Why do some people prefer to be atheists?

[Jelrak_TB]

How do you explain the reality of love? Or is it a mystery?

I have difficulty understanding love’s apparent inconsistencies…for I have witnessed individuals fall into and out of love; I have noted individuals who appear to be very loving to their family turn around and exhibit an incredible lack of sympathy to others; I have noted friendships turn to romance, parental love of dependent children erode into impatience to be rid of teenagers, and one-time love of parents evaporate into a mere routine of endurance; I have learned through direct experience that love does not conquer all and that loving one’s enemies may at times have disastrous consequences to one’s family…(or one’s society as we might currently observe with regards to Europe’s current refugee dilemma).

If love has as its origin God’s personal and direct influence why might it appear so fleeting and often times impotent in our mortal realm?

 

[Jelrak_TB]

Some people may say that the greatest argument against Christianity is Christians themselves. But I say that argument cuts both ways. If anything has turned me off of atheism it is the atheists themselves. Because of how much arrogance and insults I have seen coming from over their fence. (Not so much on this site but on other websites that I barely go to now). It is revolting to me now.

Agreed…the hostility, lack of compassion, outright ridicule, intolerance, and tactical abuse certainly have given me reason for pause…though given these behaviors are typical for debating sites it is possible that this may be a bit of a concentrated view…certainly it does not line up with my own experiences with atheists in person.

So much so that at one time I said I would rather see Muslims in the street than atheists. But that may not be as accurate now with all the terrorist activities. So I would amend that to say I would rather see peaceful Muslims. It’s probably easier to dialogue with a peaceful Muslim. At least we share much in common.

Be careful what you wish for…the peaceful Muslim may be a great deal less likely to defend your ultimate right to religious freedom than would be the atheist…for to the latter it may be easier to consider a worldview in which all religions may appear to have equal value, but to the former it is more often the case to consider alternate religions mere competition.

 

[Bradski]

Agreed…the hostility, lack of compassion, outright ridicule, intolerance, and tactical abuse certainly have given me reason for pause…though given these behaviors are typical for debating sites it is possible that this may be a bit of a concentrated view…certainly it does not line up with my own experiences with atheists in person.

Forums where there is no moderation, or very little, generally deteriorate into a bear pit. I have tried on one or two Christian sites to put a reasonable point forward and it becomes almost impossible to keep a decent tone.

That said, most atheist forums are the same. It’s all too easy to denigrate someone whilst hiding behind a keyboard.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Agreed…the hostility, lack of compassion, outright ridicule, intolerance, and tactical abuse certainly have given me reason for pause…though given these behaviors are typical for debating sites it is possible that this may be a bit of a concentrated view…certainly it does not line up with my own experiences with atheists in person.

I have atheist friends who tend to be better behaved in person than one might expect after seeing a pattern of verbal abuse from certain atheists in writing. Think Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, or Christopher Hitchens, to name just three of the more vicious ones.

 

[Jelrak_TB]

I have atheist friends who tend to be better behaved in person than one might expect after seeing a pattern of verbal abuse from certain atheists in writing. Think Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, or Christopher Hitchens, to name just three of the more vicious ones.

It is unfortunate that in attempting to refute an idea it often seems one will take the extra step to refute the person as well…even (or perhaps especially) if one might previously have held the same view.

Yet I have found it interesting to see Dawkins defend the Church of England, declaring it a part of his cultural heritage, while Sam Harris used all of his usual disdain to promote Christianity against Cenk Uygur’s defense of Islam. It appears that, in spite of all else, these atheists have not quite forgotten their roots…

 

[tonyrey]

I have difficulty understanding love’s apparent inconsistencies…for I have witnessed individuals fall into and out of love; I have noted individuals who appear to be very loving to their family turn around and exhibit an incredible lack of sympathy to others; I have noted friendships turn to romance, parental love of dependent children erode into impatience to be rid of teenagers, and one-time love of parents evaporate into a mere routine of endurance; I have learned through direct experience that love does not conquer all and that loving one’s enemies may at times have disastrous consequences to one’s family…(or one’s society as we might currently observe with regards to Europe’s current refugee dilemma).

I agree with all that you have written but it doesn’t prove genuine love is rare. There are many unselfish people who dedicate their lives to others and even die for them.

If love has as its origin God’s personal and direct influence why might it appear so fleeting and often times impotent in our mortal realm?

“appear” is the key word. If there were coercive evidence we would no longer be free to shape our own destiny.

 

[tonyrey]

It is unfortunate that in attempting to refute an idea it often seems one will take the extra step to refute the person as well…even (or perhaps especially) if one might previously have held the same view.

Yet I have found it interesting to see Dawkins defend the Church of England, declaring it a part of his cultural heritage, while Sam Harris used all of his usual disdain to promote Christianity against Cenk Uygur’s defense of Islam. It appears that, in spite of all else, these atheists have not quite forgotten their roots…

That is because for the most part they live according to Christian principles which are not limited to Europe but are the basis of the UNDHR and prevalent in most countries throughout the world. They reject Christ but not the core of His teaching.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Yet I have found it interesting to see Dawkins defend the Church of England, declaring it a part of his cultural heritage, while Sam Harris used all of his usual disdain to promote Christianity against Cenk Uygur’s defense of Islam. It appears that, in spite of all else, these atheists have not quite forgotten their roots…

“The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.” Richard Dawkins

“The only angels we need invoke are those of our better nature: reason, honesty, and love. The only demons we must fear are those that lurk inside every human mind: ignorance, hatred, greed, and faith, which is surely the devil’s masterpiece.” Sam Harris

 

[tonyrey]

Agreed…the hostility, lack of compassion, outright ridicule, intolerance, and tactical abuse certainly have given me reason for pause…though given these behaviors are typical for debating sites it is possible that this may be a bit of a concentrated view…certainly it does not line up with my own experiences with atheists in person.

