Why slam protestants?

[BenedictOblate]

It seems that people really have a distaste for protestants on this board. I’m not trying troll or be funny since this is a Catholic board, but I’ve seen a number of posts that argue that we don’t do things, because it is too protestant.

I’m interested in thoughtful responses as to WHY some posts are at best patronizing and at the very worst hateful toward protestantism.

A response like “We’re Catholic” is neither informative nor welcomed.

 

[Scoobyshme]

Well, there is a difference between “protestantism” and “protestants.” While we should show charity to our separated brethren (Protestants) we should have no tolerance, whatsoever, for Protestantism, which is a heresy.

Perhaps some don’t distinguish between the two. They should.

 

[Warrenton]

It’s hard to answer your question as framed, because it assumes that there is no good answer. “Why are some posts negative and intolerant” assumes a fact that the writer of the post would not likely agree with.

With that in mind, though, I would say that a large part of Catholic identity in English speaking lands is defined with reference to Protestantism, which is the majority religion. Therefore, it is natural, for instance, to say “we don’t believe in sola scriptura because it’s Protestant” as a form of saying “this is an alien belief.” If you asked a Greek, or a Russian the same question, thay might be more apt to answer “We know nothing of such a doctrine, and we reject it.”

Of course, Protestants have always in part formulated their identity as being “not Catholic” so there is a tendency to replicate the method of arguing.

I tend to see the main flaw in Protestantism as being based on authority and unity. The departures from the main current of historical Christianity are the product of isolation, as well as the internal logic needed to bolster the rejection of authority. However, when you get down to discussing what individual passages mean, usually there is not much disagreement. Even “justification by faith alone” and predestination are not completely “un Catholic” ideas.

Perhaps this is a way of restating the truism that what divides us is less than what binds us, but certainly to Catholics, the issue of authority is very important, and is integral to our understanding of unity.

 

[WFS5801]

It seems that people really have a distaste for protestants on this board. I’m not trying troll or be funny since this is a Catholic board, but I’ve seen a number of posts that argue that we don’t do things, because it is too protestant.

I’m interested in thoughtful responses as to WHY some posts are at best patronizing and at the very worst hateful toward protestantism.

A response like “We’re Catholic” is neither informative nor welcomed.

I would have to see specific examples, not sure what you’re talking about. But it should be mentioned that Protestantism is heresy, as all Protestantism denies at least some of the teachings of the Church. There is no sense in glossing over that fact.

Many (maybe most) of the Protestants who post in the Apologetics section (at least) are specifically attacking the Church’s teaching. To defend the Church you sometimes need to point out where the Protestants err.

As a former Protestant I have no trouble separating Protestantism from Protestants. I know Protestants are usually quite sincere about their beliefs – but that doesn’t change the fact that, where they oppose the teachings of the Church, they are wrong.

 

[valentino]

No one should slam protestants.Many of them are well intentioned people.I don’t hear them slamming Catholics or other denominations for the mosst part.Let them preach Jesus they way they see Him.I don’t see any harm in what they do.If you were brought up baptist,or Lutheran what would you preach?

 

[josephback]

Well, there is a difference between “protestantism” and “protestants.” While we should show charity to our separated brethren (Protestants) we should have no tolerance, whatsoever, for Protestantism, which is a heresy.

Perhaps some don’t distinguish between the two. They should.

Well said:thumbsup: Sometimes I have trouble distinguishing as an ex-Protestant. It’s sorta like being an ex-Catholic only the other way around. A person can get really negative. That said, I haven’t seen many people actually be hateful toward Protestants per se, though there is great and understandable opposition toward Protestant ideas. I’ve seen a few posts that were out of bounds, but overall not that bad. Am I blind?

 

[Alix1912]

I see this too.

It irks me to no end that all protestants are lumped together with often little to no understanding of the differences that exist between protestant denominations.

It is often assumed we are ignorant of Christanity’s history in general, and that of the RCC in specific

Questions are often posed in childish and patronizing manners…Example “Hey Protestants did you know…” or “Why do Protestant’s believe XYZ thing” Then many Catholics jump on to the thread with answers that read …because they don;t know better, they haven’t read such and such, they don’t understand, they like to make things up, etc.

Lots statements that are gross generalities about protestants or down right wrong.

Then you as a protestant try to correct it, and you are dumped on and treated in many cases very rudely.

