Why does it seem like even Catholic and Christian girls are shallow?

[benjammin]

I agree with this. I was going to say that the OP sounds depressed. I would look into that. A counselor/meds might help with motivation and learning more about yourself.

Look i’ve done meds ever since I was a kid. They thought I had ADD so I was put on stuff. It worked, but it didn’t feel like me. I don’t want to be someone who has to take meds just to be normal. Depression is all a mind thing anyway. I can overcome it. Medicine just numbs the pain and basically makes you a slave. I want to feel normal on my own with the only help coming from God.

 

[Lucky7]

Look i’ve done meds ever since I was a kid. They thought I had ADD so I was put on stuff. It worked, but it didn’t feel like me. I don’t want to be someone who has to take meds just to be normal. Depression is all a mind thing anyway. I can overcome it. Medicine just numbs the pain and basically makes you a slave. I want to feel normal on my own with the only help coming from God.

I’ve come to the conclusion that anything anyone says is not good enough for you or you take it personally. Is it possible that that is what these women sense?

 

[Angelsflight]

Look i’ve done meds ever since I was a kid. They thought I had ADD so I was put on stuff. It worked, but it didn’t feel like me. I don’t want to be someone who has to take meds just to be normal. Depression is all a mind thing anyway. I can overcome it. Medicine just numbs the pain and basically makes you a slave. I want to feel normal on my own with the only help coming from God.

Some meds can help…sometimes depression can be the result of a chemical imbalance, and then meds can do wonders. It just depends on the situation, and it doesnt have to be that you are on them forever. Cant hurt to check with a doctor about.

And if you work nights, that can take its toll too. I have worked nights for 10 years and it does put a strain on friendships and relationships, especially if your friends and family work normal hours. It can get lonely sometimes.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

Look i’ve done meds ever since I was a kid. They thought I had ADD so I was put on stuff. It worked, but it didn’t feel like me. I don’t want to be someone who has to take meds just to be normal. Depression is all a mind thing anyway. I can overcome it. Medicine just numbs the pain and basically makes you a slave. I want to feel normal on my own with the only help coming from God.

Look, I hear ya. I don’t want to be on meds either, but depression is a progressive disease and left untreated can be fatal. (Look at the suicide rate.) It took them years of tinkering to get my meds right. Most of the common ones that are prescribed today (SSRIs and SNRIs) make me extremely tired and I am unable to stay awake for more than 2-4 hours a day. I had to try so many before finding one that worked. Unfortunately that drug increased my anxiety, which had already been a lifelong struggle. So then we had to play the medicine game with that and after several tries they found that benzos work well for me.

It is absolutely not all in the mind. It is caused by very real chemical issues that can’t be overcome without help anymore than diabetes can.

 

[NSFrame]

I haven’t read through all of the responses but…

I can say that 99% of attractiveness is grooming and personal presentation/confidence. Are you dressed nicely, are you a gentleman, is your facial hair neat and clean, do you have a normal-guy hairdo, are your glasses stylish, can you joke around and make small talk with a woman knowing that there’s a 99.9% chance she is not your future girlfriend? Do you have a solid future - even if your job is still entry-level, are you clearly working towards promotions, graduate school, etc.?

As a somewhat attractive young woman in high school and college, I used to get attention from all sides - cool, cute, not cool, not cute, neither cool nor cute, both cool and cute, etc. I was pretty focused on what I was looking for because I was looking for a future husband who I could be proud of. Someone who treated me right, who worked hard, who would be a caring dad, who would be a fun companion in life’s events. If someone comes off as not confident or overly quirky or oblivious to what’s going on around him then you lose confidence in that person as a future mate.

 

[chevalier]

To be fair, it’s a phenomenon more easily seen with Western women. That said, it is best to avoid women who hate conflict resolution because any advice which even hints of conflict resolution is the real kiss of death.

Conflict resolution is generally a difficult subject with people nowadays, although I make no claim to know for sure how good or bad it was before.

What you need is the ability to negotiate and someone to negotiate with. It helps when neither party is bound by limitations arising from preconceptions, such as the typical presumed 50/50 split, i.e. value sharing, as opposed to value creation. We gotta strive for win-win, not a lose-lose or even tie-tie. And put our creativity to work. Humans are supposed to be an ingenious species. As a lawyer I’ve got one thing to say: mediation > suit. Get rid of the boundaries, think outside the box, your solutions will be better.

While at it, however, I’d like to say I’ve met some women I’ve thought at bit too combative or confrontational. I’d say adversarial, perhaps. It’s not like they desired to fight you, they just seemed to have an adversarial bone, kinda “programmed” like that. Everybody has some of it, just gotta challenge it until it’s reforged into a desire and ability to create win-wins for the elevation of mankind. Erm.

Also, an average looking woman can appeal to a man more than a much more physically beautiful woman if she has a certain personality that is really appealing, and knows how to seductively talk to the guy.

Vanity of vanities! Don’t confuse process with matter. All charm of form goes poof after a while. It just goes off when the fireworks are gone. On the other hand, personality is a substantive thing.

