Why do you need a recent copy of your baptismal certificate?

[jay_ar31]

Hi,

I noticed that one of the documents that you need to prepare for your marriage is a recent-copy (six months I believe) of your baptism certificate? Why is that? What’s wrong with the one that you had at the time you were baptized? Also, is it an actual rule of the Church, or is just something particular to certain parishes?

 

[Gorgias]

Hi,

I noticed that one of the documents that you need to prepare for your marriage is a recent-copy (six months I believe) of your baptism certificate? Why is that? What’s wrong with the one that you had at the time you were baptized? Also, is it an actual rule of the Church, or is just something particular to certain parishes?

It’s an actual rule.

And, it’s not a ‘baptismal certificate’, so to speak. It’s an extract from the baptismal register at the parish where you were baptized.

As part of the process of marital preparation, the priest (or deacon) who is working with you needs documentation of the fact that you’re a baptized Catholic and that you’re free to marry. The extract lists not only the date and place of your baptism, but also all the other sacraments you’ve received. After you get married, the parish where you were married sends a notification of your marriage to the place you were baptized, and they make a notation in their baptismal register on your record.

So, if you were previously married, then that notation would already exist in your baptismal record. (That’s why they need a recent copy – the certificate your folks received when you were baptized (as an infant, usually, right?) wouldn’t show you were married as a baby, right? )

Hope this helps – let me know if you need some more clarification…

 

[Usige]

To follow on Gorgias answer, it is to make sure you haven’t been married in the Church last couple months or if you have received a declaration of nullity that it is noted and you are free to marry. It would be clearer if it was just called a sacramental record extract rather than baptismal certificate with notations.

 

[Luz_Maria]

What then happens if the records for the Sacraments of Initiation are in a communist country? Does the Church in “the free world” exchange this information (Marriage, etc.) with the Persecuted Church? Is there a “Diplomatic Church Pouch” to obtain these? How does one acquire those records from such a country? What if there is no one who knows the church where a person was Baptized or the exact date?

I would love to know the answers to the above questions. Thank you!

Luz Maria

 

[Corki]

What then happens if the records for the Sacraments of Initiation are in a communist country? Does the Church in “the free world” exchange this information (Marriage, etc.) with the Persecuted Church? Is there a “Diplomatic Church Pouch” to obtain these? How does one acquire those records from such a country? What if there is no one who knows the church where a person was Baptized or the exact date?

I would love to know the answers to the above questions. Thank you!

Luz Maria

You should speak to your priest about this. It would be a situation that would be dealt with on a case-by-case basis depending on many facts (i.e. is it China or Cuba? - very different reality for Catholics in one vs. the other).

 

[Gorgias]

What then happens if the records for the Sacraments of Initiation are in a communist country? Does the Church in “the free world” exchange this information (Marriage, etc.) with the Persecuted Church? Is there a “Diplomatic Church Pouch” to obtain these? How does one acquire those records from such a country? What if there is no one who knows the church where a person was Baptized or the exact date?

It presents a particular problem, to be sure. No, there are no ‘diplomatic pouches’ for this purpose. If the records are unavailable, then they’re just unavailable, and there’s not much one can do about it.

In that case, the Church would seek affidavits from those who were present at the baptism, attesting that it took place. If no one were able to attest to the baptism, and there is uncertainty that the baptism actually took place, then a ‘conditional baptism’ might be in order (but that’s a very rare occurrence – the Church doesn’t want people to think that there can be multiple baptisms for a person).

Corki is correct – it’s really necessary for a person in this situation to speak to his parish priest. The priest should know how to handle the situation (or have the insight to ask for help from the diocese).

 

[jay_ar31]

Thanks for your answers Gorgias and Usige! Much appreciated.

 

[Vico]

Hi,

I noticed that one of the documents that you need to prepare for your marriage is a recent-copy (six months I believe) of your baptism certificate? Why is that? What’s wrong with the one that you had at the time you were baptized? Also, is it an actual rule of the Church, or is just something particular to certain parishes?

