Why is active homosexuality part of the "culture of death?"

[Les_Richardson]

Marauder:

I personally don’t think that homosexuality is “part of the culture of death”, I think the new acceptance of homosexual acts is a result of the culture of death.

When people start putting such a small value on life, that they kill the unborn and have no problem with euthanasia, stem cell research, etc. then relationships that do not produce life are accepted as normal.

It’s a “me first” mentality now, the way I feel is more important then any rules or even whether a fetus lives. If I have a life inside of me that isn’t convienant I must get rid of it. If I have feelings towards another man I must act on those feelings instead of realize they are wrong.

If I can not produce a kid on my own, I need artificial methods to do it if I want it, if I don’t want a kid I produced, lets get rid of it.

All products of the culture of death we now live in.

I’d have to agree.

I recently heard an open-line show on a secular radio station discuss the abortion issue from the point of view of recent medical advances that keep pointing relentlessly to the fact that what is growing inside a woman is a life, identifiable now as early as 12 weeks in a new method of ultrasound. A “pro-choice” caller, a woman, actually said that most pro-choicers know absolutely that it is a life, yet they are worried about the consequences if they admit it. I was astounded.

She was essentially saying that abortion was killing but she wanted to hang on to that option. I was driving down the road screaming at the radio, “what in the name of all that is Holy is so important that you readily admit you would kill for it?!” Lifestyle? Money? Sex without consequences?

The absolute epitome of selfishness, self-centeredness. Absolutely the culture of death. May God help us.

 

[Les_Richardson]

Shoshana:

Males did shameful things with males and thus received in their own persons the due penalty for their perversity.

Is it as simple as saying that the homosexual lifestyles produce the everlasting AIDS/HIV epidemic? I do struggle with this. Now, I heard on TV that the AIDS virus could’ve been inoculated through the polio vaccine in the Third World! What to think?

And if homosexual acts passes this virus around, well, I only ever hear from men that are infected. I never hear from lesbians being infected.

Rome was well known for its sexual perversions: whether it be homosexuality, pedophile acts, lesbianism, sexual orgies, etc etc.

What is the due penalty for their perversity? Just a question…
Blessings,
Shoshana

Here’s an interesting side-note on the Aids question;

“Over the past decade, Uganda has reduced the HIV infection rate from more than 30 percent in the early 1990s to about 6 percent last year. In June, Museveni’s wife, Janet, was given the Medical Institute for Sexual Health’s “Hero Award” in Washington for the success she and her husband have had in promoting abstinence over “safe sex” in Uganda.” sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=18679

That touched off a debate. There is an agenda there as well. It amounts to selfishness again. Abstinence is mocked and derided because it requires self-restraint and that goes against everything that the homosexual lobby and Planned Parenthood wish to promote. They see the human race in a Darwinian light, as little barnyard animals that have no control, because control implies a moral compass and that eventally implies a higher authority and the last thing they want is God involved in society.

 

[Mijoy2]

This issue has me torn. As a Catholic I am in agreement with and understand that I am to honor and obey the teachings of the church. And therefore I do.

HOWEVER, from a purely secular (I’m not confused about the issue from a religous viewpoint) viewpoint I can’t understand how a homosexual lifestyle threatens society or degrades society. If laws are developed based purely by secular means, and those laws ultimately are in favor of homosexual marriage, civil unions whatever, how does this directly affect the majority which is heterosexual?

As I see it, if we look into the proverbial crystal ball and see our future made up of a mixture of a homo and hetero sexual society, how is society adversely effected by this?

Now before I get slammed here, a reminder, I understand the churches teachings and therefore I reject the lifestyle. I just can’t honestly understand how homosexuality hurts society (secularily speaking). If it’s against Gods will it is wrong. However I remain confused and deeply sympathetic. Therefore I believe the battle can never be won by Christians, at least not until religious views outweigh secular views. And we are far from that balance.

 

[Marauder]

scaxter:

Could you please explain to me then, exactly what is the culture of death in your opinion or maybe what Pope John Paul II is specifically referring to.

What I think the culture of death is, is the complete disregard for life by a large portion of the population. People have no problem disregarding the right to life of entire populations, the unborn, the aged, the sick, prisoners that are killed for the sake of revenge, etc.

When you start devaluing life, then the value of other things related to it also goes down, thus affecting your ethics.

Even people that are in the groups of devalued people start to look down on themselves. How many terminally ill people play into the thinking that their life is worthless? Just because other people say that they should consider suicide/euthanasia they feel they should. When there is no respect for life in all it’s forms, people’s morality dies.

