Why do some people prefer to be atheists?

[Lou2U]

Ah, Pascal’s Wager. I actually find that to be even worse, that there is a God who would reward people for gambling on Him existing.

I agree with this. I would never believe in a God as a ‘just in case’. It’s insulting to all the people who do truly believe in a God, and I would rather join them because I also believed instead of trying to place the best bet.

Lou

 

[aclausen]

God punishes people for gambling that he doesn’t exist.

The fool in his heart says there is no God.

He has to say it in his heart because it is only a gamble in his head that God does not exist.

Either way, we have to gamble. It is infinitely wiser to gamble on God than against God.

Having gambled on God, we grow to know him better and better, even to the point of discovering in the encounter that he really does exist.

“The heart has reasons reason cannot know.”

Then atheist denies this because he has no heart or hope in God.

I’m not trying to deny anything. I simply see no reason to accept the existence of God. If I’m wrong, and he’s the kind of god you described, then I guess I’ll pay for eternity for not believing. If I’m right, well, then, I’m dead, and it won’t matter much. I’m not simply going to gamble on God’s existence as a coin toss.

He’d rather gamble on death and nothingness, as if that made a lot of sense.

I have this life. I have no expectation that it will last any longer than the final firing of neurons in my brain. But what of it? That to me makes life very precious indeed, an unlikely and brief period of existence.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

I agree with this. I would never believe in a God as a ‘just in case’. It’s insulting to all the people who do truly believe in a God, and I would rather join them because I also believed instead of trying to place the best bet.

Lou

Belief for an atheist has to begin with tiny steps un til you are able to make the long strides.

Gambling on God for the atheist is a tiny step; not the destination, but the opening of the heart’s door to let God in.

That’s how conversion works. You don’t just go from absolute disbelief to absolute belief in the wink of an eye.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

I’m not trying to deny anything. I simply see no reason to accept the existence of God. If I’m wrong, and he’s the kind of god you described, then I guess I’ll pay for eternity for not believing. If I’m right, well, then, I’m dead, and it won’t matter much. I’m not simply going to gamble on God’s existence as a coin toss.

I have this life. I have no expectation that it will last any longer than the final firing of neurons in my brain. But what of it? That to me makes life very precious indeed, an unlikely and brief period of existence.

When you arrive at the hour of your death, I hope you are singing a different hymn.

Go to go. Have a great day.

 

[aclausen]

Belief for an atheist has to begin with tiny steps un til you are able to make the long strides.

Gambling on God for the atheist is a tiny step; not the destination, but the opening of the heart’s door to let God in.

That’s how conversion works. You don’t just go from absolute disbelief to absolute belief in the wink of an eye.

But then you would have to convince me why I should. As I’ve stated elsewhere, I can’t see why God needs to exist, and further that if He exists, why I should worship him, or indeed, if there is a God, that Christianity is in fact accurately reporting His wishes.

And, believe it or not, I wasn’t always an atheist, and didn’t really cross that threshold until my late teens or early 20s. I did start having significant reservations about my particular sect’s (not Catholic, to be clear) theological claims in third grade. It just took another decade or so to gain the intellectual tools to understand and express my growing skepticism.

And I’m not even now some hardened Dawkins-esque Uber Atheist who believes all religious people are deluded. I’m not a member of any humanist organization, and frankly find most of the atheists I know to be, well, thin-skinned, rude, and frequently invoking what I view to be fairly infantile anti-theistic arguments.

 

[Lou2U]

Belief for an atheist has to begin with tiny steps un til you are able to make the long strides.

Gambling on God for the atheist is a tiny step; not the destination, but the opening of the heart’s door to let God in.

That’s how conversion works. You don’t just go from absolute disbelief to absolute belief in the wink of an eye.

I know that, but telling me to pick the best bet isn’t going to endear me to believe. And then, of course, we go through ‘which God is the best for me to pick’ ect, and you’ll tell me the Catholic one

I do not absolutely disbelieve in a God. I believe that there could be something we would call a God, or a creator. However, I can’t find myself ever believing in God as described by Christianity, or Islam, or any other religion. I don’t believe that gambling on a God is a tiny step at all.

Lou

 

[Maximus_Power]

No one is able to come to me, unless the Father who sent me wills it to be so. John :6 something

You can’t believe in God without a) having the grace to do so or b) praying for the grace to do so

You see no evidence. I see overwhelming evidence.

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

Yes, faith in God or faith in nothingness.

Which is more worthy of faith?

Is there a need for faith? I suppose there is for most people but I (and presumably most atheist/agnostics) don’t feel such a need. Also, there are easy more than just those two options, so much so that odds are one chooses the “wrong” faith assuming any of them are true.

 

[aclausen]

No one is able to come to me, unless the Father who sent me wills it to be so. John :6 something

You can’t believe in God without a) having the grace to do so or b) praying for the grace to do so

You see no evidence. I see overwhelming evidence.

I guess my chief problem here is that to even want to pray for grace means at least having to accept there is some purpose in doing so. The minute I did that, I would cease to be an atheist, and would already be some distance down the road to having convinced myself that there is a God. There’s a circularity to all of it; in that to believe in God, you have to start by believing in God.

 

[Maximus_Power]

Is there a need for faith? I suppose there is for most people but I (and presumably most atheist/agnostics) don’t feel such a need. Also, there are easy more than just those two options, so much so that odds are one chooses the “wrong” faith assuming any of them are true.

Let me help you narrow it down.

View is different from a historical fact. Reason alone tell me that Jesus’s divinity is a possibility because of the historical persecution of his followers.

You can’t trace Allah’s foot prints
You can’t find any of the Hindu Gods in recorded history.

