Why so many Protestant denominations

[COGHOBDOJ]

So your entire theology is based on your personal interpretation of 3 verses of Scripture??? What if you interpreation is wrong?

Geez… No, not my ENTIRE theology.

White Flag

Waiter? Check Please!

Buh-bye.

 

[estesbob]

Geez… No, not my ENTIRE theology.

White Flag

Waiter? Check Please!

Buh-bye.

I guess that means you wont answer my question.

 

[COGHOBDOJ]

I guess that means you wont answer my question.

Can you just get to the point?

 

[estesbob]

Can you just get to the point?

The point is it appears your wholefaith is based on your personal interpretation of Scripture. How do you know your interpretation is correct?. As the title of this thread suggests this approach has thus far led to some 30,000 different denominations. How many different versions of the truth can there be?

 

[paidion]

(paidion chuckles and says, "there’s a reason why G-d compares us to sheep )

 

[COGHOBDOJ]

Despite our different practices of faith, I believe its not hard to imagine that Jesus wants us to be intimate with Him. Yes, even consider Him a friend. Still holding Him at His rightful place as Lord and Savior. He did walk in the Garden of Eden with Adam, didn’t He? That’s what’s so wonderful about our God. He created us, He is our Lord and Savior, and He died for us, and He wants that type of relationship with us. We still need a healthy fear of the Lord, but He certainly can be our friend.

As for the many denominations, I don’t know…

 

[estesbob]

Despite our different practices of faith, I believe its not hard to imagine that Jesus wants us to be intimate with Him. Yes, even consider Him a friend. Still holding Him at His rightful place as Lord and Savior. He did walk in the Garden of Eden with Adam, didn’t He? That’s what’s so wonderful about our God. He created us, He is our Lord and Savior, and He died for us, and He wants that type of relationship with us. We still need a healthy fear of the Lord, but He certainly can be our friend.

Well that’s all well and good but again what do you base this on?

 

[COGHOBDOJ]

COGHOBDOJ;3150906:

Despite our different practices of faith, I believe its not hard to imagine that Jesus wants us to be intimate with Him. Yes, even consider Him a friend. Still holding Him at His rightful place as Lord and Savior. He did walk in the Garden of Eden with Adam, didn’t He? That’s what’s so wonderful about our God. He created us, He is our Lord and Savior, and He died for us, and He wants that type of relationship with us. We still need a healthy fear of the Lord, but He certainly can be our friend.

Well that’s all well and good but again what do you base this on?

Various scriptures. Do you disagree with any of the above?

 

[estesbob]

estesbob;3150963:

COGHOBDOJ;3150906:

Despite our different practices of faith, I believe its not hard to imagine that Jesus wants us to be intimate with Him. Yes, even consider Him a friend. Still holding Him at His rightful place as Lord and Savior. He did walk in the Garden of Eden with Adam, didn’t He? That’s what’s so wonderful about our God. He created us, He is our Lord and Savior, and He died for us, and He wants that type of relationship with us. We still need a healthy fear of the Lord, but He certainly can be our friend.

Various scriptures. Do you disagree with any of the above?

I think what you post highlights a major problem with Protestant denominations-it’s very much about emotion and very little about worship and unfortunately very little is based on the truth. Yes Jesus created us and yes he is our Lord and Savior. But obviously there is more to salvation and justification than that. And again you tell us your faith is based on Scripture but I ask you again how do you know your personal interpretation is correct? I have a minor in theology, and spent four years in the seminary, and I do not feel myself in anyway qualified to offer personal interpretations of Scripture.

Jesus did not ascend into heaven and leave us on our own. For the better part of 1500 years people recognized this and aceded to the authority of the one true Church. Protestantism replaced the authority of the Church with the authority of the individual and we have seen the chaos that ensued.

 

[jblake]

COGHOBDOJ;:

As for the many denominations, I don’t know…

If it wasn’t for the plethora of denominations, how could people go church shopping?

xan

jonathon

 

[COGHOBDOJ]

Protestantism replaced the authority of the Church with the authority of the individual and we have seen the chaos that ensued.

I’ve had very little chaos in my life lately. But, I’m not convincing many people here of that.

I’m tired…

 

[DebChris]

In looking through this thread, I’ve not really seen an answer to the following question. Where do Messianic Jews (Jews that believe Jesus/Yeshua is the Messiah) fit into this whole scheme?

Messianic Jews have been around since Messiah came to earth - long before the Protestant Reformers were even a thought. All of the apostles (Peter included) were originally Jews. Did they all stop being Jews simply because the Messiah came?