I sort of try to avoid non-substantive devices. I’ve seen women change mind enough to prefer something more stable. Plus, if you create mutual attraction without verifying actual, substantive compatibility, you can end up having a relationship when the desire takes over and leads you to a lasting decision, while the relationship won’t have the basis to make it work.

I know most women find me boring, but for heavens sake i’ll never treat them like **** or be mean, but i’m not a wash cloth who does whatever they want. I stand up for myself. I just don’t understand. Also, its not like i haven’t tried to lose weight. I played rugby for a year, lost a little weight. I didn’t get anymore attention. I try to go out and be social I get scared because the times I do try I get rejected. I almost feel like i’m cursed.

Reminds me of myself, Ben. I was there a couple of years ago. Not many, actually. You need to stop trying to work women out and discover why they don’t want you or avenge yourself by finding a flaw in them on their reasoning or motivation to disprove the merits of the perceived rejection, which you may see as a judgement of yourself. I’m sorry for this language, but it’s hard to switch to normal after reading and writing law stuff all day long, so bear with me.

So, you disprove the judgement and undercut the rejection by showing your mettle. You do so at work or school, by studying hard and earning good grades, getting a job and doing it well. If these sound like fleeting things, then even better: you just do your job well, whatever it is, and help others. That’s where the external measure of your worth is (the internal one is in your relationship with God). That’s more objective than the details of your lack of luck with women.

I’m only recommending a way I’ve made myself. Doing meaningful work and lots of it has the lovely effect of putting my women woes in good perspective. In short, they don’t get (much) more attention than they really deserve. And I don’t need a girl for validation.

Plus, while I may’ve been less than kind to you in previous posts, I was really serious and it was also a way I had made myself, when I spoke about realising that women have their right to pick and even a right to pick wrong. It’s like freedom of speech: you may very well not like the result and in fact many people say idiotic things, but you respect the right itself. As the right sinks in, you just take it as a fact of life, and you move on. Same with this. I feel much happier after realising that this issue does involve an individual’s freedom to select his (or her; everybody is a he grammatically, of course) own marriage partner or relationship partner. A right that would deserve every measure of protection in every court. So I had to uphold it in my own mind too. And life became easier from that point. Maybe you should try. If the women you’re after don’t want to choose you, there’s a heckload of things you can do in life to make it worthwhile (and not only for yourself but also for others). Don’t let the lack of a girlfriend or even wife stop you from all that.

And you aren’t cursed. Everybody has a field where he isn’t particularly successful. Great leaders, thinkers and other great people have areas of lack of success, or even embarrassing flaws too. A while ago I realised that if my lack of luck with women were to become epic, I might as well secure the movie rights. That, and just accept it with a dose of sense of humour.

 

[chevalier]

23 and tired of seeing most of my friends get married and have lives while I just can’t get anywhere. I know there is the whole “get a wife, get a life thing”. I understand that, but i’ve never had any measurable experience in dating other than a few first dates that fizzled and one that only lasted 3 dates. I’m worried I won’t know what to do. One of the big things my mom said about being married late is that my father never really knew how to act like a married man. Not that he cheated or drank or anything, but sometimes he could be thoughtless in some things like coming home late from work and not calling.I don’t want to be that guy. I feel like people who get married late are to set in their ways and it leads to a lot of issues. Heck my father always worried my mother would leave him, and she loved him so much.

You’ve got to realise that you aren’t your father and that while you could perhaps try to improve some things in your family line, you aren’t individually responsible for what your dad did wrong… or right, for that matter. You’re your own man. You have flaws your dad doesn’t have and you have some areas where you do better than he did or still does.

Also, being a little thoughtless or forgetting to phone is not a crime. It’s not the caliber of thing that should have you thinking you don’t want to be a “man like that”.
"Luvz2travel:

I beg to differ it depends on the person. Something that can be utterly boring to one person but is endlessly facinating to another. Boad/card/ video games all boring to me to death while reading history or hiking in the woods are interesting but many others can’t be bothered with those. If he wants a girlfriend it’s probably not as hard for him as he thinks there are more devout girls out there than devout guys available he just needs to be more proactive and seek out the type of ladies he’s looking for through group activities as a start or maybe even online where he can list his interests in a profile and connect with people who share those interests.

Actually, there’s another dimension to that: organising and making things happen. For example, I love the woods and I’m sure I’d love hiking. But the thought of me organising it is a lamentable joke. I guess I could introduce someone to the computer world on the other hand, who couldn’t really find a way otherwise. A good thing about interacting with others is that they can introduce us to new things and facilitate some others. Makes life more interesting.

In addition to what I wrote earlier, which I still stand by 100% I would like to add that anger and bitterness about being single are enormous turn-offs. Most women see those traits and desperation as a sign of clinginess at best, abusiveness at worst.

True, and women are touchy about “control”. I guess it’s a reflection of a desire for independence… which some of them take a bit too far (at the cost of the independence of others or of the overall balance of things).

