Why I am Drifting from Catholicism to Islam

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R_not said:
Good news! Maybe our politicians, and also religious leaders, are ‘getting it’!!

I don’t listen to Swaggart, but many do - and that is great that he is getting it too.

Appeasing has not worked in any country that the muslims have migrated to - in fact, it works to the detriment of the host population. We need to stand up for our laws and ways in our country. We are a great country and a beacon of hope to so many.
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What was your MOS in the Marines?
 
wth1257 said:
that MSA is a puppet regime of the Muslim Brotherhood as are all the agents who work through it, that Muslims are involved in a global conspiracy to trick the West, that there are no nuances in Islam, that Christians are to be slain in Islam, that Islam has been engaged in a perpetual war against the west, that “moderate” Muslims are universally complacent.
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Just clueless.

Perpetual war with Islam.

Muslim:C9B1N33 “The Prophet said: ‘I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and they establish prostration prayer, and pay Zakat. If they do it, their blood and property are protected.’”

But I guess letting Christians live as slaves and treated as second class citizens is ok. Right?

Here is what “moderate” Muslims stand for.

It’s Only a Few…That’s What They Keep Telling us
Those that follow the worldwide problem of Islam, continually hear the popular “it’s only a few” excuse by the Islamic apologists. Well, I beg to differ. Lets finally put that excuse to rest.

If it were only a “few”, then how can these FACTS be explained?

islaminaction08.blogspot.com/2008/05/its-only-fewthats-what-they-keep.html
 
R_not said:
Good news! Maybe our politicians, and also religious leaders, are ‘getting it’!!

I don’t listen to Swaggart, but many do - and that is great that he is getting it too.

Appeasing has not worked in any country that the muslims have migrated to - in fact, it works to the detriment of the host population. We need to stand up for our laws and ways in our country. We are a great country and a beacon of hope to so many.
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Seconded. One can read Mark Steyn’s America Alone, if he wishes to know more.
 
Verisimilitude said:
Try using some of that nuance you spoke about earlier. What they said was Muslims acknowledge the One God. They give no creedence to allah or Mohammed. Big difference.
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thanks.

allah is sooooooooo NOT what the Jews and Christians worship! And mohammed was so disgusting of an individual.

All I got to say is READ to anyone who thinks allah is the same god. THINK for oneself!

bible.ca/islam/islam-moon-god.htm
 
ChristopherL said:
Just clueless.

Perpetual war with Islam.

Muslim:C9B1N33 “The Prophet said: ‘I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and they establish prostration prayer, and pay Zakat. If they do it, their blood and property are protected.’”

But I guess letting Christians live as slaves and treated as second class citizens is ok. Right?

Here is what “moderate” Muslims stand for.

It’s Only a Few…That’s What They Keep Telling us
Those that follow the worldwide problem of Islam, continually hear the popular “it’s only a few” excuse by the Islamic apologists. Well, I beg to differ. Lets finally put that excuse to rest.

If it were only a “few”, then how can these FACTS be explained?

islaminaction08.blogspot.com/2008/05/its-only-fewthats-what-they-keep.html
Click to expand...
That Turkey voted in a party with “Islamic Roots”?
 
ChristopherL said:
No, YOUR interpretation is worth less then 2 cents. You are in a fantasy world.

Here are Christian leaders who have spoken the same as us about Islam.

Rod Parsley,
Despite his call for the U.S. to win the “hearts and minds of the Islamic world,” Sen. John McCain recruited the support of an evangelical minister who describes Islam as “anti-Christ” and Mohammed as “the mouthpiece of a conspiracy of spiritual evil.”

abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4905624&page=1

Pastor Hagee on Islam,
I was greatly blessed by Pastor Hagee’s teachings on Islam wherein he gives an accurate portrayal of the Quran, the injunction of Allah to kill infidels and the devotion of Muslims to be martyrs.

Swaggart Jr on Islam actually sells the book “Because They Hate”.

There are more speaking out against Islam, like the POPE. But I guess you know better.

He said, I quote, ‘Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached.’"
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Am I dreadfully impressed by your embrace of Hagee who considers the Catholic faith to be an abomination - and of young Swaggart who is hardly a firend to Catholicism?. Yes. Dreadfully is the word. As to the Holy Father, you might want to get current. In his address to the bishops of Bangladesh on June 12, 2008, he states:

"In fact, “much good can be accomplished when it is conducted in a spirit of mutual understanding and collaboration in truth and freedom. All men and women have an obligation to seek the truth. When it is found, they are compelled to model their entire lives in accordance with its demands (cf Dignitatis Humanae, 2). Consequently, the most important contribution we can bring to inter-religious dialogue is our knowledge of Jesus of Nazareth.”

