Why isn’t Thomas à Kempis a saint? Or is He?

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ALL those who attain Heaven by God’s Grace are saints - it is more important that Thomas a Kempis is a saint in the eyes of God than a name on the Canon listings.

I feel he is likely to be politely and mildly amused at any concern over his lack of official recognition this side of life’s veil. 😉

In his own words - Man proposes, but God disposes. 😉
 
According to the rules of the church a person must have performed two confirmed miracles to be considered for beatification.
 
joetheatomboy said:
According to the rules of the church a person must have performed two confirmed miracles to be considered for beatification.
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Well, I don’t know about “must have two miracles”. There are other examples of Saints without two miracles. For example, martyrdom saints and other examples, right? What were Saint Joseph’s two miracles, for instance?
 
Jimmy_B said:
Well, I don’t know about “must have two miracles”. There are other examples of Saints without two miracles. For example, martyrdom saints and other examples, right? What were Saint Joseph’s two miracles, for instance?
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Canonization only started about 1000 years ago. Prior to that (e.g. St Joseph, the Apostles etc) there was no canonization process.
Since its introduction canonization REQUIRES two miracles.

ewtn.com/johnpaul2/cause/process.asp
 
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thistle:
You’re correct, thank you. However, aren’t there modern day, within the last 1000 years, martyred saints, without 2 confirmed miracles?

NO.

John XXIII doesn’t have two confirmed miracles (yet ;)).
 
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thistle:
You’re correct, thank you. However, aren’t there modern day, within the last 1000 years, martyred saints, without 2 confirmed miracles?

NO.
Aren’t these two examples? Not to mention all of the other WWII Saints? …And many others???
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The 108 Martyrs of World War II, known also as 108 Blessed Polish Martyrs (Polish: 108 błogosławionych męczenników), were Roman Catholics from Poland killed during World War II by the Nazis.

Their liturgical feast day is 12 June. The 108 were beatified on 13 June 1999 by Pope John Paul II at Warsaw, Poland. The group comprises 3 bishops, 52 priests, 26 members of male religious, 3 seminarians, 8 female religious and 9 lay people. There are two parishes named for the 108 Martyrs of World War II in Powiercie in Koło County, and in Malbork, Poland
Here - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/108_Martyrs_of_World_War_Two
______________________________________________
"Remembering the Mexican martyrs of the Cristero rebellion"
“…May 21, 2000 canonization of 25 Mexican martyrs, many Catholics…”
Here - victorclaveau.com/htm_html/around%20the%20world/mexico/mexican_martyrdom.htm
 
Jimmy_B said:
NO.
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Aren’t these two examples? Not to mention all of the other WWII Saints? …And many others???
_____________________________________________
The 108 Martyrs of World War II, known also as 108 Blessed Polish Martyrs (Polish: 108 błogosławionych męczenników), were Roman Catholics from Poland killed during World War II by the Nazis.

Their liturgical feast day is 12 June. The 108 were beatified on 13 June 1999 by Pope John Paul II at Warsaw, Poland. The group comprises 3 bishops, 52 priests, 26 members of male religious, 3 seminarians, 8 female religious and 9 lay people. There are two parishes named for the 108 Martyrs of World War II in Powiercie in Koło County, and in Malbork, Poland
Here - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/108_Martyrs_of_World_War_Two
______________________________________________
"Remembering the Mexican martyrs of the Cristero rebellion"
“…May 21, 2000 canonization of 25 Mexican martyrs, many Catholics…”
Here - victorclaveau.com/htm_html/around%20the%20world/mexico/mexican_martyrdom.htm

Miracles are required before anyone is canonized. There is nothing in these articles that states no miracles happened.
 
thistle said:
Miracles are required before anyone is canonized. There is nothing in these articles that states no miracles happened.
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Popes can dispense with the miracle requirements if they want.

Although I personally couldn’t tell you of any saints canonized since 1000 AD without miracles. 🤷
 
LilyM said:
Resigned to the fact of his own death, apparently. It seems it’s saintly, or at least more saintly, to be calmly accepting in the face of death than otherwise.
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This is true. At the same time, waking up to find you’re six feet underground is no day at the beach, however saintly a person you might be.

It could be also, that at first Thomas reacted with horror (and God forbid, despair) at his situation; but might have been resigned to it at the last. Only God knows, and can judge.

As for me, I’m donating my organs after I’m gone; so no worries there. 👍
 
Mount_Carmel said:
ALL those who attain Heaven by God’s Grace are saints - it is more important that Thomas a Kempis is a saint in the eyes of God than a name on the Canon listings.

