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Kaninchen
Guest
A very, very sad state of affairs. Perhaps the Islamic world really does need the worldly-wise Ottomans back?My son might also have a hard time there…he’s a Sufi
Why is law based on Christian beliefs acceptable, when Sharia law is opposed on the basis of separation of church and state?
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Shalom.
The Qur’an promises paradise to Jews and Christians who believe in the Beloved, and do good works. This being so, why would any Muslim state make it difficult for them to do so? My wife, for example, is a Catholic, with an absolute right under Islamic law, not only to retain her Faith, but to practise it. If I - her husband - have no authority to stand between her and the Beloved, what authority does the state have? None.
We don’t need an Ottoman…we simply need to accept the will of our Lord.
K
Kaninchen
Guest
Wa-Alaikum-Salaam
I don’t think I’ve ever posted anything criticising Islam which has always seemed to me to be a rather sensible religion in many ways*.
My reference to the Ottomans was really about Erdoğan’s rather obvious attempt to set up Turkey as an alternative to the Saudi and Iranian worldviews.
Meanwhile, I expect @(name removed by moderator) and I have equally enjoyed our “Muslim ate my hamster!” arguments with the easily shocked on World News over the years, you’ll have caught on to the reference to fake shock! horror! stories.
I don’t think I’ve ever posted anything criticising Islam which has always seemed to me to be a rather sensible religion in many ways*.
My reference to the Ottomans was really about Erdoğan’s rather obvious attempt to set up Turkey as an alternative to the Saudi and Iranian worldviews.
Meanwhile, I expect @(name removed by moderator) and I have equally enjoyed our “Muslim ate my hamster!” arguments with the easily shocked on World News over the years, you’ll have caught on to the reference to fake shock! horror! stories.
- other than the sarcastic suggestion that the real solution to the problem of covering up of women was for males, once past puberty, to only go out blindfolded, accompanied by their mothers until, once married, they could be accompanied by their wives or, preferably, their mothers-in-law - this would go for all covering-up religious enthusiasts, obviously.
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Shalom, sister.
Forgive me, Kaninchen. I did not intend to suggest that your reference to the Ottomans was a criticism of Islam. Please accept my apologies for any offence.
Erdoğan’s has made a grave error, in my opinion. His action is entirely political, and it could well backfire in the longer term.
Without straying into politics…you will know that the Israeli government wants Jerusalem to be recognised throughout the world as that state’s capital. Once that happens, what is to prevent the government demolishing the Dome of the Rock - and the Al-Aqsa Mosque - and replacing them with a Temple? If ‘Might is Right’ is good for the Turks, then it is good for the Israelis. You get my point, I’m sure.
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Love it
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Kaninchen
Guest
I believe that the only way that sort of outrage would be palatable to anybody but cranks would be after something like a nuclear confrontation - of course, if Messiah turns up . . .
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childinthefaith
Guest
As previously stated, I believe Islam and sharia fit the title “political system” and “hate group” much better than a “religion.”
Personally, I consider mosques to be a blight upon an otherwise beautiful America and feel it would be appropriate, by U.S. Law, to shut them all down. Perhaps that’s the concern about the law in America?
Not sure I mentioned it, but as a Christian and a soldier, I have been to the Muslim’s Holy Land, Saudi Arabia, and exactly at the point where Muslims start their pilgrimage to Mecca. I saw how the elite ruling class used sharia to control and manipulate the “regular” people, and saw more than one of them breaking rules that would elicit the execution of a “regular” person. I am therefore convinced that, since the end goal of Islam is 1 world caliphate, that it is a “religion” about controlling its devotees. Make US all pay a jizya tax and submit, right? Is that not what the quran says to do with the “People of the Book, aka, Christians and Jews,” if they will not convert?
Another question: If Islam is so great, why do Muslims keep coming to America from countries where they’re the majority?
Answer: To attempt to infiltrate our government, take over from the inside by using our freedoms against us, and to enjoy our freedoms that don’t exist in the originating countries until they ruin them with sharia. It is quite ironic actually, those whom desire to take over our democracy and replace it with Sharia, do not want to live where there is currently sharia in force. Gee whiz, big surprise.
In answer to the population prediction etc., I here encourage married Catholics who are able to do as God said, “Go forth and multiply,” and, raise your kids in the Church!!!
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Alexandria2020
Guest
It gets worse in certain places. Children become like slaves.
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Alexandria2020
Guest
Exactly it’s a type of political system. Search on YouTube Muhammad Hijab and Yasir Qadhi. They themselves reveal the flaws of the Qur’an. As there are multiple versions of the Qur’an. Christian apologists Jay Smith and David Wood explain on this very well in their YouTube channels as well. Sam Shamoun is a great Christian apologist who knows about this as well.
The biggest comedy here is - this can of worms were opened by two Muslims - Muhammad Hijab and Yasir Qadhi - discussing on their faith on Youtube.
The current standard Qur’an is the 1924 Egyptian Quran based on Hafs 'an 'Asim’s recitation from the 8th-century recitation. That’s not even the earliest version of the Quran sadly. And the 3rd caliph Uthman apparently burned other versions of the Qur’an. So quite obviously this was purely a political ‘religion’ system.
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childinthefaith
Guest
I didn’t watch that youtube, but I agree with pretty much everything you stated.
And, thx for the data - I’d not seen some of it.
And, thx for the data - I’d not seen some of it.
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mcq72
Guest
Yes, that is current standing, though states indeed did have established religions for a time. I believed they stopped not due to constititional issues but more bickering over taxes and church/congregational splits.
Right, maybe 14th, but I was citing states rights or lack of it now, ceding to stronger federal government (where states used to decide right to life issues on their own, as they did slavery before War).
Well it certainly helped remove a generic religious prayer from public schools. It is still being used to try to remove prayers from some government public meetings etc… I think it has helped remove any Christian/ biblical refetences in all sorts of textbooks such ad english, science etc…
Yes, and as the saying goes, " the power to tax is the power to destroy".
Public schools gained favor and popularity at expense of private/ religious schools, and made them less accesible, (affordable) and therefore restricting such free exercise thereof. Tough to not only support a public school system thru taxes, but then pay tuition for private. Of course you can’t opt out of taxes.
Most anti establishment church like Baptists at least wanted general Christian teaching in schools. When “public” schools were formed thru taxes (and disestablishment motives), religious division again kept any “established”
schools from sharing the revenue. The rest is history. The roles reversed. Where once schools were mostly religious, even " established", or " private", now most are unreligious and public, disestablished not only from any sectarianism, but from Christianity and all religions (unless you call atheism or agnosticism a sort of faith based practice/ religion). It took a while but humanists like Horace Mann got the upper hand as planned. Tough for a divided Christian community to withstand such force.
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mcq72
Guest
And which came first, the compromising bickering church in these issues or the crumbli g of our society? The issue is much deeper than prayer in schools. Do you think we lost the fervor of implementing Christian principles in civil and private matters as the Puritans and really our founding fathers had? And schooling our children was not merely a civil matter, and the least place for any disestablishment of our “private” religious convictions.
There is an interesting study " To Pray or Not To Pray". It compares all the statitistical benchmarks of a healthy society and school system, pre and post 1963. Hard to deny that perhaps prayer being kicked out of school is part of or symptomatic of a slowly but surely crumbling society and anemic church.
But agree, no prayer in school is just one of the many darts to be addressed.
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