Then when the value of life starts going down, the value of other things follows. The only things that become important is the “me” and if anything gets in the way of it, it is bad. People think I should be able to have anything I want, I can’t have a child I must use artificial means to get one. I don’t want a child I need to abort the child. I want to have sex whenever I want and however I want so I can. Anyone that stands in my way is a bigot, homophobe, fundie, etc. Thus the culture of death affecting all aspects of morality.

Is abortion a result or a symptom?

Abortion is a symptom of the “culture of death.” It is part of the culture of death because society has devalued the life of a class of human beings. A person that has not been born has no value, unless the kid is wanted.

Does the culture of death then begin first in the heart and all sins are results of “the heart” not being right?

In my opinion, yes because as soon as you devalue your fellow man in any way, you start to support the culture of death.

Just look at Iraq right now, the Muslem extremists have devalued the life of people that don’t support their cause, so they have no problem beheading non-combatants. This supports the culture of death.

 

[fix]

Mijoy2:

This issue has me torn. As a Catholic I am in agreement with and understand that I am to honor and obey the teachings of the church. And therefore I do.

HOWEVER, from a purely secular (I’m not confused about the issue from a religous viewpoint) viewpoint I can’t understand how a homosexual lifestyle threatens society or degrades society. If laws are developed based purely by secular means, and those laws ultimately are in favor of homosexual marriage, civil unions whatever, how does this directly affect the majority which is heterosexual?

As I see it, if we look into the proverbial crystal ball and see our future made up of a mixture of a homo and hetero sexual society, how is society adversely effected by this?

Now before I get slammed here, a reminder, I understand the churches teachings and therefore I reject the lifestyle. I just can’t honestly understand how homosexuality hurts society (secularily speaking). If it’s against Gods will it is wrong. However I remain confused and deeply sympathetic. Therefore I believe the battle can never be won by Christians, at least not until religious views outweigh secular views. And we are far from that balance.

Why would bestiality be a threat? It is abnormal. It leads to physical sickness and death in many cases. It pollutes young minds. It is a disorder. One of the many sad things about this debate is that homosexualists have hijacked it.

Many no longer think of homosexual desires as a sickness or mental illness. The credentialed misfits have proclaimed it is normal and most sheeple go along with it. That is why so many can’t see it as a terrible threat to our civilization and our salvation.

Any decent person who can’t see that a perverted act is repulsive, degrading and an offensive to humanity is no longer decent. It started with wholesale contraception, that led to millions of abortions and now the next step is homosexual sex as normal.

 

[Mijoy2]

fix:

Why would bestiality be a threat? It is abnormal. It leads to physical sickness and death in many cases. It pollutes young minds. It is a disorder. One of the many sad things about this debate is that homosexualists have hijacked it.

Many no longer think of homosexual desires as a sickness or mental illness. The credentialed misfits have proclaimed it is normal and most sheeple go along with it. That is why so many can’t see it as a terrible threat to our civilization and our salvation.

Any decent person who can’t see that a perverted act is repulsive, degrading and an offensive to humanity is no longer decent. It started with wholesale contraception, that led to millions of abortions and now the next step is homosexual sex as normal.

I do think it abnormal. It certainly is by definition. I just can’t bring myself to taking such a hateful stand. I simply do not feel threatened by it and have difficulty seeing how society is. I know I am in the minority in a forum such as this expressing this.

As I stated in my original reply, I am aware that homosexuality is viewed as wrong in scripture. I believe the bible to be infallible and the teaching of the church to be infallible. I have difficulty reconciling it intellectually. We are called to trust the church, which I do. I don’t believe we are expected to instantly intellectually understand the teaching. Otherwise we would not be human, we would be robots. I humbly admit to trusting the Church. I would not be exercising true integrity if I lied and said I understand. If the speed limit suddenly dropped to 25 mph on the highway, I’d (somewhat) obey it and trust there is probably good reason. However I may not be in full understanding of it. As I said, I am torn over this one.

 

[fix]

Mijoy2:

I do think it abnormal. It certainly is by definition. I just can’t bring myself to taking such a hateful stand. I simply do not feel threatened by it and have difficulty seeing how society is. I know I am in the minority in a forum such as this expressing this.