The Scriptures say that Jesus came to fulfill the Law, not destroy it. Therefore, Judaism as practiced in the fulfillment of Yeshua is a valid expression of the Faith. So then, where do the Jews (who themselves believed in and taught their children of Messiah) belong in this whole paradigm?

I wanted to come back to this question, especially as several other posts referred to Messianic Jews as a denomination. Generally speaking, a denomination will build churches that identify themselves; for example, Methodist, Nazarene, Assembly of God, etc. I have not seen a church identifying itself as Messianic Jew. I have known, however, several Jews who have accepted Jesus as the Messiah. They have joined the denomination of the person who introduced them to Christ. This is true of any non-believer who comes to knowledge of God and accepts Jesus Christ as his/her personal Lord and Saviour. In other words, if a person comes to know Christ through the preaching of a Baptist, that person will become a Baptist.
Like a Charismatic, a Messianic Jew may be found within any of the various denomination, including the Catholic Church.

The whole point in following Torah was to understand the holiness of G-d (His grace and mercy). It never was a means of salvation. For if we could have been redeemed through keeping Torah, we would have never needed Messiah’s sacrifice on the cross.

I appreciate your thoughtful/thought-provoking comments, DebChris. I agree that the Jews were the ones to whom the Law was given, and the gentiles were not under any obligation to keep Torah. What I do not see is anywhere in which Messiah stated that the holidays and lifestyle were to be completely abandoned. For example, Sukkot (the Feast of Tabernacles), and Pesach (the Passover) were to be observed as a lasting ordinance (Lev. 23) Again, these statutes were never meant to be a means of attaining righteousness; rather, they were a means of seeing the holiness and majesty of the Almighty.

How many times did the Messiah go to Jerusalem to celebrate the Passover (John 6) , Sukkkot (John 7), or even Hannukah (see John 10)? (Those are just a few quick references, there are others recorded in the Gospels). And if our L-rd Himself celebrated the festivals, shouldn’t also we follow His example???

The summation of the Law was to love the L-rd your G-d with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength (Deut. 6) If we are no longer under obligation to follow the Law/Older Testament, should we disregard this ordinance as well?

I agree that the statues wihich the Lord enjoined on us were not a means of righteousness in themselves. They are an aid in fulfilling the Law of God—that is to Love God with all your heart, soul, and mind and your neighbor as yourself.
God honors those who honor him through adherence to these laws and disciplines. We have in Maccabees, the story of the mother who watched her seven sons die rather than be unfaithful to God by eating pork. While the Catholic Church no longer asks us to abstain from meat on Fridays throughout the year, many still maintain this discipline as a way to honor God.
Jesus was obedient to His Father throughout his earthly life and He calls us to this same obedience. “It is not the one who cries 'Lord, Lord” who will enter the kingdom of heaven but the one who does the will of the Father."

 

[2ndGen]

COGHOBDOJ;3151242:

estesbob;3150963:

I think what you post highlights a major problem with Protestant denominations-it’s very much about emotion and very little about worship and unfortunately very little is based on the truth. Yes Jesus created us and yes he is our Lord and Savior. But obviously there is more to salvation and justification than that. And again you tell us your faith is based on Scripture but I ask you again how do you know your personal interpretation is correct? I have a minor in theology, and spent four years in the seminary, and I do not feel myself in anyway qualified to offer personal interpretations of Scripture.

Jesus did not ascend into heaven and leave us on our own. For the better part of 1500 years people recognized this and aceded to the authority of the one true Church. Protestantism replaced the authority of the Church with the authority of the individual and we have seen the chaos that ensued.

Know what’s odd? I’ve been to and have watched countless of hours on Christian TV non-Catholic Christian services.

It’s like watching the same show. Over and over. Year after year. The message doesn’t grow, doesn’t evolve, doesn’t get passed a certain point.

It’s like watching a video on YouTube that is set on repeat…as soon as the showing is over, it goes right back to the beginning and starts all over again…it’s like their preaching is looped.

I’m not making a personal judgement, but don’t those attending those services ever wonder what about the rest of Christianity?

I love their form of worship though.
I love praying with them.
I love to genuflect when I lead the prayers.
This look comes on some of their faces.

LOL!

The more experienced fellowshippers love it when I genuflect.

 

[estesbob]

estesbob;3151281:

COGHOBDOJ;3151242:

.

LOL!

The more experienced fellowshippers love it when I genuflect.

I had lunch woth an evangelical client last week and he said a blessing before the meal-you should have seen the look on his face when i m,ade the sign of the cross.!