I really find it amazing considering the amount of Catholics I encounter on here who have not read their own church doctinal documents let alone any of ours yet still make the assumptions. I also find it interesting that mny on these forums get very upset about the misconceptions about Catholics and about anti Catholic rhetoric (which is always uncharitable, and wrong to pass on) yet will turn around and display the same attitude towards non Catholics.

I have to say this issue is probably the single biggest thing that turns me off the Catholic Church. Most of the doctrinal differences between the Lutheran Church MS and the RCC are not that huge in my mind, a few are, but most aren’t. However, the holier than thou are attitude is really off puting. Which is sad because there is a lot to be said for the RCC and how they stick to their values and traditions, and how beautiful their traditions and such are. However ever it is sometimes hard to see past some of their members attitudes.

 

[ajpirc]

If you were brought up baptist,or Lutheran what would you preach?

Heresy

 

[Theophorus]

It seems that people really have a distaste for protestants on this board. I’m not trying troll or be funny since this is a Catholic board, but I’ve seen a number of posts that argue that we don’t do things, because it is too protestant.

I’m interested in thoughtful responses as to WHY some posts are at best patronizing and at the very worst hateful toward protestantism.

A response like “We’re Catholic” is neither informative nor welcomed.

Thankfully I have not come across such a childish attitude towards non-Catholic beliefs.

Its one thing to point out particular examples of incompatible non-Catholic practice, and debate topics and customs and specific shortcomings of the various protestant denominations, which are likewise incompatible with Catholicism.

It is quite another to spout uninformed generic slogans and apply them to all the 30000+ protestant denominations out there.

this is a problem that occurs both ways people on both sides can sometimes get over emotional when discussing these important topics and others are just blunt and poor debaters just as in the real world. For others they can loose sight of the fact that it is a real person they are addressing and get carried away and say things over the internet they would never saw in the real world.

God Bless

 

[chaunceygardner]

It seems that people really have a distaste for protestants on this board. I’m not trying troll or be funny since this is a Catholic board, but I’ve seen a number of posts that argue that we don’t do things, because it is too protestant.

I’m interested in thoughtful responses as to WHY some posts are at best patronizing and at the very worst hateful toward protestantism.

Do you mean like this:

Valentino:
“If you were brought up baptist,or Lutheran what would you preach?”

Ajpirc:
"Heresy"

There are many people who know how to “be” Catholic but sadly have no idea what it means to be a Christian. Some of it could be due to a long history of persecution and discrimination against Catholics; some of it could be due to how people were raised and what they heard their parents do and say about other faiths. I think a lot of it may be because many Catholics really don’t know what the Church teaches. They think the pronouncements and attitudes of Medieval and Reformation era Popes about non-Catholics still apply today. Many would be shocked if they learned what the Church now teaches about the relationship between the Catholic church and Protestant churches and how much that has changed in the past 60 years.

Mostly it is a failure to follow Jesus by people on both sides.

 

[Theophorus]

Heresy

Try some Salesian wisdom:

“You can catch more flies with a spoonful of honey than with a hundred barrels of vinegar.”

and

“What is good makes no noise, noise does no good.”

 

[MarcoPolo]

It seems that people really have a distaste for protestants on this board. I’m not trying troll or be funny since this is a Catholic board, but I’ve seen a number of posts that argue that we don’t do things, because it is too protestant.

I’m interested in thoughtful responses as to WHY some posts are at best patronizing and at the very worst hateful toward protestantism.

A response like “We’re Catholic” is neither informative nor welcomed.

You’re right, apologetics is about defending one’s own faith rather than attacking another. I try to make sure I do the former unless called to explain why Catholics do not believe this or that Protestant teaching. I think you should strive to do the same and set the example.

 

[FAB]

It seems that people really have a distaste for protestants on this board. I’m not trying troll or be funny since this is a Catholic board, but I’ve seen a number of posts that argue that we don’t do things, because it is too protestant.

I’m interested in thoughtful responses as to WHY some posts are at best patronizing and at the very worst hateful toward protestantism.

A response like “We’re Catholic” is neither informative nor welcomed.

Those who are slaming or patronizing to our brothers and sisters of the protestant faith are faithing in their Catholic faith. The Church states that all Crhristain faiths have the Holy Spirit working within them, each contain an aspect of the truth. It also teaches further that the the Catholic Church is the only faith that contains fully Gods revelation and truth.
We are called to find common grounds of belief with all faiths. Our work is to recognize the universal needs and rights of all and work to make certain thise rights are realized.

