R
RNRobert
Guest
George, I have the funny feeling you are not listening to anything thing we have to say, but are simply here to “save us.” Well, the Catholic Church is not a false church as you claim, it is CHRIST’S CHURCH.
- Status
D
distracted
Guest
I am wondering approx how old you are?
What about religion did not “fit”?
Was it your grandmom dying that caused you to “lose your faith”?
I have been thorugh things that have temporarily caused me to “lose faith” or whatever… but, as someone once said, “If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent Him.” I feel that way even more about Jesus Christ… I relate more to Jesus than the father most of the time because he knew what it was like to be human, to be persecuted/hated/misunderstood/questioned all the time… (motives, etc.)… and crucified by evil people, all things i have endured… (except, absolutely speaking, that last one… ). He came not only to die on a Cross for us but to show us the way to live and how to accept the terrible sufferings this world inflicts on people…
If Jesus did not exist… i would invent Him…
But i could never have dreamed up something (Someone) so wonderful…
The remedy for doubt (& anything else that ails you) is spending time with Jesus @ the blessed Sacrament… His Real Presence is in the Catholic Church 24 hours a day…
God bless…
L
Laurent_LUG
Guest
The fact that my last grandmom died ,
has nothing with it !!
You know , I have faith in myself !!
religion:
What does not fit ?? The way I see it:
For instance:
The story , there was guy named josef ,
he did get a son , but someone else
tells he’s the father ??
Such a mom , you worship her ??
So , what about the husband , if they were married ??
To me , it sounds like a perfect script
for a soapopera !!
And I really do not like soapopera’s !!
They are a perfect “school” to teach
how to lie & commit adultery !!
Also , all those other bible stories like:
Feeding a large crowd with only
2 fishes & 5 loafs of bread ??
Water changes into wine , just like that ??
Etc … !!
Further: If it not exists , you would invent it ??
How I see it , a complete blurry mankinds’
invention , just to satisfy its’ thoughts !!
Live to suffer is totally crazy !!
Suppose someone would tell me , they will
crucify him/her within 5 years and why ??
I declare her/him totally nuts !!
Actually , an unbelievable “story” !!
I don’t know the reason why we do live ,
but I enjoy it , I seize the day
To live & enjoy , we do not need (a) religion !!
I die , over & out , finito , c’est fini !!
My body will rot in the ground !!
It’s a chemical process !!
My age
?? I’m born in 1967
Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), october 21, 2008
has nothing with it !!
You know , I have faith in myself !!
religion:
What does not fit ?? The way I see it:
For instance:
The story , there was guy named josef ,
he did get a son , but someone else
tells he’s the father ??
Such a mom , you worship her ??
So , what about the husband , if they were married ??
To me , it sounds like a perfect script
for a soapopera !!
And I really do not like soapopera’s !!
They are a perfect “school” to teach
how to lie & commit adultery !!
Also , all those other bible stories like:
Feeding a large crowd with only
2 fishes & 5 loafs of bread ??
Water changes into wine , just like that ??
Etc … !!
Further: If it not exists , you would invent it ??
How I see it , a complete blurry mankinds’
invention , just to satisfy its’ thoughts !!
Live to suffer is totally crazy !!
Suppose someone would tell me , they will
crucify him/her within 5 years and why ??
I declare her/him totally nuts !!
Actually , an unbelievable “story” !!
I don’t know the reason why we do live ,
but I enjoy it , I seize the day
To live & enjoy , we do not need (a) religion !!
I die , over & out , finito , c’est fini !!
My body will rot in the ground !!
It’s a chemical process !!
My age
?? I’m born in 1967 Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), october 21, 2008
L
LutheranDK
Guest
I do indeed se the logic of purgatory. I just believe that it is unbiblical, and therefore not something that should be so vital a part of Christian theology.
This is how I see it:
Either the work of salvation was completed with Christ’s sacrifce, or there is no salvation possible. Either, Christ took ALL of our sins upon Himself, or He took none. Either we are justified in Christ alone, or not at all.
Your option #2 seems to be a caricature of what you think non-RC’s mean; correct me if I’m wrong?
It is not true. Not for any ORTHODOX protestant anyway.