Hence I have every reason to be skeptical of them. I can’t be skeptical of Atilla the Hun anymore than Jesus

If the supernatural exists than reason tells me Christ is the best and most logical candidate for God.

 

[Maximus_Power]

I guess my chief problem here is that to even want to pray for grace means at least having to accept there is some purpose in doing so. The minute I did that, I would cease to be an atheist, and would already be some distance down the road to having convinced myself that there is a God. There’s a circularity to all of it; in that to believe in God, you have to start by believing in God.

This is true if you don’t already have the grace. I inherited the grace from my Baptism, so returning to the faith after a brush of agnosticism was possible.

I’m sorry, it must be hard being on the outside looking in.

 

[aclausen]

Let me help you narrow it down.

View is different from a historical fact. Reason alone tell me that Jesus’s divinity is a possibility because of the historical persecution of his followers.

You can’t trace Allah’s foot prints
You can’t find any of the Hindu Gods in recorded history.

Hence I have every reason to be skeptical of them. I can’t be skeptical of Atilla the Hun anymore than Jesus

If the supernatural exists than reason tells me Christ is the best and most logical candidate for God.

One can accept Jesus’s existence without thinking he actually performed any miracles, much as one can accept Constantine’s existence without believing he saw a cross in the sky, or Kim Jung-Il’s existence without having to believe he actually found a cure to AIDS.

As to persecution of Jesus’ followers, well, lots of people in many different times have been persecuted for their beliefs. I’d tell you to ask all the Arians or Cathars, but, unfortunately, they were wiped out.

 

[aclausen]

This is true if you don’t already have the grace. I inherited the grace from my Baptism, so returning to the faith after a brush of agnosticism was possible.

I’m sorry, it must be hard being on the outside looking in.

No harder than being on the inside looking out, I would imagine.

 

[Solmyr]

Your notion of God is defective because you don’t take into account free will. If you are compelled to be an atheist your scheme of things is worthless because you are no more than a biological computer programmed by events beyond its control. There is no guarantee that your programming is superior to a theist’s.

We have a very limited “free will” - if at all. I did not VOLITIONALLY choose to be an atheist, it was the lack of evidence that CONVINCED me that it is the only rational position. Maybe we have “free will”, maybe not. There is no way to prove one way or another. We assume that we have a certain amount of freedom. But that freedom is VERY limited. It certainly does not include our subconscious decisions.

 

[Maximus_Power]

One can accept Jesus’s existence without thinking he actually performed any miracles, much as one can accept Constantine’s existence without believing he saw a cross in the sky, or Kim Jung-Il’s existence without having to believe he actually found a cure to AIDS.

As to persecution of Jesus’ followers, well, lots of people in many different times have been persecuted for their beliefs. I’d tell you to ask all the Arians or Cathars, but, unfortunately, they were wiped out.

You’re absolutely right. As I said you first would have to believe in the supernatural before you could make a reasoned informed choice about what religion is the correct one.

 

[Maximus_Power]

No harder than being on the inside looking out, I would imagine.

On the contrary. I found it far more difficult to be Agnostic than Catholic. Sure you had the pleasures of this world, but to always have the possibility of Hell, and to know that death is stalking you every waking second of every day was the ultimate thorn in the side.

I’m 29 years old and fully ready for death. You can’t imagine how comforting that is.

 

[aclausen]

On the contrary. I found it far more difficult to be Agnostic than Catholic. Sure you had the pleasures of this world, but to always have the possibility of Hell, and to know that death is stalking you every waking second of every day was the ultimate thorn in the side.

I’m 29 years old and fully ready for death. You can’t imagine how comforting that is.

Honestly, I don’t spend my days and nights worrying about death. It will come when it will come, hopefully later rather than sooner, but eventually. I take comfort in the days I have, when I need to take any comfort at all.

 

[Maximus_Power]

Honestly, I don’t spend my days and nights worrying about death. It will come when it will come, hopefully later rather than sooner, but eventually. I take comfort in the days I have, when I need to take any comfort at all.

I thought it was native to the philosophy. Perhaps the grace of my Baptism was just nagging at me.

 

[tonyrey]

We have a very limited “free will” - if at all. I did not VOLITIONALLY choose to be an atheist, it was the lack of evidence that CONVINCED me that it is the only rational position. Maybe we have “free will”, maybe not. There is no way to prove one way or another. We assume that we have a certain amount of freedom. But that freedom is VERY limited. It certainly does not include our subconscious decisions.

If you didn’t choose to be an atheist you weren’t responsible for “your” decision. It was thrust upon you and you’re not justified in claiming it as yours. You just happened to be a cog in the machine of nature and your atheism has no rational foundation… There is no guarantee that it wasn’t the result of the way you have been conditioned by living in a secular society dominated by materialist propaganda and by your subconscious desire to be independent of a higher authority…

 

[tonyrey]

Let me help you narrow it down.

View is different from a historical fact. Reason alone tell me that Jesus’s divinity is a possibility because of the historical persecution of his followers.

You can’t trace Allah’s foot prints
You can’t find any of the Hindu Gods in recorded history.

Hence I have every reason to be skeptical of them. I can’t be skeptical of Atilla the Hun anymore than Jesus

If the supernatural exists than reason tells me Christ is the best and most logical candidate for God.

Endorsed by the fact that human rights are based on Christ’s teaching that we all have the same Father in heaven and should treat everyone as our brothers and sisters. There is no other rational basis for the principles of liberty, equality and, above all, fraternity. We would be related solely by an accident of birth and have no moral obligations whatsoever. If only matter exists nothing matters!