Generally, the sad thing is that to stop despairing one wants to find someone. On the other hand to find someone one needs to stop despairing. Sounds like a vicious circle, doesn’t it? Kinda like you needed to become rich to become a nobleman but you needed to be a nobleman to gain wealth, in a fairy tale world that wasn’t so pretty in all its aspects. Anyway, you’ve got to break out of the circle. Don’t let the trap hold you and dictate your terms. Get out of the trap and play on your own terms. (Some guys did find their way out of the birth & wealth problem in the old day.)

As far as I was concerned he was the most handsome, kind, funny man in the world. I know that he probably wasn’t (he was very cute though) but his personality, kindness, and sense of humor just drew me to him. Everywhere we go he makes people laugh and makes even strangers want to be around us.

Humility does have some relationship to success with women. Cough Where’s my cats?

 

[chevalier]

"TimeEntrance:

This comment seems to logically infer there is a one personality type and a one kind of mind of women. Furthermore, it seems to infer all women are non-boring?

Finally someone talks easy language.

With your sympathy for the category of “woman” you might remember to feel more charitable towards liberal Democrats that sympathize with the category of women on welfare over the working wealthy or with Muslims over Christians.

Take my word on that the conservative ones come with their own problems too.

How exciting is a Church going Catholic girl trying to obtain sainthood? I’m sure she doesn’t even read racy literature and probably avoids horror films or anything not deemed “family oriented” by Opus Dei or Catholic answers. Somehow I don’t see her drinking beer at a bar and riding home on the back of a Harley.

I can easily imagine a sturdy nun having a beer and riding a Harley. Maybe not in a quick succession though, at least on a public road. Last Sunday during the sermon the prison chaplain that’s resident at my parish talked about an eighty year old nun driving a jeep in the jungle to teach children or something (I don’t remember the details).

Plus, a woman can exhibit courage by dating the shy guy no other woman wants.

Better she not date a guy just to show courage or whatever other character she’d like to show. That’s how women get themselves hurt. Men too for the record.

But thats the thing. I’m not a loser. I graduated from college. I played rugby in school. I tried to be social and active but it still didn’t work. Now i’m stuck in middle of nowhere USA where there really is no hope.

Create some!

More to the point, researchers say, those who marry later in life are probably people who were willing to stay unmarried rather than marry the wrong person. That is probably the biggest thing that predicts success in marriage: That is, that you marry someone because you positively wanted to marry that person, and not because you were in a rush to simply “be married like everyone else I know” or were afraid no one else would have you. That attitude is a recipe for preventable disaster.

Marrying begins with dating. You don’t date wrong, you don’t marry wrong. Side-effect is you feel lonely for all the lack of companionship during. On the other hand, you’re spared a ton of bad things that are worse than being single. I’ve not had a girlfriend most of the time in my life, sometimes it felt hard emotionally, but it was way worse when dealing with a relationship that was falling apart or had no future.

I don’t know of many women who meet a guy whose demeanor screams, “This is what you get, so take it or leave it” who are going to find that demeanor attractive.

On the other hand that attitude itself doesn’t strike me as being altogether foreign to the fair sex, you know, EasterJoy.

When you meet a woman, you have to remember that no matter how many times other women have overlooked you or even rejected you, this one hasn’t done that. Even if she has overlooked you in the past, this is another day, a day on which she might wake up and see you differently, the way you really are. If you approach her with an attitude that judges her as “picky” before she’s had a chance to get to know you, she’s never going to get the chance to look past that off-putting exterior. Your complaint will be on your face, and your “good personality” won’t get a chance to show itself.

Yeah, fourteenth Amendment and all.
"TimeEntrance:

Money helps.

Don’t worry, a woman can make any man a millionaire!

He just needs to become a billionaire before he marries her but this is a small detail.

Simply suggesting he’s weak or a poor excuse of a man is not going to help.

Yeah. Your trials generally grow with you, they tend to be proportional. Besides, things tend to seem trivial to people who haven’t experienced them or have so long ago they have all but forgotten by now.

All I can say is to hang in there. You see all your friends getting married. Well, that means less competition for you. And by the time you are about 30, you will be in high demand if you are not married by then.

Allow me to dispel that one. Har har.

 

[chevalier]

Absolutely. It is a good strategy that skips the step of racking up the ex-wife, alimony payment, and children you only get to see every other weekend from your twenties. One of the reasons my relatives waited until their 30s to marry is because they saw how their friends’ marriages were working out…very often not a bowl of cherries. The married twenty-somethings who had unwisely rushed into marriage envied their single friends. Only the ones who had married wisely were happy with their choice, and that wasn’t enough of them.

I knew that all the time along when people commented on my video games. :thankyou:

Well, i guess my counter question would be: why does it seem like even catholic and christian guys say they want a nice girl and end up going for the super model/pretty girls, and then complain to the nice girls that they cant get a good girl? I agree with a previous poster, i have liked some “nice” guys before who only told me how they wished they had a girlfriend, all the while pining for some unattainable and/or mean girl.