Indeed, “[d]ialogue, based on mutual respect and truth, cannot fail to have a positive influence on the social climate of your country. The delicacy of this task requires thorough preparation of clergy and lay people, first of all by offering them a deeper knowledge of their own faith and then by helping them to grow in their understanding of Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism and the other religions present in your region.”"

asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=12498&size=A

One cannot spread a message of love by preaching hate.
 
Catharina, as promised, here you go:

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

You’ve earned it.
 
R_not said:
thanks.

allah is sooooooooo NOT what the Jews and Christians worship! And mohammed was so disgusting of an individual.

All I got to say is READ to anyone who thinks allah is the same god. THINK for oneself!

bible.ca/islam/islam-moon-god.htm
Click to expand...
The Catholic Church does assert in the CCC that Muslims worship “the one God”. Please hear me out.

Here is a long thread on this topic. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=80349

Here is a snippet from Lumen Gentium (similar to passage in catechism)…
  1. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related to the People of God in various ways. There is, first, that people to which the covenants and promises were made, and from which Christ was born according to the flesh (cf. Rom. 9:4-5): in view of the divine choice, they are a people most dear for the sake of the fathers, for the gifts of God are without repentance (cf. Rom. 11:29). But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Moslems: these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.
And Paul stated in Acts 17:23 For passing by, and seeing your idols, I found an altar also, on which was written: To the unknown God. What therefore you worship, without knowing it, that I preach to you

There seem to be two camps on this.
  1. The first follows St. Paul’s lead and says if someone worships one god who they acknowledge to be the All-powerful Creator and since we believe there is indeed only One God, they must also be worshipping The One God. This same camp would say that Muslims are ignorant of the fullness of truth and their image of God is very skewed, but still the One Creator of all.
  2. The second camp looks at the attributes of the professed deity and compares them with the attributes of our God and concludes that they must not be the same.
Who is correct? Only God knows. Do the current Muslims believe they are worshipping the One God Creator of all, the God of Abraham? They do believe so. That is what they profess. From God’s perspective (dare I presume) that may be the God’s way of drawing good (muslims worshipping Him) out of evil (Mohammed inventing the Quran after being visited by, perhaps, a demon calling himself Gabriel). This is an oversimplification, but we do not know the mind of God. We simply don’t know the extent of God’s mercy.

The following was cut and paste from someone else, but I think it sums up nicely.

Again, for clarification. Muslims believe in the creator of this world, which happens to be One. So whoever believes that one creator created this world, is worshipping the only God THEORETICALLY (not theologically). The Church says we worship the same God because Islam is monotheistic, but the Church never says we worship the same God theologically, and the Church never said Muhammad is a prophet from God. Remember, EVEN SATAN believes in the God of Abraham. So if the Church says Muslims worship the God of Abraham, I don’t take it as an agreement on Muhammad being a prophet of God or Islam being truthful, because the Church admits as well that even Satan knows the Only God, the God of Abraham. Muhammed, inspired (perhaps) by satan, hijacked God and invented Islam. This is between God and Muhammed. Current devout Muslims are, in good faith, worshipping a misguided view of the One God.
 
dranzal said:
The Catholic Church does assert in the CCC that Muslims worship “the one God”. Please hear me out.

Here is a long thread on this topic. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=80349

Here is a snippet from Lumen Gentium (similar to passage in catechism)…
  1. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related to the People of God in various ways. There is, first, that people to which the covenants and promises were made, and from which Christ was born according to the flesh (cf. Rom. 9:4-5): in view of the divine choice, they are a people most dear for the sake of the fathers, for the gifts of God are without repentance (cf. Rom. 11:29). But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Moslems: these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.
And Paul stated in Acts 17:23 For passing by, and seeing your idols, I found an altar also, on which was written: To the unknown God. What therefore you worship, without knowing it, that I preach to you

There seem to be two camps on this.
  1. The first follows St. Paul’s lead and says if someone worships one god who they acknowledge to be the All-powerful Creator and since we believe there is indeed only One God, they must also be worshipping The One God. This same camp would say that Muslims are ignorant of the fullness of truth and their image of God is very skewed, but still the One Creator of all.
  2. The second camp looks at the attributes of the professed deity and compares them with the attributes of our God and concludes that they must not be the same.
Who is correct? Only God knows. Do the current Muslims believe they are worshipping the One God Creator of all, the God of Abraham? They do believe so. That is what they profess. From God’s perspective (dare I presume) that may be the God’s way of drawing good (muslims worshipping Him) out of evil (Mohammed inventing the Quran after being visited by, perhaps, a demon calling himself Gabriel). This is an oversimplification, but we do not know the mind of God. We simply don’t know the extent of God’s mercy.

