Why Radical Pro-Lifers Are Wasting Their Time

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NOTE: That is not my title, it is the title of the article.

Now, for a quotation from the article:
Wrong. A 2005 poll showed that Rhode Island is also, coincidentally, 63% pro-choice — a near impossibility if its Catholic residents are as doctrinally opposed to abortion rights as the bishops assure us every Catholic must be. And lest you dismiss Rhode Island Catholics as a liberal fringe, a Pew Research Center survey this year found that a majority of all U.S. Catholics, 52%, think abortion should be kept legal. That just about squares with the general U.S. population, 54% of whom support abortion rights, according to an ABC News/Washington Post poll over the summer.
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Read more: ideas.time.com/2011/11/17/why-radical-pro-lifers-are-wasting-their-time/#ixzz2Gw0VyMUE

If this is true then this is just downright shocking. 52% of American Catholics believe abortion should be kept legal??? :mad:😦 Just how bad is the problem of cafeteria Catholicism???
 
From the areticle: “But while the Catholic bishops have to toe the Vatican line, the Catholic laity doesn’t.”

I don’t have the RAM to express how ridiculous this statement is.
 
Holly3278 said:
NOTE: That is not my title, it is the title of the article.

Now, for a quotation from the article:

Read more: ideas.time.com/2011/11/17/why-radical-pro-lifers-are-wasting-their-time/#ixzz2Gw0VyMUE

If this is true then this is just downright shocking. 52% of American Catholics believe abortion should be kept legal??? :mad:😦 Just how bad is the problem of cafeteria Catholicism???
Click to expand...
The statistics, like all statistics, are likely skewed in favor the person researching them. It’s very easy to introduce selection bias in your surveys.

That said, whether these statistics are accurate or not the problem of cafeteria Catholicism is a major one. Too many Catholics seem to forget that they are dealing with divine law, not just some human-made decree. The article writer is also making the mistake of assuming that what is right is dictated by majority opinion. The Bishops are correct, all Catholics MUST be opposed to abortion. If they are not, then they are not following the teachings of the Church, and have no business calling themselves Catholic.
Aquila_Lucis said:
From the areticle: “But while the Catholic bishops have to toe the Vatican line, the Catholic laity doesn’t.”

I don’t have the RAM to express how ridiculous this statement is.
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That hurt my brain… They seem to be forgetting that Catholicism is not a democracy. >_>
 
How can it be that the same folks who are rightly outraged about the deaths of 20 children in Newtown don’t blink an eye at the death of 10’s of millions through abortion?

Can someone explain the thought process going on there?
I guess unborns are not human persons?
They are possessions until born? Kinda like slaves?
They don’t exist because we can’t see them?
What?
 
clem456 said:
How can it be that the same folks who are rightly outraged about the deaths of 20 children in Newtown don’t blink an eye at the death of 10’s of millions through abortion?

Can someone explain the thought process going on there?
I guess unborns are not human persons?
They are possessions until born? Kinda like slaves?
They don’t exist because we can’t see them?
What?
Click to expand...
They don’t view them as being the same as people who have been born, I guess. They certainly don’t view them as being children, and they’re not, really. They’re foetuses. They’re still people, though.
 
Regular_Atheist said:
They don’t view them as being the same as people who have been born, I guess. They certainly don’t view them as being children, and they’re not, really. They’re foetuses. They’re still people, though.
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This is exactly what I am getting at.

They’re not children, but they’re still people?
 
clem456 said:
This is exactly what I am getting at.

They’re not children, but they’re still people?
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Yes? Why is that surprising? Adults are not children, and yet they are still people.
 
Clem,

IMO, it is a problem of “out of sight - out of mind”.
Sadly, some people can put on moral blinders and ignore the humanity of the unborn.
Also, people don’t like to think about the fact that s/he was once at that stage of development; that would bring home the reality of the human person & the continuity of Life.

I would dearly love to see the day when a channel like MTV shows some kind of ads of weeks old fetus with heart beating; statement underneath: heartbeats detectable as early as 16 days from conception. Perhaps teen mom is studying, then shown partying, blissfully unaware of the life developing inside her. This followed by a few seconds showing of a photo of a slightly older fetus, and so on, until the baby is fully developed. The concluding statement: When does this human being become a person? Can you tell? Or something like that. Something - ANYTHING to get young ppl who are immersed in a video culture to THINK about the reality that this is a Human Being from the moment of conception and thus worthy of protection.

Also, most students are not grounded in philosophy of any kind. I don’t know how to fix that except to keep encouraging ppl to Think. And we need priests who will expound these facts from the pulpit, unafraid of the possible backlash. Truth is more important than making friends w all of your parishioners. We never hear about the evils of contraception and abortion in homilies here.

Happy New Year,
Mimi
 
What bothers me is not only the number of Catholics in dissent, but the idea non-Catholic journalists have that Catholic teaching is/should be determined by a ‘majority vote’ of Catholic laity.

It could be that 99% of Catholics support abortion “rights”, but if the Catechism says they must not, then they are not in line with their Catholic religion.
 