The sexes are more alike than most people think. The lure of the unattainable works both ways. But, people can’t change what they’re attracted to. Or rather they can but it’s not a single act of will that effects an abrupt change. It’s more gradual and time-stretched.

Mostly, I remember going to high school dances and seeing all the guys who came stag, talking with each other while standing in front of a blaring speaker, all too afraid to ask somebody to dance,

That’s nothing. I once asked every single girl at the party to dance and got refused every single time.

He knew none of those girls were angling to be his girlfriend next week, and I don’t think he cared. If he did, he didn’t show it. He had enough sense to enjoy the moment, and more power to him.

He’s probably the next governor. On the other hand, it’s better to care and suffer some than to avoid emotional suffering by not caring.

The median age of first marriage is about 28 for guys and about 26 for women.

Seems to be the same way everywhere.

Not all the girls are gone. Some of them haven’t even remotely considered marriage yet, and some of those who have started looking haven’t kissed their share of frogs yet, haven’t gotten over judging by first appearance. The ones wise enough not to judge by first appearance are sometimes wise enough to wait until college is over before they even do any serious looking.

Well, don’t wanna be the spoilsport but the share of those either unable (and sometimes for real, e.g. divorce) or unwilling to commit is quite large. Most of the lists of people tend to show double surnames on the female names. It isn’t that easy to spot one that isn’t married, and from there one that isn’t in a long-term relationship with some guy that’s leading or not to marriage. I guess we oughtta google up some numbers and do the crunching.

Oh, and be glad you’re a guy. Sad to say, but it is easier for a 28 year old man to find a 23 year old bride than the other way around.

Actually, where are the 28 year old females? Early thirties is the typical coming-of-sense bracket.

 

[chevalier]

Oh, and my married older brothers told my unmarried younger brothers this: You are only young once, and young and unmarried and young and married have totally different advantages. Take the advantages of being unmarried while you’re unmarried, and you’ll not have regrets when your only choice is the advantages of being married.

Buy your hunting rifles now, and if you want anything with chrome on it, get it now. Don’t go nuts, but buy those little things that you don’t want to talk someone else into believing mean something special to you. Or if you want camping equipment for the future, buy good stuff now, stuff that’s going to last…or the ski boat that your family will enjoy with you some day, same thing. They didn’t mean to fill your life with stuff and shallow pursuits. They meant that what is a reasonable purchase for a single guy living at home and paying no rent is going to be totally out of the question after marriage.

Time is the issue, too. Why should your job own you? Do you love it that much? If you’re going to get a annual ski pass, now is the time. There isn’t time to ski that much after you get married and start having kids, and forget about the money. Now is the time to hike the Pacific Crest Trail, to skip around Europe living on nothing and staying at youth hostels, to do all those things that don’t take a lot of money but won’t work when you have a hearth to tend and that you might not have the health to do when you have the money again. Now is the time to take a gamble, to try some stuff that might fail, because you’re the only one who’ll go hungry if you lose your job striking out on something new. Now is the time to do the things that you won’t be so willing to gamble on when you have a wife and children to take care of. Now is the time to consider: do I want to be a missionary, or go to live next to the bone to help someone else, or to give a look at the seminary. You won’t have those doors open forever. Learn from your guy friends who have married, and spend time with your guy friends who haven’t done it yet.

+1 on that, forget all those good things when you’ve a got your ball and chain, I mean, ring. Personally, I decided to push for degrees, travel a bit, play some computer games. Wasn’t not worth it, at all.

Easter Joy, Thank you. I do agree 23 is too young to panic, but i’ve never even had a girlfriend. At least if i’d had one relationship i’d know that I could get one. The way it is now i’m worried I won’t know how or what to do. I’ve always been shy. I even asked a few months ago if shyness means I should stay single. Everyone said no, but I feel that its such a huge impediment. thats why I love/hate onlien dating. Approaching is easier, but I still can’t get girls to like me. I even met one in my area on catholic match, and she said we’d be better friends. I don’t get it. Why. whats wrong with me. I’m not saying I wanted to marry her or anything, but what if it came to that? Anyway Thank you. I’m not so much panicking about marriage, but no relationship experience

Sorry to chime in uninvited but the lack of having had a girlfriend before doesn’t matter that much. In fact, the knowledge of your previous serious relationships might be a burden to some women. I still remember how a certain 28 year or something old lady, actually a lawyer turned PR wizard so not someone you would associate with the lack of cunning and guile, reacted to finding out (early! and we actually weren’t a couple, she was a little inconsistent as to her intentions) that I’d had a girlfriend I cared for some 3 years before, who’d left me. She acted like I was married that other lady. That was quite an educational experience. For the record, the heroine was herself freshly out of a big deal of a relationship, to tell you something of how people’s logic works.

At any rate, experience is overrated, and it is a burden. Also, it makes you suffer emotionally. You’re better off if you avoid all of the failed relationships and pick right (and responsibly) the first time and work with what you’ve got. Because then there’s no turning back and thinking what if. Your marriage is exactly what you make of it, under grace. You get what you put in.

