governmental front
to stem the tide, is not to support ideologies that encourage mass murder, sometimes very adamantly, while giving historically dubious solutions for the poor.
It ends up objectively as taking a bribe against the innocent, especially the magnitude of the mass murder.
And, you really think that it is boot strapping to consider Biblical moral concerns as to why
many lean conservative? That sure confuses me.
Bishop Fulton J. Sheen described the ‘modern’ Church of our day before 1950. It is so accurate it is astounding. I certainly will not get into it all, but he said that there would be a new ‘humanitarian’ movement that would disregard some with great bloodshed. And he said that it would be an accommodating Church that to most would look like the real Church. But he, also added, not to worry, the Remnant Church will always be here, and God allows all these things for our benefit.
Killing a child is killing a child no matter the reason. We are to help the parents in their needs, not condone nor appear to condone by silence the killing of children.
But so many want to take real human concerns, and fog this over with situational ethics.
Jesus Christ said for each of us to make our ‘yes’ mean ‘yes’ and our ‘no’ mean ‘no,’ anything else is from the devil.
And the world, always attacking the Judaeo Christian ethic, clarified by Jesus Christ to further ideologies and agendas - will always use propaganda to do things such as paint this as non compassionate.
Just like totalitarian communism, the dictatorship of moral relativism which culminated in a culture of death - with many justifications - will be conquered by Jesus Christ, one way or another.
 
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Once again, I advocate for life as well. It’s just that I advocate food, housing, medical care and education for life as well. The reason? It’s not political but it is psycho-social. It is thoughtful because it looks at the reasons without demonization and shaming for something no one would look forward to procuring for oneself. One of the largest demographics of women that obtain abortion are the poor that lack the above and see no way out. They’ve convinced themselves sometimes that is the only way! I’d like to tell them it isn’t. I’d like to tell them their child is not a mistake. I’d like to tell them we will carry them until they can walk. That should clear up any misgivings on bootstrapping as well.
 
That is why we advocate compassionate raising awareness, and not leave parents orphaned to the world’s propaganda. The killing of a child, not only hurts the child, it severely hurts the psyche of the parents. Silence exacerbates their situation.
I’m quite familiar with the poor, having been around them much of my life.
And those in the Gospel of Life witness, where The Sacredness of Life is an integral
part of the Divine Revelation show compassion toward those who have their consciences
fogged over regarding the child. Most of the time striving to show available help, first,
then gradually reveal the reality of the child. Not leaving someone in ignorance, certainly
is not demonizing. It just isn’t cajoling, complicating matters.
And your argument that is not political, doesn’t make sense. ‘Legalized’ slavery aided and abetted acceptance for a very long time, even to the point of many Churches in the south
advocating it.
The Declaration of Independence indicates that just laws are derived from The Laws of Nature, and of Nature’s God.
The laws of the land sanctioning legalized murdering of helpless children, and everyone is created with a natural ardent desire to live in God’s Providence. Being complacent about all branches - with a special note regarding the judiciary, which has decades long ramifications,
doesn’t help the poor in their plight.

Peace, — oh here is yesterday’s Priests For Life reflection, very apropos.​

September 3​

"Teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you…" (Matthew 28:20).
Reflection: Pro-abortion politicians will often say to us, “Abortion is the law of the land.” But the “law of the land” can be changed, just as it was changed regarding slavery and segregation. The law of the land is meant to protect the good of the people. Because imperfect people make the law of the land, they sometimes make mistakes, and allow things which experience later proves are not good for the people. That’s why the law can be changed.
Prayer: Holy Spirit, come and renew the face of the earth, and make us agents of change. Amen.
 
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