Why is Harry Potter hated by some Catholics for magic when lord of the rings has Gandalf who was a wizard?

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Encyclopedias, history books, and dictionaries don’t actively promote the occult as something good, harmless, innocent, or that can be used for doing good.
 
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YoungCatholicGuy said:
Encyclopedias, history books, and dictionaries don’t actively promote the occult as something good, harmless, innocent, or that can be used for doing good.
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This is such a silly argument.

These are fictional books. Any references occur alongside descriptions of flying on broomsticks, talking paintings, and unicorns.

Instead of worrying about protecting your children from these dastardly references to the occult, why not just concentrate on teaching them the difference between fiction and reality?
 
The book may be fictional, but the occult is real, and references to Divination, consulting the dead, use of curses/ hexes, astrology, are all actual occult methods used by satanists. Neither can the occult / satanism be used for ‘good.’

Jesus was an expert storyteller, and never once used references to occult methods as a literary device.

Just that I agree with certain christians and catholics who have a concern about this terminology used as a literary device in this series.
 
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Zachary King is reported to be a convert to the Catholic Church from Satanism. He had experienced things other-worldly so to speak by his past experiences & spoke from that perspective on the matter.
 
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It makes more sense to read the Silmarillon first before the LOTR since the Silmarillon essentially lays down the foundation of Tolkien’s world building.
 
You mean Satanists use Harry Potter books as a how to manual?

If the occult was real as you claim, the Harry Potter books do a bad job of documenting it.

Why?

The HP books are not about Satanism, if there was ever such a thing.
 
These are the references in the book:
YoungCatholicGuy said:
references to Divination, consulting the dead, use of curses/ hexes, astrology, are all actual occult methods used by satanists. Neither can the occult / satanism be used for ‘good.’
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The mythological texts you mention do not use of the Occult.
Name any of Tolkien’s good characters who used occult methods for Good?
 
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casslean said:
  • Survives an attack by a powerful ruler as an infant due to the sacrifice of his parents
  • Displays an uncanny knowledge and awareness beyond his years at the age of eleven
  • Defends people believed by society to be evil because he understands they are not
  • Faces persecution by those who fear his message and believe it will undermine their power
  • Chooses to sacrifice himself to save the world from evil
  • Returns from the dead to defeat that evil
Honestly, the only way to make it more obvious would be to add a footnote saying “PS - Harry is supposed to represent Jesus”
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Yes, I have actually been corrected by several posters before this. You are only the latest in a long line of kind and thoughtful literary critics to set me straight. Thank you so much.
 
This isn’t a thread about other world mythologies.
It is a thread on the differences between Lotr, Narnia, vs Harry Potter.

Please provide the references to where any Lord of the Rings or Narnia character uses occult methods/ terminology, for ‘good.’

This is why Tolkien and Lewis are safer, compared to Harry Potter where occult terminology is used as a literary device for the characters to do ‘good.’
Which can be a danger to younger readers, who are only a click away from discovering the methods behind such occult terminology on the internet,

The occult isn’t real? Unfortunately Jesus condemned in the Bible, and the Catechism here condemns it also as real recourse to demons (which Catholic Exorcists say is the most common cause of demonic oppression)
  • All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future. Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone. (CCC 2116)
  • All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others—even if this were for the sake of restoring their health—are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity. (CCC 2117)
The Harry Potter series mentions: astrology, divination, curses, hexes, (as methods of ‘good’ and ‘self defence’, which is a contradiction of Catholic doctrine).
 
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YoungCatholicGuy said:
The Harry Potter series mentions: astrology, divination, curses, hexes, (as methods of ‘good’ and ‘self defence’, which is a contradiction of Catholic doctrine).
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One more time – it’s FICTION. It’s not a series of how-to manuals. Why that is so difficult to understand is beyond me. You may be one of those people who just should not read any fiction at all.
 
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The occult is not fiction.

That is the danger of a literary work, where occult methodology are used for ‘good.’

Tolkien nor Lewis did this.
Neither did Jesus Himself in His storytelling.

I have read the books. But this line should not have been crossed by the author.
The occult is real and its methods cannot be used for ‘good.’

Maybe, readers who understand this, and young readers who are informed of this, will not be likely to ever develop curiousity into the occult.
 
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So first… funny story about Tolkien. I knew he was Christian, I never knew he was Catholic. When I found out I told my Protestant friends and their response was: OH NO! Now the stories are ruined for me!!!

Because, in their minds, Catholics aren’t Christian.

That said.

I understand, to an extent, the concern with glamorizing the occult, as Harry Potter does. In Tolkien’s work we are in an entirely different world, the creatures are fantastical and don’t exist in our world. In Harry Potter the real world and the fantastical are entertwined which can lead to confusion.

I don’t think people are wrong for choosing not to expose their children to Harry Potter while welcoming Tolkien. I think there are legitimate concerns because of how Harry Potter is structured (and how horribly those teenagers act towards adults and even how horribly the adults act towards the teenagers). I also don’t think people are wrong for choosing to read these books to their kids.

I think ALL things should be taken with consideration. I think it wouldn’t hurt if parents had conversations with kids about what they’ve read. “So in this book they use magic but in the real world that stuff is not the same. You understand, right?”

There is magic and divination and etc in the Bible as well. And yes, it’s usually painted in a bad light but if a parent is open and honest and communicates with their child I think it could be okay.

Just my personal opinion though as a huge fantasy fan who reads countless novels with ‘magic’ in them.
 
Divination isn’t real?

Divination is recourse to demons. The ouijii board is a form of divination, and is one of the highest roots of demonic possession according to Catholic exorcists.

Quote from the Catechism:
  • All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future. Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone. (CCC 2116)
 
SomeCanadian stated:
‘’
There is magic and divination and etc in the Bible as well. And yes, it’s usually painted in a bad light ‘’
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Unfortunately Jesus states in the book of revelation:
‘all workers of magic, divination, sorcery, will be cast into the fires of Hell.’

The occult is always painted as a bad light by catholicism and the Bible,

Because power only comes from God,
Or
Satan.
 
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Earlier in the thread, when the clear Christian allegorical elements of Potter were pointed out, one poster replied that Rowling was simply repackaging the occult in a structure that would appeal to Christians. So really… they’ve already made up their mind that Rowling is leading some massive demonic conspiracy and no real world facts will sway them.

If we do take the author’s words at face value… she has explicitly stated that Wicca has no place in her fictional world while her Christianity inspired the various obvious Christian symbolism.
 
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