Also, LJBF (let’s just be friends) is a natural, common event in the life of a man. Just like hanging was a natural death for a horse thief and stabbing for a mediaeval monarch.

My husband was once very shy and never had a girlfriend. He got a job that required him to talk professionally over the phone with strangers, he got older, and nobody who met him later in life would guess that he was ever shy! Your shyness may be a lifelong trait, but maybe not. At any rate, shy people marry all of the time. It is not uncommon for them to marry other shy people, but if anything the shy people I know who are married are happier than the outgoing ones. They love having somebody they don’t feel shy with, I guess. With shy people, familiarity often seems to breed bliss!!

Same story here. I talk back to black robes but lose my tongue around a woman that activates that soft spot in me. It happens. You can get over shyness. When I was 17 or so, I had to practice speaking for a long while before I even dared lift the phone receiver for fear my voice would fail me and I’d be a scared little stammerer.

I’d suggest you go find some groups to be in so you can have female friends who aren’t girlfriends.

+1. That’s a life-saver in terms of perspective. Reminds me when I set that lawyer turned PR wizard up with my lady friend who worked as a uniformed attorney for the prison service. That was fun.

 

[chevalier]

What if I don’t have any close by friends. To be honest thats what sucks about life right now. I don’t know of any groups to join because i’m in small town midwest where there aren’t these kind of groups. It sucks. I know I can go to bigger towns, or volunteer around here, but most church groups are filled of middle aged and older women and men and the few young people who are involved are married. Most young people are either not involved in the church and frequent the bars too much, or worse are into drugs, or they are like me and feel they have to go somewhere else to find some fun

Can you open a business of some kind? Not as cool as an interesting extracurricular activity but can still be rewarding.

Because as a rule of thumb males only think with their little heads.

A woman who thinks that way doesn’t get far with me. I tend to become crisp and clear when that happens.

I do understand I need to do more, but anymore I don’t feel motivated too because i’m not really good at anything or don’t have the patience. I find myself simply wanting to just come home from my night job and sleep and then watch tv when I don’t substitute teach. I guess I must just be called to single life even though God hasn’t said anything. I know I have a lot going, but maybe i’m just to boring and strange for a gf. I just don’t feel motivated. It doesn’t help I don’t have many friends, let alone single friends.

Distraction, Ben, you need distraction. Anything. Volunteering. Sport. Reading. DIY. Land works. Whatever works. Even things that don’t strictly need doing. The worst thing to have when you don’t have a fair companion by your side and life’s not being easy on you for that, is too much free time. Just make time pass, but meaningfully (without just frittering it away). Experience talking here, many years of.

Nice fairy tale but I’ve been turned down numerous times in my teens to early 20’s asking for dates. No lack of “Cowboying up” either.

Asking for dances with a young woman is akin to interviewing for employment. You’re probably not going to get every job available depending on how appealing you are.

Too appealing or overqualified loses you jobs. It also loses you girls.

Then I ask Brazilian women online if they’ve ever seen this behavior among Brazilian females and I get the reply never to rarely.

Of course… teen pregnancy and unwed mothers in their 20’s is a problem in Brazil too. At least they don’t act like morons though.

Be careful. Other cultures have other problems you might not be aware of. Just saying.

So are you advocating sex tourism? Nasty. Anyway, I don’t want to be one of those losers who goes and gets some submissive wife from another country. Its one thing to happen to meet someone from another country, but I don’t want to be looking for a bride specifially in another country. I always think those kind of guys are wimps and only want a submissive women who will put up with their problems. While I kind of want a woman to put up with me, I want it to be because they love me, not because i’m some american sugar daddy or because they are submissive. I know I need to work on things, but i’m not some loser who needs a male order bride or to go looking for a submissive wife.

+1 on attitude, and I’m very impressed. You’re showing your mettle right now, without knowing. Anyway, actually, you might sometimes want to think outside the box. Not to find a mail order bride and especially not to look for a submissive wife, but to find someone you’re compatible with. For example languages increase the pool of people you can interact with. I’ve always found that very helpful. Besides, learning languages is a nice pastime, teaches you a whole slew of soft skills and widens your job opportunities as a by-effect. Think of all the foreigners who can’t do a thing in the modern world without English.

 

[chevalier]

Besides, nationalities tend to have some bearing on tempers and moods, perhaps through ubpringing and all. Long story short, people act and think differently depending on nation, to same extent (while we’re mostly substantially similar and definitely all equal). Some people find friends or love in different nations from their own. BTDT too.

I know that I personally was not ready for a relationship until I jumped into mixed martial arts. It gave me confidence, it opened up friendships and it honed my physical capabilities. It also was something my wife thought was interesting. Since marrying and having kids I have yet to get back to MMA. I might not ever do it again. But the social skills and self-confidence it gave me have remained even if my fighting skills are quite rusty.

Yeah, all sorts of sports have that effect, even “e-sports”. Jobs do the same. People change radically between college and real work.

