Why the bible is most assuredly not a Catholic book,

[PRmerger]

The blood of Christ is more powerfull than all the demons in hell

God has given His Church the power of the blood of Jesus and the gates of hell can not prevail against it.

Amen! 2 very Catholic statements above.

 

[Hisalone]

Yes, it does. Matthew 16:18-19, John 17, John 21:15-19, and the entire Book of Acts testify to ONE Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. Not myriad conflicting denominations.

No one denies that Jesus established a church, His Church.
Where we disagree is in the nature, makeup and how that Church should function.

Jesus has His Church thanks to the Catholic Church and dispite of the Catholic Church…

 

[jmcrae]

No one denies that Jesus established a church, His Church.
Where we disagree is in the nature, makeup and how that Church should function.

Jesus has His Church thanks to the Catholic Church and dispite of the Catholic Church…

Jesus quite obviously appointed Peter as the first Pope. Where is Peter’s Successor? No one dares claim a successor for Peter, except for the Catholic Church.

Therefore, it follows that the Catholic Church is actually the one that Jesus set up, with Peter in charge of it. He said “The gates of Hell shall not prevail against you.” He didn’t say, “Well, in about 1500 years, the gates of Hell are going to prevail against you, and then I’m going to set up about a hundred other churches to take over from you, each with different doctrines and different ideas about morality.”

 

[Hisalone]

Jesus quite obviously appointed Peter as the first Pope. Where is Peter’s Successor? No one dares claim a successor for Peter, except for the Catholic Church.

Therefore, it follows that the Catholic Church is actually the one that Jesus set up, with Peter in charge of it. He said “The gates of Hell shall not prevail against you.” He didn’t say, “Well, in about 1500 years, the gates of Hell are going to prevail against you, and then I’m going to set up about a hundred other churches to take over from you, each with different doctrines and different ideas about morality.”

I disagree from the start. Jesus establisheed a people of God that is what church means the assembly or people of God. Peter was a leader but to go from the leader Peter was to “pope” is a very great leap indeed.

 

[Lampo]

Im a fallible human being. I am in good company the apostles were fallible human beings.

But unlike you, the apostles were fallible except when pronouncing on faith and morals. That’s good that you admit that your concept of the New Covenant could very likely be erroneous.

 

[Filius_Prodigus]

1. Jehovah Witnesses proclaim Jesus as Lord.
   (I do believe Catholics have a better understanding of Jesus as Lord that do the JWs)
2. What does this have to do with any of the discussion we are having?
3. The Reformation is a direct result of the Catholic Church being unfaithfull to the mission, the promises and to the purpose that was given to the true Church of God.

The so-called “Reformation” was not a real reformation, it was a theological and ecclesiological rebellion, and we can apply that word nobody likes: heresy. Neither of those I mentioned (Luther, Zwingli, Calvin) trusted their interpretations enough to leave it in the hands of the magisterium and Christ’s promise of presence in the ekklesia, and did not wait for a Church Council. When the Council did occur in a city the CC chose for its closeness to the Germanic world (Trento, now in northern Italy close to modern Austria and Switzerland), they nor any representative of them showed up. In other words they wanted to break away, they wanted to follow their own minds. Zwingli decided not to agree with Luther, nor did Luther propose meeting and agreeing to agree on matters of faith or ecclesial organization… even among themselves, which anyone would think would be natural allies and like-minded folk.

Also, this has everything to do with the discussion. Protestants believe in Bible-only (sola scriptura) read-by-yourself-alone and decide whatever you would like to believe in. It has nothing to do with what Jesus commanded. He never said he would be there “with anyone of you, alone, ignoring everybody else and following your hearts desire”, in turn what he did say was he would be there in the midst of us.

The RCC is Bible-based, though not by means of (unaided) individual study alone, but congregated in whole-church Council (and the Pope in between councils, who by the way was the leader of the Church as recorded in the Church Fathers and beyond. See: catholic.com/library/Peter_Primacy.asp and catholic.com/library/Peter_and_the_Papacy.asp).

 

[Lampo]

1. The Reformation is a direct result of the Catholic Church being unfaithfull to the mission, the promises and to the purpose that was given to the true Church of God.

No, the Reformation is a direct result of sinful men within the Catholic Church…

 

[oneGODoneCHURCH]

I find it ironic that those that test that the bible is the word of God do not trust the Church that decied what books would comprise the word of God. give or take the 7 duetro cannonical books from the Old testment. All those that do not accept the Catholic Churchs cannon of the Bible need to ask themselves how they can accept any cannon? The religious identity of the authors of the individules books is not being disputed. All were Hebrew/Jewish, but for one. What makes the Bible a Catholic Chirstian book, or more correctly a collections of Books and Letters is that it was Bishops of the Catholic Church that came together in council lead by the Holy Spirit the complied It.