The following was cut and paste from someone else, but I think it sums up nicely.

Again, for clarification. Muslims believe in the creator of this world, which happens to be One. So whoever believes that one creator created this world, is worshipping the only God THEORETICALLY (not theologically). The Church says we worship the same God because Islam is monotheistic, but the Church never says we worship the same God theologically, and the Church never said Muhammad is a prophet from God. Remember, EVEN SATAN believes in the God of Abraham. So if the Church says Muslims worship the God of Abraham, I don’t take it as an agreement on Muhammad being a prophet of God or Islam being truthful, because the Church admits as well that even Satan knows the Only God, the God of Abraham. Muhammed, inspired (perhaps) by satan, hijacked God and invented Islam. This is between God and Muhammed. Current devout Muslims are, in good faith, worshipping a misguided view of the One God.
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👍
 
Glaucon said:
Again, this is not my wisdom I’m talking about here.

And just because it ain’t Church teaching, does it mean it’s not true?
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When your “wisdom” stands AGAINST Church Teaching, I ignore such ‘wisdom.’
 
R_not said:
Oh by the way Catharina - maybe take a look at the section we are in: non-Catholic Religions.

Why are you telling us not to discuss non-Catholic faiths when we are in the correct section to begin with?
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Get a clue. I’ve said nothing of the kind.
Any pretense that Christianity teaches hatred of Islam is a lie.
 
catharina said:
One cannot spread a message of love by preaching hate.
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No one is preaching hate. What we are doing is telling others what islam is. Why the problem with facts?

Here is the main problem that I see happening here.
  • it is a shock to find out that islam is NOT peaceful and that when we discuss islam, its prophet, and its adherents - we go to the base teachings and find that is the core of the problem. When we study its current history, we find that its organizations such as the MSA (muslim Student Association), CAIR, etc are funded by the wahabbi saudis and have direct ties to the muslim brotherhood.
Both have ties to the latest radical movement that started in the very early 20th century by Al Husseini. The tie between the muslim brotherhood, al Qaeda, Hamas, the wahabbi saudis, Hezbollah - are all offshoots of this same movement. And in the early days they were affiliated with Hitler and his movement in Europe. When we stopped the Nazis - we did not stop the muslim movement - they moved to Northern Africa and the Middle East. We had not a clue as to what was going on. Although, I can speak of this - we have been in these areas with a military presence for some time now.

No one, such as yourself, questions why so many ‘moderate’ muslims do nothing to curtail their own. Instead the muslims worry about their image, and will riot, and kill, over cartoons and a movie - but no riots over the slaughter of others by muslims. In muslim lands there is not law to protect infidels, known as the subjugated ones (dhimmi), from muslims doing ANYTHING to them - rape, beatings, torture, and/or murder.

and it seems the only ones bothered by all of this are people who are speaking out about islam and then accused by our own that we are hateful.

think again - it isn’t hatred that any of us are speaking out. It is the outrage that we have about what so many ‘moderates’ are ok with since NO MASS MOVEMENT comes from them to stop the atrocities. In fact, why should they? All muslims are told to wage jihad and if they cannot do the violent kind then they are to support those who do that. hence, muslim charities and the deception we hear from muslims about islam. They spout the peaceful passages in the koran and never tell anyone that those passages were replaced by the violent passages.

The koran can be used to prove their point - whether it is to fool us into thinking islam is peaceful and only has our best wishes at heart or by the jihadists who torture and/or kill us.
 
dranzal said:
The Catholic Church does assert in the CCC that Muslims worship “the one God”. Please hear me out.

