Why Should a Mormon Become Catholic?

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I think it’s the wrong question.
I think the question should be, how is your personal relationship with God going?

When one gets too focused on the institution, that relationship suffers

Christ had a very close and prayerful relationship with the Father first before all else
 
I don’t think there is any evidence of a real evidence of a “great apostasy” as some claim, or any evidence of Apostolic Succession being broken.

That’s my short ‘n’ sweet answer.

God be with you on your journey.
 
rfournier103 said:
I don’t think there is any evidence of a real evidence of a “great apostasy” as some claim, or any evidence of Apostolic Succession being broken.

That’s my short ‘n’ sweet answer.

God be with you on your journey.
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there is no real evidence to anything js said.

that should be enough
 
rfournier103 said:
I don’t think there is any evidence of a real evidence of a “great apostasy” as some claim, or any evidence of Apostolic Succession being broken.

That’s my short ‘n’ sweet answer.

God be with you on your journey.
Click to expand...
Thank you. And I agree.

What i have found after reading LDS apologetics for so long is this. Many LDS apologists attempt to prove the so-called restoration of doctrines by Joseph Smith by referring to the writings of ancient Jews and Christians. They attempt to show that there were beliefs such as pre-mortal existence, deification (which they attempt to say is analogous to the LDS exaltation, ignoring the orthodox theosis), God with a body, “mysteries” (which are supposed to be equivalent to the temple washing and anointing, and the Endowment), etc. They then claim that because no other Christian church has these things (in their view), there was an apostasy. The problem is, even if we entertain that all of these things are found amongst ancient Jews and/or Christians, there is no evidence that there ever was a unified, if you will, Church of Jesus Christ of Former-day Saints, an ancient LDS Church, with these unique beliefs. Instead, they grab from here and there, from this obscure text and that obscure text, from this one statement from one person to another one statement, etc, many times out of context. The fact that we don’t see in the 1st-2nd century a unified ancient LDS Church (with core beliefs such as pre-mortal existence, ordinances like sealing, Endowment, etc) is problematic for the LDS.

But most LDS won’t focus on things like that when attempting to prove an apostasy of the Church. Instead, they’ll just say that the NT Church was led by apostles. After the apostles died, there were no more apostles, and bishops took their place, when bishops are not equivalent to apostles. Therefore, there was an apostasy. The Catholic/Orthodox response would be that apostles and bishops were/are equivalent in authority and office (and “apostle” merely means one who is sent), and “apostle” specifically referred to an eyewitness to Christ.

I think for me personally, the hardest part of the authority question from an LDS perspective is whether the bishops were given the same authority as the apostles, and are their successors. Not that they received authority from the apostles (since the same could apply in the LDS Church), but whether they received the same authority as the apostles, and succeed them as the leaders of the Church. But then, we already had a thread on that ;).
 
Jesus gave the apostles the authority to bind and unbind here on earth.

how does the lds support its teaching that the twelve apostles refused to pass this authority on to their successors? what evidence does the lds have to support this idea?

logically, why would the twelve refuse to pass their apostolic authority on to their successors?
 
Hi LW, God didn’t set his church up to fail, what would have been the point of Christ’s work. Trust Him, his church is here, it may not be perfect but its foundation is on the authority conferred by Christ to Peter and the apostles. The church was organised with that authority. Trust the ‘pull’, I did and do not regret it. I can’t explain it, it goes beyond words, it is not a burning in the bosom thing, I just went into a church, and He was there, THEN I started to learn, it was 2 years later that i was finally confirmed. I got to know God through the Sacred Scriptures without the Mormon spin, and my walk continues. When the priest during mass holds up the host and cup and asks us to behold the Lamb of God, I can’t describe my feelings, joy is the closest, but it is more profound than that, at that moment my soul is in total communion, there is an at-oneness, at-onement, knowing I am totally accepted by him, and my joy is in knowing that God did this for us so that we can be in communion with him, that Christ’s atoning work has enabled us to boldy approach the throne of Grace and never be turned away.
I never knew joy in Christ as LDS, I suspect this is your experience too
 