As I stated in my original reply, I am aware that homosexuality is viewed as wrong in scripture. I believe the bible to be infallible and the teaching of the church to be infallible. I have difficulty reconciling it intellectually. We are called to trust the church, which I do. I don’t believe we are expected to instantly intellectually understand the teaching. Otherwise we would not be human, we would be robots. I humbly admit to trusting the Church. I would not be exercising true integrity if I lied and said I understand. If the speed limit suddenly dropped to 25 mph on the highway, I’d (somewhat) obey it and trust there is probably good reason. However I may not be in full understanding of it. As I said, I am torn over this one.

Hateful stand? Boy, you really have been co-opted. It is not just divine law that is violated, but natural law as well. It is like abortion. People do not see the violence and so intellectualize it, psychologize it and nuance it so they think an incrediblly evil act is neutral, or even good. It is a sick thing. It is diaboloic.

Yes, for all Church teachings we should accept them first, and they try to understand them if God allows us to. But, homosexual acts can be condemned without believing in God at all. I get very exercised about all this because in a short period of time our entire society is becoming more sick and degenerate than I thought possible.

What should a parent tell their children when they see two men kissing? What should they say when their friend has two mommies? You can’t see how wrong that is on a purely natural level? Our gods have become psychologists, psychiatrists and the media. Apparently, they are infallible and are the way to salvation.

As Fulton Sheen said…Our world is sickening in it’s tolerance, what we need is more intolerence. Intolerance toeward evil!

 

[Auberon_Quin]

fix:

Any decent person who can’t see that a perverted act is repulsive, degrading and an offensive to humanity is no longer decent. It started with wholesale contraception, that led to millions of abortions and now the next step is homosexual sex as normal.

So your point is that, if it weren’t for contraception, homosexuals wouldn’t be having sex?

I must have missed a step.

 

[fix]

Auberon Quin:

So your point is that, if it weren’t for contraception, homosexuals wouldn’t be having sex?

I must have missed a step.

The embrace of contraception and that mentality that separates love and sex has helped usher in the era of open acceptance of fornication, adultery, homosexual sex, abortion, etc. They are all linked.

Heterosexuals who contracept are not that different from homosexuals who have “sex” with each other. It is faux marital embrace. It is mutual masturbation. It is almost two sides of the same coin.

 

[Shoshana]

Well, we are now into contraception…and I must admit, this is all true. When I was getting married 30 years ago, while taking pre-cana classes, I argued the point that the Church had no right to tell me what to do in my bedroom! On the one hand they say to keep your man happy, and then, on the other, conception is a sin. Go figure! My mind at the time was very narrow on this subject and looking back, it seemed I was retaliating. And I was…that is another story!

Years ago, during prayer and reflection, in between my heavy involvement in parish work, it seemed that the Lord, in His mercy, allowed me to see my error. Birth control turned around, is control the birth! Isn’t this Satan’s work? Turning things around!!! I repented and have shared this story with many many people. How do we control the birth? Pills, IUD’s, tying male and female tubes, abortions, masturbation, homosexuality in all of its forms, etc etc. The consequences of my generation of ‘birth control’ which was a new thing then, has snowballed into something real ugly. And Satan is having a good time! We haven’t seen the end of it, I fear!

Just my two cents…
PS I do have a question here that wasn’t responded to in another thread. It is a scientific fact that Homesexuality is present in higher forms of animals. Not all animals though, just some. How do we explain that if it is found in the animal world, would that be a genetic problem or psychological? How do we make peace with that? I obey the Church in all of its teachings, I humbly try. These are just questions…

Blessings,
Shoshana

 

[Ken]

fix:

Hateful stand? Boy, you really have been co-opted. It is not just divine law that is violated, but natural law as well. It is like abortion. People do not see the violence and so intellectualize it, psychologize it and nuance it so they think an incrediblly evil act is neutral, or even good. It is a sick thing. It is diaboloic.

Yes, for all Church teachings we should accept them first, and they try to understand them if God allows us to. But, homosexual acts can be condemned without believing in God at all. I get very exercised about all this because in a short period of time our entire society is becoming more sick and degenerate than I thought possible.

What should a parent tell their children when they see two men kissing? What should they say when their friend has two mommies? You can’t see how wrong that is on a purely natural level? Our gods have become psychologists, psychiatrists and the media. Apparently, they are infallible and are the way to salvation.

As Fulton Sheen said…Our world is sickening in it’s tolerance, what we need is more intolerence. Intolerance toeward evil!

If a parent doesn’t know what to tell his child when they see two men kissing, then they are not fit to a parent.