Here is a long thread on this topic. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=80349

Here is a snippet from Lumen Gentium (similar to passage in catechism)…
  1. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related to the People of God in various ways. There is, first, that people to which the covenants and promises were made, and from which Christ was born according to the flesh (cf. Rom. 9:4-5): in view of the divine choice, they are a people most dear for the sake of the fathers, for the gifts of God are without repentance (cf. Rom. 11:29). But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Moslems: these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.
And Paul stated in Acts 17:23 For passing by, and seeing your idols, I found an altar also, on which was written: To the unknown God. What therefore you worship, without knowing it, that I preach to you

There seem to be two camps on this.
  1. The first follows St. Paul’s lead and says if someone worships one god who they acknowledge to be the All-powerful Creator and since we believe there is indeed only One God, they must also be worshipping The One God. This same camp would say that Muslims are ignorant of the fullness of truth and their image of God is very skewed, but still the One Creator of all.
  2. The second camp looks at the attributes of the professed deity and compares them with the attributes of our God and concludes that they must not be the same.
Who is correct? Only God knows. Do the current Muslims believe they are worshipping the One God Creator of all, the God of Abraham? They do believe so. That is what they profess. From God’s perspective (dare I presume) that may be the God’s way of drawing good (muslims worshipping Him) out of evil (Mohammed inventing the Quran after being visited by, perhaps, a demon calling himself Gabriel). This is an oversimplification, but we do not know the mind of God. We simply don’t know the extent of God’s mercy.

The following was cut and paste from someone else, but I think it sums up nicely.

Again, for clarification. Muslims believe in the creator of this world, which happens to be One. So whoever believes that one creator created this world, is worshipping the only God THEORETICALLY (not theologically). The Church says we worship the same God because Islam is monotheistic, but the Church never says we worship the same God theologically, and the Church never said Muhammad is a prophet from God. Remember, EVEN SATAN believes in the God of Abraham. So if the Church says Muslims worship the God of Abraham, I don’t take it as an agreement on Muhammad being a prophet of God or Islam being truthful, because the Church admits as well that even Satan knows the Only God, the God of Abraham. Muhammed, inspired (perhaps) by satan, hijacked God and invented Islam. This is between God and Muhammed. Current devout Muslims are, in good faith, worshipping a misguided view of the One God.
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James says, if I remember correctly, “You believe God is one? You do well, even the demons believe, and tremble”

Something like that.

Scripture says the Satan believes in God, Vatican II says Muslims Adore the one true God.

Please do not conflate the two.
 
R_not said:
No one is preaching hate. What we are doing is telling others what islam is. Why the problem with facts?

Here is the main problem that I see happening here.
  • it is a shock to find out that islam is NOT peaceful and that when we discuss islam, its prophet, and its adherents - we go to the base teachings and find that is the core of the problem. When we study its current history, we find that its organizations such as the MSA (muslim Student Association), CAIR, etc are funded by the wahabbi saudis and have direct ties to the muslim brotherhood.
Both have ties to the latest radical movement that started in the very early 20th century by Al Husseini. The tie between the muslim brotherhood, al Qaeda, Hamas, the wahabbi saudis, Hezbollah - are all offshoots of this same movement. And in the early days they were affiliated with Hitler and his movement in Europe. When we stopped the Nazis - we did not stop the muslim movement - they moved to Northern Africa and the Middle East. We had not a clue as to what was going on. Although, I can speak of this - we have been in these areas with a military presence for some time now.

No one, such as yourself, questions why so many ‘moderate’ muslims do nothing to curtail their own. Instead the muslims worry about their image, and will riot, and kill, over cartoons and a movie - but no riots over the slaughter of others by muslims. In muslim lands there is not law to protect infidels, known as the subjugated ones (dhimmi), from muslims doing ANYTHING to them - rape, beatings, torture, and/or murder.

and it seems the only ones bothered by all of this are people who are speaking out about islam and then accused by our own that we are hateful.

think again - it isn’t hatred that any of us are speaking out. It is the outrage that we have about what so many ‘moderates’ are ok with since NO MASS MOVEMENT comes from them to stop the atrocities. In fact, why should they? All muslims are told to wage jihad and if they cannot do the violent kind then they are to support those who do that. hence, muslim charities and the deception we hear from muslims about islam. They spout the peaceful passages in the koran and never tell anyone that those passages were replaced by the violent passages.

The koran can be used to prove their point - whether it is to fool us into thinking islam is peaceful and only has our best wishes at heart or by the jihadists who torture and/or kill us.
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What I am saying, quite clearly, is that to promote disrespect of Isalm is to stand against Church Teaching. Deal with that, not with political fears and paranoia. Maybe pray more?
 
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