Canon Law (Latin)

Can. 535
§1. Each parish is to have parochial registers, that is, those of baptisms, marriages, deaths, and others as prescribed by the conference of bishops or the diocesan bishop. The pastor is to see to it that these registers are accurately inscribed and carefully preserved.
§2. In the baptismal register are also to be noted confirmation and those things which pertain to the canonical status of the Christian faithful by reason of marriage, without prejudice to the prescript of can. 1133, of adoption, of the reception of sacred orders, of perpetual profession made in a religious institute, and of change of rite. These notations are always to be noted on a baptismal certificate.
§3. Each parish is to have its own seal. Documents regarding the canonical status of the Christian faithful and all acts which can have juridic importance are to be signed by the pastor or his delegate and sealed with the parochial seal.
…

 

[Phemie]

Canon Law (Latin)

Can. 535
§1. Each parish is to have parochial registers, that is, those of baptisms, marriages, deaths, and others as prescribed by the conference of bishops or the diocesan bishop. The pastor is to see to it that these registers are accurately inscribed and carefully preserved.
§2. In the baptismal register are also to be noted confirmation and those things which pertain to the canonical status of the Christian faithful by reason of marriage, without prejudice to the prescript of can. 1133, of adoption, of the reception of sacred orders, of perpetual profession made in a religious institute, and of change of rite. These notations are always to be noted on a baptismal certificate.
§3. Each parish is to have its own seal. Documents regarding the canonical status of the Christian faithful and all acts which can have juridic importance are to be signed by the pastor or his delegate and sealed with the parochial seal.

Would that that were taken seriously. I realized, after having issued certificates for a few years, that parishioners’ other sacraments were not recorded in the baptismal register unless they were celebrated in another parish. That meant that each time someone requested a certificate of Baptism I had to go look through all the different registers to see if they’d also been confirmed or married.

 

[Usige]

[/INDENT] Would that that were taken seriously. I realized, after having issued certificates for a few years, that parishioners’ other sacraments were not recorded in the baptismal register unless they were celebrated in another parish. That meant that each time someone requested a certificate of Baptism I had to go look through all the different registers to see if they’d also been confirmed or married.

That is unfortunately true. Neither my wife nor I have notation of our marriage in our records. Since we were both converts after marriage the parishes simply don’t see it as required to include the proper notation. As far as they are concerned if it’s not in a Catholic marriage register it doesn’t go in the baptismal notations.

 

[Casilda]

Hi,

I noticed that one of the documents that you need to prepare for your marriage is a recent-copy (six months I believe) of your baptism certificate? Why is that? What’s wrong with the one that you had at the time you were baptized? Also, is it an actual rule of the Church, or is just something particular to certain parishes?

The way this ‘rule’ is implemented by poorly trained church staff is atrocious. I was told my original baptismal certificate was worthless. The reason for a recent certified copy is to see if there are any previous marriages listed, but that is a moot point, because I had been married for over 30 years and that marriage is not listed there. Also, if you get the certified certificate and it lapsed prior to the time your convalidation (marriage?) is to occur, it also becomes invalid. We all know the whole process can take years so many certified, valid for 6 months only, certificates may need to be issued, and maybe that’s the reason some parishes have started charging for the copies.

Another thing they don’t tell you, you can’t just call your baptismal church or write them for a copy, the parish requesting the information from you has to order it.

 

[Corki]

The way this ‘rule’ is implemented by poorly trained church staff is atrocious. I was told my original baptismal certificate was worthless. The reason for a recent certified copy is to see if there are any previous marriages listed, but that is a moot point, because I had been married for over 30 years and that marriage is not listed there. Also, if you get the certified certificate and it lapsed prior to the time your convalidation (marriage?) is to occur, it also becomes invalid. We all know the whole process can take years so many certified, valid for 6 months only, certificates may need to be issued, and maybe that’s the reason some parishes have started charging for the copies.

Another thing they don’t tell you, you can’t just call your baptismal church or write them for a copy, the parish requesting the information from you has to order it.

To the bolded, that is not a blanket rule. I have had to get the Baptismal certificates from a variety of parishes for various reasons including marriage and registering my kids in Catholic schools. The request was always by me and over the phone or by fax. The parish requesting was never involved. I do Sacrament prep now and all of our parents request certificates themselves. We have never (in 12 years) been asked to do the requesting on their behalf.

 

[Vico]

[/indent]Would that that were taken seriously. I realized, after having issued certificates for a few years, that parishioners’ other sacraments were not recorded in the baptismal register unless they were celebrated in another parish. That meant that each time someone requested a certificate of Baptism I had to go look through all the different registers to see if they’d also been confirmed or married.

The pastors have the responsibility, but they do not always fulfill it.

 

[Phemie]

The way this ‘rule’ is implemented by poorly trained church staff is atrocious. I was told my original baptismal certificate was worthless. The reason for a recent certified copy is to see if there are any previous marriages listed, but that is a moot point, because I had been married for over 30 years and that marriage is not listed there. Also, if you get the certified certificate and it lapsed prior to the time your convalidation (marriage?) is to occur, it also becomes invalid. We all know the whole process can take years so many certified, valid for 6 months only, certificates may need to be issued, and maybe that’s the reason some parishes have started charging for the copies.

Not sure I understand what you’re saying about the marriage. Were you married in the Church? Or were you having your marriage convalidated? If it was a convalidation they still had to be sure that you had no other marriage in your past.