This has nothing to do with believing that you’re a good enough person, etc. My opposition to the teachings of Purgatory is that it has no scriptural support; and looks extremely much like a later invention, because the idea that ALL our sins were forgiven on Calvary was simply unbearable for the “pharisee within us all”…
D
distracted
Guest
Who said anythinga bout living to suffer??? You are reading things into my comments…
there’s more than one way to “crucify” someone… if you know what i mean…
we are not put on Earth to enjoy life and forget about all the injsutices perpetrated against others… which is what one would have to do to toally enjoy his life… He would have to absolutely forget about all the suffering and misery humans go through… and if you have never suffered… If you have no sufferings now… you are undoubtedly on your way to Hell… because to do the right thing always involves suffering…I don’t know the reason why we do live ,
but I enjoy it , I seize the day
D
distracted
Guest
i used to think the same thing… when i was very young. Then i went through a lot of things that only an experience with God could begin to explain… OK… so i didn’t say that so well… What i mean is that the only way the things i went through made any sense whatsoever was in the context of God’s Word… which comes to us in daily Mass (mostly)… I’ve been through such horrendous things… you would NOT believe it… I have seen & experienced great evil… and still do… (obama
, etc)If i couldn’t believe in a loving God who does not approve of all that evil & some day will do away with it forever… I would be lost… i would be so miserable, i wouldn’t want to live… Life would have no meaning… So…
I will cling to the old rugged cross… and exchange it some day for a crown…
L
Laurent_LUG
Guest
Maybe I misunderstood , but …
Those sufferings , we do this to ourselves !!
Life is what we make it !!
Some people use those sufferings for
their own satisfaction !!
cross crucifixion
crucifixion of someone by the media
…
I disagree on every single word on this quoted part !!
Not always !!
Another suffering:
Suppose at a fire , you have 1 chance only
to save someone:
- Someone who you’ve rather see dead than alive !!
- Your mom !!
You can only save one of them
because the building will collapse !!
Who will you save ?? Both are litteraly next to you !!
The last one you called ,I’ve been through such horrendous things… you would NOT believe it… I have seen & experienced great evil… and still do… (obama
ok , I don’t mind about him
also the rest of those candidates !!
(But aboard , no politic(k)s
)To be honest , I’m not an American
The rest of reply #137 ,
I disagree on every single word !! Sorry !!
Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), october 22, 2008
D
distracted
Guest
that’s your choice…
I disagree with just about everything you say also.
Have you read today’s Scripture readings?? I posted them in Non-Catholic Religions forum…
Today readings speak of how Christ will cause division…
I accept that… do you think you are the only person to ever disagree wtih me?? Ha! that’s a laugh…
Jesus said “You will be hated by ALL because of Me.”
(When i read that, i always get this feeling Jesus said that just for me - and a few others who love Him more than anything/anyone else…)…
and He probably did… He also said that the road to eternal life is narrow and there are “few who find it”…
Apparently, a lot of people end up in Hell…
but… that’s their choice…
D
distracted
Guest
It is totally biblical… 1 Cor 3:13, St. Mt 18:23 and etc… I post the daily/sunl Mass readings every day… in this forum… Almost every day there is a scripture passage that alludes to Purgatory… and/or OSAS… I am sorry if this sounds rude, but most Protestants do not know the bible as well as they like to think…
How do you figure?
No one is arguing with that… It is just HOW one is justified… HOw one is “in Christ” that is in controversy… What is at issue is what we are to DO with Christ’s redemption (etc.). Jesus said that not everyone who says Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of Heaven… You have to DO something to get into Heaven… You can’t just say you believe in Jesus and that’s all… Even the demons believe and tremble…
i can understand you thinking this… You think this in large part because you have been programmed to think that - and other negative things about Catholicism… You wren’t raised CAtholic and also The media inundates us with false notions about the Church… becaue the liberal media despises the Roman Catholic Church… I saw soemthing on Public broadcasting the other day that just made my blood boil… It was a big LIE about the Church… I turned the &^%%$ thing off and almost vowed never to watch that *&^%$ channel ever again… I can handle anything that is said against the Church but i CANNOT handle outright LIES!!!