Many writting were being used at the time and that is why the council dealt with this what was going to be The NEWTESTEMENT and what was not. Many were not as they contained Hearicies hear is a list of what was left out form this web site

interfaith.org/christianity/apocrypha/

1.1 The Epistles of Jesus to Abgarus
2. Pseudo-apostolic (general) apocrypha
2.1 Teachings of the Twelve Apostles (Didache)
2.2 Epistle of the Apostles

1. Pseudo-apostolic (specific - by Apostle) apocrypha
   3.1 - Andrew -
   3.1.1 Acts of Andrew
   3.1.2 Acts of Andrew and Matthias*

3.2 - Barnabas -
3.2.1 Acts of Barnabas*
3.2.2 Epistle of Barnabas
3.2.3 Gospel of Barnabas

3.3 - Bartholomew -
3.3.1 Gospel of Bartholomew
3.3.2 Martyrdom of Bartholomew*

3.4 - James -
3.4.1 Apocryphon of James
3.4.2 Book of James (protevangelium)
3.4.3 First Apocalypse of James
3.4.4 Second Apocalypse of James

3.5 - John -
3.5.1 Acts of John
3.5.2 Acts of John the Theologian*
3.5.3 Apocryphon of John (long version)
3.5.4 Book of John the Evangelist
3.5.5 Revelation of John the Theologian*

3.6 - Mark -
3.6.1 Secret Gospel of Mark

3.7 - Matthew -
3.7.1 Acts and Martyrdom of St. Matthew the Apostle*
3.7.2 The Martyrdom of Matthew

3.8 - Nicodemus -
3.8.1 Gospel (Acts) of Nicodemus (aka The Acts of Pontius Pilate)

3.9 - Peter -
3.9.1 Acts of Peter
3.9.2 Acts of Peter and Andrew
3.9.3 Apocalypse of Peter - version 1
3.9.4 Apocalypse of Peter - version 2
3.9.5 Gospel of Peter
3.9.6 Letter of Peter to Philip

3.10 - Philip -
3.10.1 Acts of Philip
3.10.2 Gospel of Philip

3.11 - Thaddeus -
3.11.1 Acts of Thaddeus (Epistles of Pontius Pilate)*
3.11.2 Teaching of Thaddeus

3.12 - Thomas -
3.12.1 Acts of Thomas
3.12.2 Apocalypse of Thomas
3.12.3 Book of Thomas the Contender
3.12.4 Consumation of Thomas
3.12.5 Gospel of Thomas

1. Pseudo-Pauline apocrypha
   4.1 3 Corinthians
   4.2 Acts 29
   4.3 Acts of Paul
   4.4 Acts of Paul and Thecla
   4.5 Acts of Peter and Paul*
   4.6 Acts of Xanthippe and Polyxena
   4.7 Apocalypse of Paul
   4.8 Apocalypse of Paul - other version
   4.9 Epistle to the Laodiceans
   4.10 Revelation of Paul*
   4.11 Paul and Seneca
2. Infancy Gospels apocrypha
   5.1 Arabic Infancy Gospel
   5.2 First Infancy Gospel of Jesus Christ
   5.3 Infancy Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew
   5.4 Infancy Gospel of Thomas - Greek A
   5.5 Infancy Gospel of Thomas - Greek B
   5.6 Infancy Gospel of Thomas - Latin
3. Relatives of Jesus apocrypha
   6.1 Gospel of Mary
   6.2 Gospel of the Nativity of Mary
   6.3 Book of John concerning the dormition of Mary (transitus mariæ)*
   6.4 History of Joseph the Carpenter*
   6.5 Narrative of Joseph of Arimathaea
4. Sub-canonical (disputed canon) apocrypha
   7.1 Shepherd of Hermas
   7.2 II Clement
   7.3 Diatession
   7.4 Gospel of the Lord (Marcion)
5. Other significant Epistles and pseudomynous writings and apocrypha
   8.1 I Clement
   8.2 Avenging of the Saviour
   8,3 Epistles of Pontius Pilate
   8.4 Letter of Aristeas
   8.5 Sentences of the Sextus
   8.6 Alexandrians
   8.7 Revelations of Stephen
   8.8 Muratonian Canon (fragment)
6. Fragments of lost apocryphal books
   9.1 Gospel of the Ebionites
   9.2 Gospel of the Egyptians
   9.3 Egerton Gospel (Egerton Papyrus 2)*
   9.4 Gospel of the Hebrews
   9.5 Traditions of Mattias
   9.6 Gospel of the Nazaraeans
   9.7 Preaching of Peter

now if you accept that they do not belong in the NT. that the Coucil that complied it got it right. then you would have to also accept the OT as complied by the same coucil of Bishops of the Catholic Church.

Hisalone This is not a matter of Protestant verse Cathloic this is a matter of secular History ans well as Church History. The Fisrt century Christians may not have referred t themselves as Catholic But that is what they were. As there is no other other way to look at them. The churches in each town were started be a Apostel. the Apostels wrote to each church and were in union of beleif with each other. and the Bishops today can trae themselves back to the Apostels . Dear Prostestant brothers even the Orthodox recongnize that at one time there was unity of the Whole Church. There is one Church and that Church gave us the Bible.

 

[Bill_Pick]

A very GOOD post but I think it is on deaf ears

 

[oneGODoneCHURCH]

No, the Reformation is a direct result of sinful men within the Catholic Church…

True up to a point. As all men are by nature sinful and it is by Gods Grace that we are able to void and forgiven for sin. also the reformation is the result of mans inability to listen to one another. And also the result of the secular polital powers useing this unrest within the Church for polictcal gain. One quick look will show that most every point that Luther made was address and dealt with at the council of Trent. Now If he had not been under the influnece of the germanic princes of the time in their ploy to gain power from the Emperor It is my belief that he and the populous that followed him would have returned tounion with Rome. If this had happened it is doubtful that Calvin or Zwigli would have had near the influence that they had and Henry VIII would not have possibly broken away as well.