As a somewhat attractive young woman in high school and college, I used to get attention from all sides - cool, cute, not cool, not cute, neither cool nor cute, both cool and cute, etc. I was pretty focused on what I was looking for because I was looking for a future husband who I could be proud of. Someone who treated me right, who worked hard, who would be a caring dad, who would be a fun companion in life’s events. If someone comes off as not confident or overly quirky or oblivious to what’s going on around him then you lose confidence in that person as a future mate.

Poor Einstein.

Okay… [/novel]

 

[sojo]

Its been proven that men are a lot more visual in their choice of a mate than women. If one is finding that every, or nearly every woman they meet finds one not acceptable as a mate, than instead of calling all women shallow, one might look at one’s own faults and figure out what about oneself is not attractive. And I don’t mean looks.

For sure, resorting to the, “it can’t be me, it must be ALL of them” is the cowards way out.

I know one extremely unattractive man (physically), somewhat socially awkward to boot, who made many attempts at initiating a relationship with women. A few said, “you are a great guy but not my type.” This smart guy then said, “hey, thanks for that honsety – listen, I’m feeling pretty much at a loss here… if I’m not your type, do you know anyone who might appreciate me and with whom I could click?”

Well darned if several women didn’t set him up with friends and acquaintances they thought were suitable and one of those match-ups did the trick. I never followed the story, but I bet that matchmaker was a brides maid!

 

[TimeEntrance]

So are you advocating sex tourism? Nasty.

No. I was talking about becoming a Columbus. Sailing to new lands so to speak.

Anyway, I don’t want to be one of those losers who goes and gets some submissive wife from another country. Its one thing to happen to meet someone from another country, but I don’t want to be looking for a bride specifially in another country. I always think those kind of guys are wimps and only want a submissive women who will put up with their problems. While I kind of want a woman to put up with me, I want it to be because they love me, not because i’m some american sugar daddy or because they are submissive. I know I need to work on things, but i’m not some loser who needs a male order bride or to go looking for a submissive wife.

I think you have a big stereotype of women in certain nations. Do you even know who or what sex the current President of Brazil is?

A number of Latin American democracies have elected female presidents. There is not a woman in U.S. politics perhaps a comparable to the former President of Chile.

1. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelle_Bachelet

Bachelet won the 2006 presidential election in a runoff, beating center-right businessman and former senator Sebastián Piñera (who eventually succeeded Bachelet as President) with 53.5% of the vote. She campaigned on a platform of continuing Chile’s free-market policies, while increasing social benefits to help reduce the gap between rich and poor.[1]

Bachelet, a pediatrician and epidemiologist with studies in military strategy, served as Health Minister and Defense Minister under her predecessor, President Ricardo Lagos. She is a separated mother of three and describes herself as an agnostic.[2] As well as her native Spanish, she speaks English, German, Portuguese and French, with varying levels of fluency.[3][4]

She is no “submissive woman.” Can you fathom the intelligence of a woman that speaks several languages, studied in and graduated medical school, then went on to study military strategy at formal institutes of learning?

In the case of Brazil you might be surprised to find out the Brazilian population has a higher percentage of it’s professional dentists that are female than the United States. The Catholic Church has been credited - specifically in Brazil - with the rapid increase in female professionals in the country.

Young women from upper-class Brazilian families are typically aristocratic in that they often speak 3, 4, 5 languages and read widely, and the classics, in different languages. Most of them are well traveled through out Europe. There female American peer from the same socio-economic standing typically only speaks English, reads little and if she does it cheap romance literature, and she’s never left the United States.

It is true poverty is so harsh and breaking in Brazil that the more impoverished women will placate to men - or especially European and American men which are seen as rich - than their female peers in the U.S. that are poor.

But bear in mind Brazilian women as a whole have a cultural indoctrination more akin to the famed U.S. Southern Belle.

For the Southern Belle “strength” was not seen in a cursing match or how obnoxious you could be or even dissing shy guys. An attribute of “strength” was actually viewed as being able to get a shy man to talk and to provide good company for him.

In Black-American culture there is a bit of tension between “well bred” black Southern women and just about the whole of all black Northern women. Those kinds of Southern women draw from the Southern Belle tradition and view northern black women as unlady-like and all out loud and obnoxious. I ran into a few of these women when I was down South.

As for Brazil the vast majority (but not all) of the upper-class women (and men) are white.*

**“White” in Brazil is broad in range like “black” in the United States is. Obama’s former black pastor Reverend Wright would be regarded as “white” in Brazil. He’d be both white and moreno.

But by “white” with respects to the Brazilian upper-class I’m talking the phenotype of “white” we Americans understand and speak of as “white.”*

 

[TimeEntrance]

^Addendum to post #114.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_belle

A Southern belle (derived from the French word belle, ‘beautiful’) is an archetype for a young woman of the American Old South’s upper class.

During the period, Kentuckian Sallie Ward of Louisville was the most noted belle in the South, and her portrait, which hangs in the Speed Museum in Louisville, Kentucky, is often called “The Southern Belle.” A Southern belle epitomized Southern hospitality, cultivation of beauty and a flirtatious yet chaste demeanor.