The only thing that calmed me down (and eased my depression) was the thing in the Bible abaout how much we followers of Crhist will be hated… and the truth that the devil rules in this world… (the truth will set you free)…
Anyway… i think that every American should take RCIA classes because only then will the falsehoods (and there are SO many of those) against hte Church will be eradicated… (assuming you get an orthodox instructor who teaches RCIA
)… The devil is everywhere… even in Christ’s Church. . maybe especially there… becaue… well… he hates Catholics… more than anyone…
L
Laurent_LUG
Guest
True , just my opinion
Freedom of free opinion
Suppose you did not get such freedom !?!?
But still a question:
My fire-question:
What would you do in such case ??
I think you know my opinion/answer ??
Absolutely not my cup of tea !!
The religious way:
I do not believe in heaven !!
I do not believe in hell !!
Misery means hell , true !!
Goodness & happiness means heaven , true !!
Those are my belief or faith in heaven & hell !!
I’m not a religious something or someone ,
I’m human !!
Salute & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:
– Laurent LUG (.@…), october 24, 2008
R
RNRobert
Guest
The program in question wouldn’t have happened to be “Secrets of the Dead,” would it? Last weekend I saw a promo for an episode of this program called “Battle for the Bible” about Wycliff, Tyndale, and others who translated the Bible into English, and how the church had a “monopoly” on the Bible.
D
distracted
Guest
i don’t believe in death… but somehow i don’t think what i believe about the matter is going to change things much…
D
distracted
Guest
i got in on middle of it… but yes, it was about Tyndale…The program in question wouldn’t have happened to be “Secrets of the Dead,” would it? Last weekend I saw a promo for an episode of this program called “Battle for the Bible” about Wycliff, Tyndale, and others who translated the Bible into English, and how the church had a “monopoly” on the Bible.
never knew he was burned at the stake… by us evil Catholics…
He was a heretic who changed the Word of God…
No, he shouldn’t have burnt at the stake for that… but i somehow doubt the Pope had anythign to do with that punishmetn… I have been meaning to get the Catholics’ perspective on this but haven’t yet… Do you know much?I was angry because they said the Pope wouldn’t give Henry VII a divorce because (somethijng like) he didn’t have “clout” in Rome… (the king didn’t, that is)… Geeze!!!
G
guanophore
Guest
Purgatory is a state in which we are completely cleansed and separated from our attachment to sin. This can be our state here, if we are willing to allow the HS to sanctify us completely. Some die in right relationship with God still attached to the things of this world, or perhaps even unaware that there are areas of their souls that have not been given over to God.
J
justasking4
Guest
When was purgatory created? Was it in existence during the OT and if so did the prophets speak of it?
G
guanophore
Guest
Only God knows!
J
justasking4
Guest
Do any of the OT prophets mention it in the OT Scriptures?Originally Posted by justasking4
When was purgatory created? Was it in existence during the OT and if so did the prophets speak of it?
guanophore;
Only God knows!
What did the OT teach about judgement and the afterlife?
D
distracted
Guest
in the book of Maccabbees, which was thrown out with 6 other books by M. Luther… it mentions praying for the dead “that they be loosed from their sins.” (Macc 12:44) I am not sure about other places in the OT because i am not as knowlegeable about the OT as the New… but in any case, as i am sure you know… we Catholics do not believe ALL Christian truth is to be found in the Bible…
C
cascherman
Guest
I think you’ll discover that most Christians do believe we need to cleansed from our guilt of sin before we are in the presence of God. They just get all twisted up about calling it purgatory, I suppose.
The only Christians that may have an issue with this view are the ones that believe Jesus’ death on the cross made it so you cannot be culpable for sin. Which of course I believe is contrary to scripture.
The only Christians that may have an issue with this view are the ones that believe Jesus’ death on the cross made it so you cannot be culpable for sin. Which of course I believe is contrary to scripture.
D
distracted
Guest
it is totally against scirputre… and Purg can be found there… (as mentioned elsewhere on the forums)…
Jesus’ death opened the WAY to Heaven… That doesn’t mean that everyone who goes around spouting the Lord this and the Lord that is going to get into Heaven… as Scirputre says…
Jesus said it was difficult to get into heaven… that 'few will find" that road to eternal life…
- Status