Another thing they don’t tell you, you can’t just call your baptismal church or write them for a copy, the parish requesting the information from you has to order it.

That depends on the parish. We take phone call and mail requests and mail out the certificates to the person unless they ask to have it sent directly to the other parish.

 

[jilly4ski]

Not sure I understand what you’re saying about the marriage. Were you married in the Church? Or were you having your marriage convalidated? If it was a convalidation they still had to be sure that you had no other marriage in your past.

That depends on the parish. We take phone call and mail requests and mail out the certificates to the person unless they ask to have it sent directly to the other parish.

I was wondering, don’t the faithful have a “right” to their records? I thought I remembered something like that, though I cannot find the reference now.

 

[Phemie]

I was wondering, don’t the faithful have a “right” to their records? I thought I remembered something like that, though I cannot find the reference now.

I think some parishes won’t respond to a mail or phone request because they have no way to be sure that the person phoning or mailing is in fact the person whose records are being requested. It’s a matter of privacy.

 

[Elizium23]

And, it’s not a ‘baptismal certificate’, so to speak. It’s an extract from the baptismal register at the parish where you were baptized.

My parish issues two types of documents. One is an “official record” of a sacrament, and the other is a sacramental certificate. The former is simply printed on plain paper, signed by the pastor, and affixed with the parish seal impressed into the page itself. We do not charge for these records, and they are often sufficient for inter-parish inquiries. The sacramental certificates we issue are a different animal. They are printed on special paper, and a gold sticker is affixed where the seal is added. They are decorated with appropriate graphics, in a formal font, and also signed by the pastor. There is a nominal charge for these, simply because the materials used are not free. They are “duplicates” in a strict sense, but we do also issue “originals” that are indistinguishable when someone actually has a sacrament performed in the parish. Official records are not always acceptable documentation, for example a pre-marital investigation would require the full sacramental certificate.

 

[Gorgias]

Official records are not always acceptable documentation, for example a pre-marital investigation would require the full sacramental certificate.

Actually, an ‘official record’ – with the notations that are in the register, and with a priest’s signature and the parish seal – would be sufficient. There’s no need for fancy paper or gold seals in order for the document to be official.

 

[Vico]

[/indent]Would that that were taken seriously. I realized, after having issued certificates for a few years, that parishioners’ other sacraments were not recorded in the baptismal register unless they were celebrated in another parish. That meant that each time someone requested a certificate of Baptism I had to go look through all the different registers to see if they’d also been confirmed or married.

When I requested my records from my baptismal parish, the notation on it was that I was confirmed there. I remembered that I was confirmed in a different parish than my baptism. I requested a confirmation record from that parish and received it. I still do not know if the baptismal parish record keeper made a mistake transcribing to a certificate, or if the confirmation record is wrong in their book.

It’s conceivable that a person receives baptism, confirmation or profession of faith, matrimony or convalidation or holy orders or perpetual profession in religious institute, change of ritual church or , all in different parishes, and that notifications are not sent to the baptismal parish or that those are not properly noted there.

From the canon law I see that there are four mandatory registers for a parish (or equivalent, such as a mission): Baptismal, Confirmation, Marriage, and Death.

There are episcopal records also for ordination.

I read in one publication that optional registers are for first communion and sick calls and rituals (e.g. Book of the Elect).

 

[Gorgias]

I was told my original baptismal certificate was worthless.

It’s not “worthless”, it just isn’t able to be used for the purposes for which you wished it to be.

The reason for a recent certified copy is to see if there are any previous marriages listed, but that is a moot point, because I had been married for over 30 years and that marriage is not listed there.

It may have been ‘moot’ in your case, but that’s one of the reasons it’s requested. Are you saying that your marriage was a Church marriage, but it was nevertheless not recorded? That’s a failure on the part of either the parish where you were married or the parish where your records are kept.

Also, if you get the certified certificate and it lapsed prior to the time your convalidation (marriage?) is to occur, it also becomes invalid. We all know the whole process can take years so many certified, valid for 6 months only,

I was taught that the extract had to have been issued within six months of the date of the wedding prep meeting between the couple and the priest/deacon who would be performing the validation. Certainly, if we’re talking about a period of time greater than six months, then that’s sufficient time for another marriage to have taken place in the meantime. Without asking for a recent extract, your priest/deacon might be at risk of marrying a person who was not free to marry.

Another thing they don’t tell you, you can’t just call your baptismal church or write them for a copy, the parish requesting the information from you has to order it.

I’ve heard it the other way around: it’s not so much who asks for it as it is who receives it. Some priests prefer that it be sent directly to them at their parish office.