lynnettejane said:
Hi LW, God didn’t set his church up to fail, what would have been the point of Christ’s work. Trust Him, his church is here, it may not be perfect but its foundation is on the authority conferred by Christ to Peter and the apostles. The church was organised with that authority. Trust the ‘pull’, I did and do not regret it. I can’t explain it, it goes beyond words, it is not a burning in the bosom thing, I just went into a church, and He was there, THEN I started to learn, it was 2 years later that i was finally confirmed. I got to know God through the Sacred Scriptures without the Mormon spin, and my walk continues. When the priest during mass holds up the host and cup and asks us to behold the Lamb of God, I can’t describe my feelings, joy is the closest, but it is more profound than that, at that moment my soul is in total communion, there is an at-oneness, at-onement, knowing I am totally accepted by him, and my joy is in knowing that God did this for us so that we can be in communion with him, that Christ’s atoning work has enabled us to boldy approach the throne of Grace and never be turned away.
I never knew joy in Christ as LDS, I suspect this is your experience too
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I love posts like this. Thank you.
 
eddie_too said:
Jesus gave the apostles the authority to bind and unbind here on earth.

how does the lds support its teaching that the twelve apostles refused to pass this authority on to their successors? what evidence does the lds have to support this idea?

logically, why would the twelve refuse to pass their apostolic authority on to their successors?
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Well they don’t say that the twelve “refused” to pass on their authority. What they say is that there were various reasons that prevented them from ordaining successor apostles (from the Catholic perspective I guess you could say that that they did ordain successors, the bishops. But Mormons begin with a different ecclesiology, where bishops are leaders of individual congregations, and are lower in authority than apostles, and therefore don’t have the same authority). Some of these reasons would be persecution, and that they were scattered. That’s typically the argument I’ve seen.

Some LDS do allow for successors to have possibly been ordained, but that after awhile, ordinances and doctrines were allegedly changed (LDS frequently will refer to baptism and whether it should be done via immersion, and on infants, as well as things like original sin, which they reject), causing the Church to become corrupt and the priesthood authority to have been withdrawn by God. Either way, both views believe that there were changes that caused not just individual apostasy, but also an apostasy of the Church.
 
lynnettejane said:
Hi LW, God didn’t set his church up to fail, what would have been the point of Christ’s work. Trust Him, his church is here, it may not be perfect but its foundation is on the authority conferred by Christ to Peter and the apostles. The church was organised with that authority. Trust the ‘pull’, I did and do not regret it. I can’t explain it, it goes beyond words, it is not a burning in the bosom thing, I just went into a church, and He was there, THEN I started to learn, it was 2 years later that i was finally confirmed. I got to know God through the Sacred Scriptures without the Mormon spin, and my walk continues. When the priest during mass holds up the host and cup and asks us to behold the Lamb of God, I can’t describe my feelings, joy is the closest, but it is more profound than that, at that moment my soul is in total communion, there is an at-oneness, at-onement, knowing I am totally accepted by him, and my joy is in knowing that God did this for us so that we can be in communion with him, that Christ’s atoning work has enabled us to boldy approach the throne of Grace and never be turned away.
I never knew joy in Christ as LDS, I suspect this is your experience too
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Thank you so much! I agree with Steve, that was nice. 🙂
 
oh and semi-random:

I was reading about the brown scapular (Scapular of Our Lady of Mount Carmel) yesterday, don’t know why. Next thing you know, I go to my part time job today, and I’m checking a heart monitor on a patient, and what do you know, he lifts up his shirt, and he has a brown scapular on! His visitor mentioned that it was a brown scapular, that it’s a Catholic thing, and that if you die with it on, you go to Heaven and I was like, yes I know, Mary said that, I was just reading about them yesterday.

…🤷 :eek: :whacky:
 
Answering the main question of this thread I think a Mormon should become catholic because God promised He would established a never-ending Kingdom/Church.

The next two quotes, among others, are very clear and safe for not being worry about new prophets or churches appearing here and there. (Indeed God gave us His Word. He has said to us all in His Son. Nobody can improve the revelation which Jesus brought us).