 

[2ndGen]

2ndGen;3151545:

estesbob;3151281:

I had lunch woth an evangelical client last week and he said a blessing before the meal-you should have seen the look on his face when i m,ade the sign of the cross.!

 

[COGHOBDOJ]

2ndGen;3151545:

estesbob;3151281:

I had lunch woth an evangelical client last week and he said a blessing before the meal-you should have seen the look on his face when i m,ade the sign of the cross.!

I’ll challenge you in the same spirit I was challenged:

Do you genuflect and make the sign of the cross to get that reaction? Cause if you do, “you have already received your reward.”

 

[COGHOBDOJ]

Know what’s odd? I’ve been to and have watched countless of hours on Christian TV non-Catholic Christian services.

It’s like watching the same show. Over and over. Year after year. The message doesn’t grow, doesn’t evolve, doesn’t get passed a certain point.

That may be subjective. You may have had a bias. If you do not attend a service with the expectation of being fed spiritually, you probably won’t be fed.

Just to show the difference, when I attended my first Protestant service, the message was alive. My spirit was fed with fresh revelation. Even though some of you believe it was only an emotional experience, it has lasted for 6 years.

When I went back to the Catholic Mass, the Mass seemed like the same show, over and over. The message didn’t grow, only the homily changed. And my priest didn’t have many life experiences to share, learn or teach from.

So, just wanted to give a different perspective.

 

[2ndGen]

estesbob;3151580:

2ndGen;3151545:

I’ll challenge you in the same spirit I was challenged:

Do you genuflect and make the sign of the cross to get that reaction? Cause if you do, “you have already received your reward.”

I was literally going to write this when I wrote about my experience, but I didn’t think it was neccesary. I didn’t think that anybody would ask me such a question because at the core of that question is the insinuation that I,as a Catholic, woud use my faith to make someone feel uncomfortable.

When I prayed in a Jewish Temple, by a Moslem Mosque, in a Protestant Church, I considered for a split second “not” genuflecting.

Then I remembered Jesus’ words…
Matthew 10:
32
Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men,
him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
33
But whosoever shall deny me before men,
him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

So, I swore to never allow my fear of what others could or would think of me keep me from practicing my faith.

 

[2ndGen]

That may be subjective. You may have had a bias. If you do not attend a service with the expectation of being fed spiritually, you probably won’t be fed.

Just to show the difference, when I attended my first Protestant service, the message was alive. My spirit was fed with fresh revelation. Even though some of you believe it was only an emotional experience, it has lasted for 6 years.

When I went back to the Catholic Mass, the Mass seemed like the same show, over and over. The message didn’t grow, only the homily changed. And my priest didn’t have many life experiences to share, learn or teach from.

So, just wanted to give a different perspective.

Can you eat the same cereal for breakfast, lunch and dinner day after day and year after year?

I can’t. I want the whole Bible. I’m not content to the limits of man. I want more. I never get enough Jesus. I understand the difficulty in churches that have only been around for 20 years to produce a clergy anywhwere near the holy richness of The Priesthood though so I really can’t blame them.

See, you have Christ and that’s enough.

We have Christ and God and the sacraments and tradition and, oh well, you get it.

That’s another thing, NCC’s don’t talk about God much.
They only talk about Jesus as if God isn’t neccessary.

(Of course, the whole “God and Jesus are one in the same to in talking about Jesus we’re talking about God!” argument can spring up, so let me be clearer…they only talk about Jesus the man).

Not saying all do, but just the one’s I’ve experienced in over 5 states over 3 decades.

By the way, I would never belittle your experience at your service. How you feel at your service I feel at mine (just I feel it at mine everytime I go to Mass).

Like I always say, if you feel God (or maybe just Jesus in your church! LOL! That’s a joke related to the prior paragraphs on this post! LOL!), more power to you and that’s where you belong brother.

Pax

 

[jmcrae]

I wanted to come back to this question, especially as several other posts referred to Messianic Jews as a denomination. Generally speaking, a denomination will build churches that identify themselves; for example, Methodist, Nazarene, Assembly of God, etc. I have not seen a church identifying itself as Messianic Jew.

Probably because they are quite rare - it’s not a very popular choice of religion, although it certainly has dedicated followers.

The majority of these temples would be found in the New York area, I would expect. They are not actually Jews, themselves - they are Gentiles who follow the Jewish liturgical year and Jewish dietary laws, etc., in aid of worshipping Jesus. They have also put out quite a bit of literature.

BRB - something is beeping …