 

[TMC]

It seems that people really have a distaste for protestants on this board. I’m not trying troll or be funny since this is a Catholic board, but I’ve seen a number of posts that argue that we don’t do things, because it is too protestant.

I’m interested in thoughtful responses as to WHY some posts are at best patronizing and at the very worst hateful toward protestantism.

A response like “We’re Catholic” is neither informative nor welcomed.

I agree that some posters express an appalling lack of charity when talking about (or to) protestants. They seem more numerous than they are because of selection bias. In other words, the Catholics that have an ordinary (i.e. kind and generally tolerant) view of protestants don’t feel any need to post on “protestant” threads because (1) they don’t feel very strongly about those issues and (2) they already know their views are in the majority. As a result (like so many things on the internet) an outspoken and mostly marginal minority makes up a disproportionate percentage of those who choose to post on those threads. Please be assured that they do not represent mainstream Catholic thought.

 

[ajpirc]

Do you mean like this:

Valentino:
“If you were brought up baptist,or Lutheran what would you preach?”

Ajpirc:
"Heresy"

There are many people who know how to “be” Catholic but sadly have no idea what it means to be a Christian. Some of it could be due to a long history of persecution and discrimination against Catholics; some of it could be due to how people were raised and what they heard their parents do and say about other faiths. I think a lot of it may be because many Catholics really don’t know what the Church teaches. They think the pronouncements and attitudes of Medieval and Reformation era Popes about non-Catholics still apply today. Many would be shocked if they learned what the Church now teaches about the relationship between the Catholic church and Protestant churches and how much that has changed in the past 60 years.

Mostly it is a failure to follow Jesus by people on both sides.

Sorry, I should try to keep my big mouth shut sometimes (or most of the time).

 

[Alix1912]

Valentino:
“If you were brought up baptist,or Lutheran what would you preach?”

Ajpirc:
"Heresy"

There are many people who know how to “be” Catholic but sadly have no idea what it means to be a Christian. Some of it could be due to a long history of persecution and discrimination against Catholics; some of it could be due to how people were raised and what they heard their parents do and say about other faiths. I think a lot of it may be because many Catholics really don’t know what the Church teaches. They think the pronouncements and attitudes of Medieval and Reformation era Popes about non-Catholics still apply today. Many would be shocked if they learned what the Church now teaches about the relationship between the Catholic church and Protestant churches and how much that has changed in the past 60 years.

Mostly it is a failure to follow Jesus by people on both sides.

Yeah I found that pretty insulting.

Calling others heretics or telling them they are going to hell (which is essentially what being a heretic means) is just not cool, and doesn’t make anyone want to leanr more about your church.

Also we are in a world where Christianity is rapidly becomeing a persexuted religon espeically the more conservative and high litergical denominations. It woud behove us to stand together rather than get catty amoungst ourselves. We are going to need each other to stand together in the future.

Not to mention the anti protestant attitude is really off putting to spouse of Catholics who are protestants. (myself included in that group) Considering somewhere between 35-45% of Catholics are married to non Catholics…that’s a lot of spouses to alienate. It is one of the main reasons I hold my husband to the promise he made me when we married and he was non practicing (we have since gone thru radical sanation)…The kids are being raised Lutheran.

 

[BenedictOblate]

Some very good responses so far.

I don’t post a lot, but read what others are posting. I have been following the music threads recently (having to do with Gregorian Chant) and some of the posts about protestant music got me thinking about the topic.

One of the ideas that seems to cause strife is the role of the congregation in divine worship. The role of the congregation changed significantly after Vat. II and I think it is a good change. I also love the extraordinary form of the mass, think it was a mistake for it to “disappear” for a few decades and think it needs to continue to become more prevalent.

The concern I have is that some refer to the ordinary form as being too “protestant.” We actually have to sing? We have to respond? We have to participate in a way that others can see?

I think the additions of some more “protestant” elements isn’t necessarily a bad thing and pushing us out of our comfort zones may be good good thing.

 

[ndeparis88]

I see this too.

It irks me to no end that all protestants are lumped together with often little to no understanding of the differences that exist between protestant denominations.

It is often assumed we are ignorant of Christanity’s history in general, and that of the RCC in specific

Questions are often posed in childish and patronizing manners…Example “Hey Protestants did you know…” or “Why do Protestant’s believe XYZ thing” Then many Catholics jump on to the thread with answers that read …because they don;t know better, they haven’t read such and such, they don’t understand, they like to make things up, etc.

Lots statements that are gross generalities about protestants or down right wrong.

Then you as a protestant try to correct it, and you are dumped on and treated in many cases very rudely.