One from the OT: 44 “In the time of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed, nor will it be left to another people. It will crush all those kingdoms and bring them to an end, but it will itself endure forever. (Daniel 2:44)

And one from the NT: 18 And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.” (Matthew 16:18-19)

I recommend these articles about this topic:
catholicbible101.com/thekingdomofgod.htm
apologeticacatolica.org/Protestantismo/Anticatolic/AnticatN08.html (This one in Spanish, If you know this language it worths the read!)
catholicapologetics.org/ap021000.htm

I know a kind of “open letter to protestants” that San Francis of Sales wrote in defense of the Church, and how the Church cannot disappear or fall into apostasy. But I cannot find it in English. I learned a lot reading his writings. In Spanish this letter can be read here: oocities.org/ar/magisterio_escritos/f_sales/indice.html

LW7, I suppose you are living moments of paramount importance right now, discerning about your spiritual journey. May the Lord guide you and bless you!
 
LivingWaters7 said:
oh and semi-random:

I was reading about the brown scapular (Scapular of Our Lady of Mount Carmel) yesterday, don’t know why. Next thing you know, I go to my part time job today, and I’m checking a heart monitor on a patient, and what do you know, he lifts up his shirt, and he has a brown scapular on! His visitor mentioned that it was a brown scapular, that it’s a Catholic thing, and that if you die with it on, you go to Heaven and I was like, yes I know, Mary said that, I was just reading about them yesterday.

…🤷 :eek: :whacky:
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awesome.
 
LivingWaters7 said:
So I hesitated posting this thread, but thought, what the heck.

-temples and eternal families
-prophets, revelation from God to man (including personal revelation), church guided by revelation, Heaven not being “closed” (in their view)
-apostles, priesthood
-“one true church”
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Your first couple points puzzle me a bit.
I welcome corrections from more knowledgeable Catholics.
  1. While not doctrine, nothing in Catholic faith precludes the general concept of eternal families. If my wife and children follow Christ here on this Earth, why not take comfort from the thought of being together in heaven?
  2. New Testament is very clear, we have the gift of prophecy from the Holy Spirit, and Prophet was a position in the early Christian church. Whether you want to call it revelation or not, the Holy Spirit is available to guide us. God responds to our prayers.
 
LivingWaters7 said:
oh and semi-random:

I was reading about the brown scapular (Scapular of Our Lady of Mount Carmel) yesterday, don’t know why. Next thing you know, I go to my part time job today, and I’m checking a heart monitor on a patient, and what do you know, he lifts up his shirt, and he has a brown scapular on! His visitor mentioned that it was a brown scapular, that it’s a Catholic thing, and that if you die with it on, you go to Heaven and I was like, yes I know, Mary said that, I was just reading about them yesterday.

…🤷 :eek: :whacky:
Click to expand...
Whoa. That there’s a sign! 😉 :D:thumbsup:
 
tarboy said:
Your first couple points puzzle me a bit.
I welcome corrections from more knowledgeable Catholics.
  1. While not doctrine, nothing in Catholic faith precludes the general concept of eternal families. If my wife and children follow Christ here on this Earth, why not take comfort from the thought of being together in heaven?
Click to expand...
That is definitely true. I guess the way LDS envision the Catholic view is that in Heaven, everyone has the same relationship with everyone, so while you’ll be with your wife and children, they won’t have that same family relationship with you.
  1. New Testament is very clear, we have the gift of prophecy from the Holy Spirit, and Prophet was a position in the early Christian church. Whether you want to call it revelation or not, the Holy Spirit is available to guide us. God responds to our prayers.
Click to expand...
Perhaps it’s based on LDS misunderstanding what is meant by “public revelation” ending. When LDS read that, they would see that as meaning that God no longer speaks to His children, that the Church is no longer led by revelation from God (LDS would view the New Testament Church as having been led by revelation to men with the gift of prophecy, prophets), the Heavens are closed, etc (these are all phrases that many LDS actually use to describe the traditional Christian view of revelation).
 
To me, it is having the fullness of all the books of the Bible that were missing in the KJV and also I come away feeling such peace.
 
LivingWaters7. don’t know if you have me on ‘ignore’ but I have been praying for you and your return to the Church.

It revolves around who Jesus is, and He is the Living Word of God. He does not lie and we must look to His words in found His Church.

Our Church was instituted by God, and God does not fail.
 
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