I feel he is likely to be politely and mildly amused at any concern over his lack of official recognition this side of life’s veil. 😉

In his own words - Man proposes, but God disposes. 😉
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Amen to that. 😉
 
So I’m resurrecting this thread from way back in the day, but I think it deserves continued discussion. I make no bones about it, I’m definitely in favor of Thomas a Kempis being canonized. Way overdue. If you think about the vast impact The Imitation of Christ has had on the world, how many saints it influenced, how many lives it saved from despair, the author alone deserves some kind of recognition. However, anyone who reads the Imitation would know that Kempis would very well resist such recognition. So maybe God has let him have his way 🙂
Loren_1of6 said:
A person like Thomas a Kempis actually died without witnesses. People were around when he got sick and fell into a coma (or whatever caused them to decide he was dead enough to bury). They were not around when he actually died. As a result, we do not know if he accepted his death as a welcome from his heavenly Father or if he went to the other extreme and died cursing the God who would sentence him to such a cruel death. This uncertainty on the part of the Church is enough to keep him from being canonized. Remember that the canonization is a declaration that a person is definitely in heaven. If Thomas denied his faith at the very end of his life, he would not go to heaven. That is a pretty big if.
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There are many saints who, at the moment of their death, were alone and without witnesses. Blessed Jacinta of Fatima comes to mind. I think it is a bit of a reach to ask that question, and the burden of proof would be entirely on the side of the devil’s advocate. Furthermore, there is no historical evidence that he was buried alive. If you look at the link below, it will lead to a blog discussion of this longstanding urban legend.

timothyedmoore.com/?p=218

The Chronicle discussed claims “as age grew upon [Kempis] he was vexed with a dropsy in the legs, and so fell asleep in the Lord”. This suggests a natural, reconciled death. Even if the rumors WERE true that he was buried alive, others before me have mentioned the self-preservation instinct that may have kicked in. It hardly would preclude his cause from being promulgated.

Lastly, there have been saints canonized in the modern era, whose entire existence is a mystery (i.e. Juan Diego). So the reasons thus given as possible hindrances to his beatification/canonization do not seem very legitimate.

Let’s all pray for the Beatification of Thomas a Kempis! Godspeed 🙂
 
It’s really up to God to decide if he is a saint. If I found out that he was an evil person, I would still have a great attraction to The Imitation of Christ.

For a long time people were not sure whether Thomas a Kempis actually wrote the book. This may have something to do with why the Church has not canonized him.
 
There has been speculation in the past over the authorship of the Imitation, but I think most scholars believe and affirm that Thomas a Kempis wrote it. People in his order who knew Kempis within his life time even identified him as such, I believe.
 
Robert_Sock said:
For a long time people were not sure whether Thomas a Kempis actually wrote the book. This may have something to do with why the Church has not canonized him.
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There has been speculation in the past over the authorship of the Imitation, but I think most scholars believe and affirm that Thomas a Kempis wrote it. People in his order who knew Kempis within his life time even identified him as such, I believe.
 
On of our pastors in South Dakota who is now deceased, a very credible and holy priest, Fr. Leonard D. Fox (1st cousin to Fr. Robert Fox who founded the Fatima Family Apostolate and was on EWTN for the few years of his life) told us that when Thomas’s grave was opened up he was facing downward and that’s why the canonization process was stopped. It was a sign of despair. 😦
 
Bsokolow said:
On of our pastors in South Dakota who is now deceased, a very credible and holy priest, Fr. Leonard D. Fox (1st cousin to Fr. Robert Fox who founded the Fatima Family Apostolate and was on EWTN for the few years of his life) told us that when Thomas’s grave was opened up he was facing downward and that’s why the canonization process was stopped. It was a sign of despair. 😦
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Well, I’ve never heard that…but I don’t know how that would constitute ‘a sign of despair’ or an impediment to canonization. If one makes the ill-founded assumption (based more on rumor than fact) that Kempis was buried alive, how is it sinful if he tried to escape? It seems like a reasonable and natural response. Regardless, again, the historical evidence we have suggests Thomas a Kempis died of natural causes in old age (specifically of dropsy). Here is a link to a blog that discusses that evidence:

timothyedmoore.com/?p=218
 
I wish I could ask our Fr. Fox specifically, but I can’t. I recall him saying that since the body was found face downward, that those who investigated his cause weren’t sure that Thomas A Kempis didn’t go downward into hell. It put enough of a doubt in the investigation to where his cause was stopped. We must pray for his soul. I love his writings.
 
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