I really find it amazing considering the amount of Catholics I encounter on here who have not read their own church doctinal documents let alone any of ours yet still make the assumptions. I also find it interesting that mny on these forums get very upset about the misconceptions about Catholics and about anti Catholic rhetoric (which is always uncharitable, and wrong to pass on) yet will turn around and display the same attitude towards non Catholics.

I have to say this issue is probably the single biggest thing that turns me off the Catholic Church. Most of the doctrinal differences between the Lutheran Church MS and the RCC are not that huge in my mind, a few are, but most aren’t. However, the holier than thou are attitude is really off puting. Which is sad because there is a lot to be said for the RCC and how they stick to their values and traditions, and how beautiful their traditions and such are. However ever it is sometimes hard to see past some of their members attitudes.

I get this a lot when trying to explain certain things about the faith. I think the media really has a lot to do with giving Catholics a bad image. I recall when invitro or embryonic stem cell research was being talked about, and the media was just slamming the CC for not agreeing with at all when we actually do just not when it comes to taking stem cells out of the embryo because it would kill the child. We allow for the taking form the placenta and I think the umbilical chord. Now to me that’s a pretty good deal, a life gets kept and more lives can be saved.

Now I also think that a lot of Catholics are unlearned in the real deep laws and ways of the Church, and I think when they try to defend it they miss something, and they can’t locate it in there heads. For me I’m currently reading a lot of apologetic to have a deep knowledge so I can defend it. The one thing I can say is that the Vatican and the Church itself I.E the bride of Christ, loves and wants everyone to be united. I know we are separated and section off, and I think it comes down to miscommunication and misinformation. As a recently confirmed Catholic, but as a man who grew up in the Church and in Catholic schools, I can tell you that there is so much love and so much joy in the guiding and saving of human souls, and I can say that the CC loves everyone, and wants them to Journey to the Truth, but It’s not the truth we all get separated over it is The Truth for Jesus is the Way the Truth and the Life. It’s a higher truth that all of us, and I think we sell ourselves short when we try to humanize it to fit us. God is not in our box.

 

[Wowbagger]

Because I am still bugged that they killed Thomas More.

Also to keep it real: Americans, me included, are sorely tempted to pluralism and “your truth is as good as my truth-ism.” I wish all sides would generally take their own very real, very important, utterly contradictory positions on important questions a little more seriously. I honestly wish we’d intermarry rather less often (sorry, Alix), because those relationships almost universally trivialize some of the most important facts about God, Christianity, and Man’s place in the cosmos. We owe it to ourselves, to each other, and to God to confidently call each other “heretics” until we’ve sorted it all out through rational conversation and prayer.

That said, I try not to be uncharitable about it. At worst, a bit of teasing about their inevitable reconciliation with Rome is in order. And I get duly teased back (one lovely woman shot back instantly, “Of course it’s inevitable! Sooner or later Rome will realize it’s wrong!”) After all, the world is aligning against us for a fresh persecution. I think everyone realizes that on some level. We cannot afford to burn the bridges within the wider Church. We will all need all our friends soon.

Still – let us never forget that we are different, and importantly so.

 

[BenedictOblate]

I get this a lot when trying to explain certain things about the faith. I think the media really has a lot to do with giving Catholics a bad image. I recall when invitro or embryonic stem cell research was being talked about, and the media was just slamming the CC for not agreeing with at all when we actually do just not when it comes to taking stem cells out of the embryo because it would kill the child. We allow for the taking form the placenta and I think the umbilical chord. Now to me that’s a pretty good deal, a life gets kept and more lives can be saved.

Now I also think that a lot of Catholics are unlearned in the real deep laws and ways of the Church, and I think when they try to defend it they miss something, and they can’t locate it in there heads. For me I’m currently reading a lot of apologetic to have a deep knowledge so I can defend it. The one thing I can say is that the Vatican and the Church itself I.E the bride of Christ, loves and wants everyone to be united. I know we are separated and section off, and I think it comes down to miscommunication and misinformation. As a recently confirmed Catholic, but as a man who grew up in the Church and in Catholic schools, I can tell you that there is so much love and so much joy in the guiding and saving of human souls, and I can say that the CC loves everyone, and wants them to Journey to the Truth, but It’s not the truth we all get separated over it is The Truth for Jesus is the Way the Truth and the Life. It’s a higher truth that all of us, and I think we sell ourselves short when we try to humanize it to fit us. God is not in our box.

+1