 

[mercygate]

Les Richardson:

Here’s an interesting side-note on the Aids question;

“Over the past decade, Uganda has reduced the HIV infection rate from more than 30 percent in the early 1990s to about 6 percent last year. In June, Museveni’s wife, Janet, was given the Medical Institute for Sexual Health’s “Hero Award” in Washington for the success she and her husband have had in promoting abstinence over “safe sex” in Uganda.” sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=18679

Ah. Perhaps the Holy Martyrs of Uganda are praying for their homeland.

 

[mercygate]

Glancing through this thread, I have not seen a recommendation of Christopher West’s excellent summary: GOOD NEWS ABOUT SEX AND MARRIAGE (I think that’s the title). He answers all the usual challenges to the Catholic position on sexual ethics.

For brainy types, read JP II’s THEOLOGY OF THE BODY. Definitely not an easy read, but seraphic!

 

[Ken]

mercygate:

Glancing through this thread, I have not seen a recommendation of Christopher West’s excellent summary: GOOD NEWS ABOUT SEX AND MARRIAGE (I think that’s the title). He answers all the usual challenges to the Catholic position on sexual ethics.

For brainy types, read JP II’s THEOLOGY OF THE BODY. Definitely not an easy read, but seraphic!

Sounds a bit like a book on birdwatching by Stevie Wonder.

 

[darcee]

well I will give you one up on that… just what should a parent tell their child when that child has to deal with the other parent’s homosexuality?

We all sin. Sex outside of the bounds of church teaching, any fornication, adultery, contraception is WRONG. I think I am missing something because I don’t understand why the Christian community as a whole is so fascinated by gay sexuality. The same people who will walk by a store shelf full of condoms and not even blink will be thrown into a fit if they see two men kissing… shouldn’t they be equally offended by both?
But back to the original question.

Homosexual acts are part of the culture of death in that, by their nature they are closed to life. They are sterile.
-D

 

[fix]

Ken:

If a parent doesn’t know what to tell his child when they see two men kissing, then they are not fit to a parent.

I am not sure of your point? The post you qoted was to someone who claims homosexuality is normal and is to be accepted on par with heterosexuality.

 

[Ken]

darcee:

well I will give you one up on that… just what should a parent tell their child when that child has to deal with the other parent’s homosexuality?

We all sin. Sex outside of the bounds of church teaching, any fornication, adultery, contraception is WRONG. I think I am missing something because I don’t understand why the Christian community as a whole is so fascinated by gay sexuality. The same people who will walk by a store shelf full of condoms and not even blink will be thrown into a fit if they see two men kissing… shouldn’t they be equally offended by both?
But back to the original question.

Homosexual acts are part of the culture of death in that, by their nature they are closed to life. They are sterile.
-D

Many Catholics wouldn’t be walking by the store. They would be going in and buying the condoms. The last I read 80% of Catholics reject Church teaching and practice birth control. But, as they walk out of the store with the condoms in a bag, they quote Church teaching to the guys kissing.

 

[fix]

darcee:

well I will give you one up on that… just what should a parent tell their child when that child has to deal with the other parent’s homosexuality?

We all sin. Sex outside of the bounds of church teaching, any fornication, adultery, contraception is WRONG. I think I am missing something because I don’t understand why the Christian community as a whole is so fascinated by gay sexuality. The same people who will walk by a store shelf full of condoms and not even blink will be thrown into a fit if they see two men kissing… shouldn’t they be equally offended by both?
But back to the original question.

Homosexual acts are part of the culture of death in that, by their nature they are closed to life. They are sterile.
-D

I think the folks who walk by condoms and don’t blink are the same ones who embrace the homosexual agenda. Their brains have been washed by pop culture. “Gay” is seen as cutesy and just a variation of normal.

 

[fix]

Ken:

Many Catholics wouldn’t be walking by the store. They would be going in and buying the condoms. The last I read 80% of Catholics reject Church teaching and practice birth control. But, as they walk out of the store with the condoms in a bag, they quote Church teaching to the guys kissing.

Not true at all. Those “catholics” who contracept do not know Church teaching or want to know. They embrace intentional ignorance or dissent openly. They accept sodomy both homo and hetero.

 

[darcee]

fix:

Not true at all. Those “catholics” who contracept do not know Church teaching or want to know. They embrace intentional ignorance or dissent openly. They accept sodomy both homo and hetero.

I am kind of confused by this. I do not think that MOST Catholics who use birth control accept homosexuality. I don’t think they are so woefully uniformed on the church’s teachings on ABC either. I am willing to bet that they pick and choose what they feel is really bad depending on where they feel inclined to sin. We all have a tendency to excuse our own sins and condemn the sins of others, but Christ calls us to something higher. To a place where we confess our own sins while ministering to others.
-D