Equites_Christi said:
What bothers me is not only the number of Catholics in dissent, but the idea non-Catholic journalists have that Catholic teaching is/should be determined by a ‘majority vote’ of Catholic laity.

It could be that 99% of Catholics support abortion “rights”, but if the Catechism says they must not, then they are not in line with their Catholic religion.
Click to expand...
👍
 
Equites_Christi said:
What bothers me is not only the number of Catholics in dissent, but the idea non-Catholic journalists have that Catholic teaching is/should be determined by a ‘majority vote’ of Catholic laity.

It could be that 99% of Catholics support abortion “rights”, but if the Catechism says they must not, then they are not in line with their Catholic religion.
Click to expand...
👍
 
clem456 said:
How can it be that the same folks who are rightly outraged about the deaths of 20 children in Newtown don’t blink an eye at the death of 10’s of millions through abortion?

Can someone explain the thought process going on there?
I guess unborns are not human persons?
They are possessions until born? Kinda like slaves?
They don’t exist because we can’t see them?
What?
Click to expand...
This is a dumb statement. It is disrespectful to those in my home state, and makes Catholics everywhere look like idiots to use the death of children to make a cheep political shot. I have no idea how you believe this to be an appropriate or relevant statement.
 
clem456 said:
How can it be that the same folks who are rightly outraged about the deaths of 20 children in Newtown don’t blink an eye at the death of 10’s of millions through abortion?

Can someone explain the thought process going on there?
I guess unborns are not human persons?
They are possessions until born? Kinda like slaves?
They don’t exist because we can’t see them?
What?
Click to expand...
The thought process here and present is diabolical. Read Jn.c7v44.
They know full well that the unborn are innocent human beings; and they have known it all along.
The unborn are the weakest,poorest, most defenseless of all humanity; they have no money, no voice, no vote, no power of their own of anykind. So they are the favorite victim of the merciless killer.
All the unborn have is the one thing that’s best to have: God. And He surely has them.
There’s no point in wondering or asking what these people are thinking about; how they have killed so many, they do it because they want to and they profit from it.
 
Holly3278 said:
NOTE: That is not my title, it is the title of the article.

Now, for a quotation from the article:

Read more: ideas.time.com/2011/11/17/why-radical-pro-lifers-are-wasting-their-time/#ixzz2Gw0VyMUE

If this is true then this is just downright shocking. 52% of American Catholics believe abortion should be kept legal??? :mad:😦 Just how bad is the problem of cafeteria Catholicism???
Click to expand...
These are the “obama” Catholics as I fondly call them. :mad: . Everyone is always jumping on the back of the SSPX, at least they have it straight that abortion is evil. Poor Catechesis, thats the main problem IMO,
 
Holly3278 said:
If this is true then this is just downright shocking. 52% of American Catholics believe abortion should be kept legal??? :mad:😦 Just how bad is the problem of cafeteria Catholicism???
Click to expand...
FWIW, I don’t see the relevance. Abortion is the killing of human life and everyone should be concerned.
 
Holly3278 said:
NOTE: That is not my title, it is the title of the article.

Now, for a quotation from the article:

Read more: ideas.time.com/2011/11/17/why-radical-pro-lifers-are-wasting-their-time/#ixzz2Gw0VyMUE

If this is true then this is just downright shocking. 52% of American Catholics believe abortion should be kept legal??? :mad:😦 Just how bad is the problem of cafeteria Catholicism???
Click to expand...
I doubt 52% is a true total, unless they contacted every catholic in the usa and personally asked them then its likely not true
 
Equites_Christi said:
What bothers me is not only the number of Catholics in dissent, but the idea non-Catholic journalists have that Catholic teaching is/should be determined by a ‘majority vote’ of Catholic laity.

It could be that 99% of Catholics support abortion “rights”, but if the Catechism says they must not, then they are not in line with their Catholic religion.
Click to expand...
👍👍👍

Exactly right. I’m not entirely sure where they got that idea either, probably from all the fundamentalist groups who do change their doctrines at the behest of their attendees.
 
Holly3278 said:
NOTE: That is not my title, it is the title of the article.

Now, for a quotation from the article:

Read more: ideas.time.com/2011/11/17/why-radical-pro-lifers-are-wasting-their-time/#ixzz2Gw0VyMUE

If this is true then this is just downright shocking. 52% of American Catholics believe abortion should be kept legal??? :mad:😦 Just how bad is the problem of cafeteria Catholicism???
Click to expand...
As the saying goes, there are lies, d–ned lies, and statistics
When I studied statistics in University, we learned how to use the data to get the desired results. I know I’ve posted this before on another thread ages ago, but I still remember the assignment I had where we had to use the same data set, and using accepted methods, obtain 3 different conclusions. This was from the same Professor that taught us to never believe statistics in the News - for precisely that reason. Despite the fact that these polls are aired as “truth”, 9 times out of 10 their methodology is flawed or their sample sizes ridiculously small and skewed. Media (and governments) just like to use these things to sway public opinion the way they want it. More people will do something if they believe “everyone else does it.”
 
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