Be careful what you wish for…the peaceful Muslim may be a great deal less likely to defend your ultimate right to religious freedom than would be the atheist…for to the latter it may be easier to consider a worldview in which all religions may appear to have equal value, but to the former it is more often the case to consider alternate religions mere competition.

I lived in Algeria and found life was safer than in the UK where I have been mugged. I’m sure that even now the terrorists are a small minority who give the rest a bad reputation. Most people want to live in peace unless they are being oppressed and lack the basic necessities of life.

 

[Birdpreacher]

Atheist here.

I love my Catholic Heritiage, and the lessons that it has taught my family and ancestors.

To me, Religon is just a social construct. It contains the stories and values of a people throughout history. I love being able to look at what values and character traits my ancestors enshrined.

Having said that, Catholicism is a good story, but its not the only story. There are many religions and epics, and mythologies out there that all have good qualitites as well as bad ones. So while I enjoy my heritage, I can also recognize that my ancestors and their beliefs were far from perfect and definitely not the divine word of god that shapes my reality and how I live my life.

I love catholics, I have close friends in the priesthood and enjoy the community it provides. I think that we live in an age were there are just people who are more concerned with “being right” than getting it right. THey exist in CAtholic and athiest camps. These outspoken people just want to cram their views down your throat and disregard yours. Its quite unattractive

 

[Jelrak_TB]

I agree with all that you have written but it doesn’t prove genuine love is rare. There are many unselfish people who dedicate their lives to others and even die for them.
“appear” is the key word. If there were coercive evidence we would no longer be free to shape our own destiny.

Let us hope you have the truer form of this…certainly I do not wish to be the one to cynically debate away such concepts…

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Atheist here.

I love catholics, I have close friends in the priesthood and enjoy the community it provides. I think that we live in an age were there are just people who are more concerned with “being right” than getting it right. THey exist in CAtholic and athiest camps. These outspoken people just want to cram their views down your throat and disregard yours. Its quite unattractive

I’ve not heard or read Catholic writers say the kind of vile things about atheist beliefs that atheist writers say about people of faith, as indicated in the quotes above from Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris. Whereas once upon a time atheists had the common sense to keep their more vicious side in check, they now seem to wear viciousness as a badge of honor for their cause.

 

[Jelrak_TB]

“The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.” Richard Dawkins

“The only angels we need invoke are those of our better nature: reason, honesty, and love. The only demons we must fear are those that lurk inside every human mind: ignorance, hatred, greed, and faith, which is surely the devil’s masterpiece.” Sam Harris

Quite.

Yet is it not interesting to consider that even such as these may find themselves in a position to support Christianity under certain circumstances…? Clearly Christianity cannot be so bad after all…?

 

[Bradski]

That is because for the most part they live according to Christian principles which are not limited to Europe but are the basis of the UNDHR and prevalent in most countries throughout the world. They reject Christ but not the core of His teaching.

This is for the most part that they live under principles which coincide with some of those of Christianity. Just like two thirds of the planet.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Quite.

Yet is it not interesting to consider that even such as these may find themselves in a position to support Christianity under certain circumstances…? Clearly Christianity cannot be so bad after all…?

What, next to Satanism?

 

[Birdpreacher]

I’ve not heard or read Catholic writers say the kind of vile things about atheist beliefs that atheist writers say about people of faith, as indicated in the quotes above from Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris. Whereas once upon a time atheists had the common sense to keep their more vicious side in check, they now seem to wear viciousness as a badge of honor for their cause.

lol I invite you to check out any fb feed in my family. There are mud slingers on both sides of this. Heck, go to your catholic friends and ask them how they would feel if their daughter or son married an atheist. I’ll sit calmly and wait for the results.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

lol I invite you to check out any fb feed in my family. There are mud slingers on both sides of this. Heck, go to your catholic friends and ask them how they would feel if their daughter or son married an atheist. I’ll sit calmly and wait for the results.

What people think or say to those who agree with them before they say it is not the issue.

The issue is what people say to the world at large as if the world at large needed to hear it.

You don’t hear leaders of the Catholic Church or any other Christian Church publicly condemning or mocking atheism in the way that Richard Dawkins or Same Harris or Christopher Hitchens would publicly mock religious beliefs.

If you’ve heard such public condemnations of atheism by religious leaders, please provide me with several of the more egregious ones. Thank you.

 

[Birdpreacher]

What people think or say to those who agree with them before they say it is not the issue.

The issue is what people say to the world at large as if the world at large needed to hear it.

You don’t hear leaders of the Catholic Church or any other Christian Church publicly condemning or mocking atheism in the way that Richard Dawkins or Same Harris or Christopher Hitchens would publicly mock religious beliefs.

If you’ve heard such public condemnations of atheism by religious leaders, please provide me with several of the more egregious ones. Thank you.

other than to deny the holy spirit = burning in hell?

 

[aclausen]

I’ve not heard or read Catholic writers say the kind of vile things about atheist beliefs that atheist writers say about people of faith, as indicated in the quotes above from Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris. Whereas once upon a time atheists had the common sense to keep their more vicious side in check, they now seem to wear viciousness as a badge of honor for their cause.

According to Archbishop Murphy-O’Connor, I’m not fully human. While he has said more temperate things of atheists and non-believers, that’s a pretty vile statement, the dehumanising of people because they don’t believe in God.

 

[tonyrey]

According to Archbishop Murphy-O’Connor, I’m not fully human. While he has said more temperate things of atheists and non-believers, that’s a pretty vile statement, the dehumanising of people because they don’t believe in God.

Evidence?