Brazilian women - more especially the Cariocas (those of and from Rio) - aren’t chaste in mannerisms, dress, or I doubt behavior. Especially the faveladas (girls from favelas). They were short, shorts, dress in tight clothing, and dance like “whores.”

But you’ll find a lot more of them that treat men in “kind” fashion the typical American male construes as flirting and wanting him. In Brazilian culture it is just a shallow way of being “nice” though.

Where contemporary, young, American women typically pride themselves on being, what we denote as the 5 letter word that begins with b, the Brazilian woman is culturally indoctrinated to pride herself in what Brazilian call simpatico.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carioca#Stereotypes

According to a survey published in American Scientist Magazine, the cariocas of Rio de Janeiro exhibited great friendliness and tend to offer to help in various situations. A quote from the article states :[1]

“ There is an important word in Brazil: simpático (or carismático). It refers to a range of desirable social qualities - to be friendly, nice, agreeable, and good-natured. A person who is fun to be with and pleasant to deal with… Brazilians, especially the Cariocas of Rio (as citizens here are known), want very much to be seen as simpático. And going out of one’s way to assist strangers is part of this image.

 

[TimeEntrance]

Be careful. Other cultures have other problems you might not be aware of. Just saying.

Yeah, apparently so, the Brazilian wife thing did not have a fairy tale ending for one of my favorite boxers.

1. sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=4323934

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

RIO DE JANEIRO – Police investigating the death of former boxing champion Arturo Gatti are working on the assumption his wife strangled him with her purse strap while he drunkenly slept. The woman’s lawyer, however, insists she is innocent and was too “fragile” to kill a boxer.

Gatti’s 23-year-old Brazilian wife, Amanda Rodrigues, told investigators she awoke Saturday about 6 a.m. to find her husband’s body in the apartment they rented in Porto de Galinhas, a seaside resort in northeastern Pernambuco state.

Rodrigues told police she had a fight with Gatti after dinner Friday night and he pushed her to the ground, resulting in minor injuries to her elbow and chin. Witnesses also reported to police the couple fought and that Gatti was drunk.

Rodrigues told police the 37-year-old former junior welterweight champion then got into a cab with their son and returned to their rented apartment, leaving her alone downtown.

Hey… she’s Benjammin’s age. I guess it’s possible that 23 year old “submissive” can strangle a husband to death. Even a world champion boxer that has taken some of the hardest hits in the business.

1. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arturo_Gatti#Death

The Brazilian authorities initially ruled Gatti’s death a homicide, but after further studies ruled it was a suicide.[21] Yet, almost a year later, in March 2010, the circumstances concerning Gatti’s death remain unclear.[22] All the reports are now at the Quebec coroner’s office awaiting further investigation. Coroner Jean Brochu said, “We’ve been waiting for this for a long time,” and “it’s going to take a while” before conclusions can be made, and released to the public.[22] A shortage of staff at the coroner’s office is being blamed for contributing to the delay of the investigation.[22] Regarding a new toxicology report being prepared, Brochu quipped that it “may take a century to get the results”."[22]

On August 23, 2011, it was reported that private investigators had concluded that Gatti’s death was indeed a homicide.[23]

 

[CatholicRaven]

I’d also like to point out that joining a group, volunteering, etc. are good ways to meet people. And perhaps you need to focus on meeting people, not on meeting single girls. A guy who is interested in people is: 1.) more attractive to women in general, 2.) more likely to see beauty in less-obvious places, and 3.) more likely to make friends who have age-appropriate single sisters, daughters, and nieces, or female cousins, friends, neighbors, or co-workers. If friends know you’re a great guy who happens to be single, they will be willing (and sometimes, eager!) to introduce you to a great gal who also happens to be single. Don’t look at a volunteer opportunity or a club or group and turn it down just because there aren’t any single women there–go because you want to help out and meet some new people in your parish or community!

Women who are looking for a good man tend to be attracted to men who do** not **come across as, “I’m looking for a girlfriend,” but rather a man who seems to enjoy life, and meeting new people, in general. A man who has his own interests, volunteers because he wants to help, and who is courteous to everyone–not just the potential girlfriend–tends to become more attractive to a woman. Even a woman who turns you down flat might develop a romantic interest in you over time, if she has opportunities to see that you really are a good guy to everyone.

And, yes, this applies to women, too.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

True, and women are touchy about “control”. I guess it’s a reflection of a desire for independence… which some of them take a bit too far (at the cost of the independence of others or of the overall balance of things).

Not exactly. I’ve been in 2 abusive relationships and and witnessed female relatives in them too. I’m not talking about a desire for a woman to not give up any autonomy or independence. I’m talking about legitimate control issues, being intimidated and frightened, manipulated in to staying away from friends and family, physically threatened and even hit, and sexual coercion. The men that I have encountered who are abusers have all had the needy, “I really want/need a woman, I really want to love and care for her, and I’m really, really bitter and angry that I don’t have that” thing going on.

That attitude scares the **** out of me and every other woman who has ever been in or witnessed an abusive relationship. The good guys are the ones who treat you like a human being and show kindness and respect. The scary ones see women as a commodity that they deserve.

 

[Crescentinus]

Conflict resolution is generally a difficult subject with people nowadays, although I make no claim to know for sure how good or bad it was before.

What you need is the ability to negotiate and someone to negotiate with. It helps when neither party is bound by limitations arising from preconceptions, such as the typical presumed 50/50 split, i.e. value sharing, as opposed to value creation. We gotta strive for win-win, not a lose-lose or even tie-tie. And put our creativity to work. Humans are supposed to be an ingenious species. As a lawyer I’ve got one thing to say: mediation > suit. Get rid of the boundaries, think outside the box, your solutions will be better.

While at it, however, I’d like to say I’ve met some women I’ve thought at bit too combative or confrontational. I’d say adversarial, perhaps. It’s not like they desired to fight you, they just seemed to have an adversarial bone, kinda “programmed” like that. Everybody has some of it, just gotta challenge it until it’s reforged into a desire and ability to create win-wins for the elevation of mankind. Erm.

In reality, dating women who hate conflict resolution is one of the most idiotic choices. You had just wrecked their arguments for persisting in idiocy.

 

[EasterJoy]

Oh, and my married older brothers told my unmarried younger brothers this: You are only young once, and young and unmarried and young and married have totally different advantages. Take the advantages of being unmarried while you’re unmarried, and you’ll not have regrets when your only choice is the advantages of being married.

Buy your hunting rifles now, and if you want anything with chrome on it, get it now. Don’t go nuts, but buy those little things that you don’t want to talk someone else into believing mean something special to you. Or if you want camping equipment for the future, buy good stuff now, stuff that’s going to last…or the ski boat that your family will enjoy with you some day, same thing. They didn’t mean to fill your life with stuff and shallow pursuits. They meant that what is a reasonable purchase for a single guy living at home and paying no rent is going to be totally out of the question after marriage.

+1 on that, forget all those good things when you’ve a got your ball and chain, I mean, ring. Personally, I decided to push for degrees, travel a bit, play some computer games. Wasn’t not worth it, at all.

Sorry to chime in uninvited but the lack of having had a girlfriend before doesn’t matter that much. In fact, the knowledge of your previous serious relationships might be a burden to some women. I still remember how a certain 28 year or something old lady, actually a lawyer turned PR wizard so not someone you would associate with the lack of cunning and guile, reacted to finding out (early! and we actually weren’t a couple, she was a little inconsistent as to her intentions) that I’d had a girlfriend I cared for some 3 years before, who’d left me. She acted like I was married that other lady. That was quite an educational experience. For the record, the heroine was herself freshly out of a big deal of a relationship, to tell you something of how people’s logic works.

At any rate, experience is overrated, and it is a burden. Also, it makes you suffer emotionally. You’re better off if you avoid all of the failed relationships and pick right (and responsibly) the first time and work with what you’ve got. Because then there’s no turning back and thinking what if. Your marriage is exactly what you make of it, under grace. You get what you put in.

Also, LJBF (let’s just be friends) is a natural, common event in the life of a man. Just like hanging was a natural death for a horse thief and stabbing for a mediaeval monarch.

Same story here. I talk back to black robes but lose my tongue around a woman that activates that soft spot in me. It happens. You can get over shyness. When I was 17 or so, I had to practice speaking for a long while before I even dared lift the phone receiver for fear my voice would fail me and I’d be a scared little stammerer.

+1. That’s a life-saver in terms of perspective. Reminds me when I set that lawyer turned PR wizard up with my lady friend who worked as a uniformed attorney for the prison service. That was fun.

The younger ones weren’t being told not to look for a wife. They were told not to waste the time of not having found yet by ignoring the advantages of still being single. Live the life you have, don’t waste it wishing for the life you don’t have yet, that was the message.

The main thing is to keep making yourself more into someone God can make into what Matthew Kelly calls “the best version of yourself”. In the end, that is what matters: that if God decides to offer you the choice of being a husband, you’ll have the choice of being the best one you can be. In the meantime, be the best unmarried guy you can be, and don’t be afraid to do the good things that your current state in life allows and to enjoy what that offers, too.

If God so clothes the grass of the field, which grows today and is thrown into the oven tomorrow, will he not much more provide for you, O you of little faith? So do not worry and say, ‘What are we to eat?’ or ‘What are we to drink?’ or ‘What are we to wear?’ All these things the pagans seek. Your heavenly Father knows that you need them all. But seek first the kingdom (of God) and his righteousness, and all these things will be given you besides. Do not worry about tomorrow; tomorrow will take care of itself. Sufficient for a day is its own evil.
Matt. 6:30-34

Don’t worry about “will I find a wife?” Like obtaining food, do today what is your duty to do today. Leave what is not yours to do up to God’s concern, and dare to go to sleep each night without a care about it.