Why the Catholic Church Is Wise to Ban Condoms

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Michael C:
It is 100% Gauranteed that you will not get AIDS by driving to church.
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Nope that isnt 100% either 😛 what if you get in an accident and the people who come to help you are infected and they get cut working on getting you out of the car and dont relize it, then they touching all your cuts and thinking the blood is from you, presto not 100%
lol

as far as the Afrcans having such a hard time with aids,they can claim what they want to there is not as many fornicating as they make you believe, they have the highest HIV in the world along with malaria,west nile, etc I am sorry but i believe that if a mosquito lands and gets a good half bite on an HIV infected person then gets “shooed” off and lands on a non infected person very soon after and starts to “fill up” there is a really good chance of infecting the “clean person” which would also be a reason they have such an HIV/aids problem there…I think they just stress the opposite to avoid massive panick…I mean it can be transferred by “needles” well a mosquito has a form of a needle as a tongue so to speak why do they make it sound so different…

My normal useless 2 cents
John
 
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she_he:
I am sorry but i believe that if a mosquito lands and gets a good half bite on an HIV infected person then gets “shooed” off and lands on a non infected person very soon after and starts to “fill up” there is a really good chance of infecting the “clean person” which would also be a reason they have such an HIV/aids problem there.
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The mosquito/AIDS link has been proven false many times over:

rci.rutgers.edu/~insects/aids.htm

The problem in Africa is IV drugs and sex, end of story. If you think telling people to abstain is the answer in a culture where women are property and human rights often don’t exist, you need to learn more about Africa.

Nohome
 
The problem is that promoting condoms encourages MORE promiscuous behavior. It is a fact that the only African country that has witnessed a decline in AIDS is the country (can’t remember which) is the one that, most due to pressure from the Catholic Church, instituted an abstinence-only sex-ed program.
I really wish I had a source for that!
 
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vluvski:
The problem is that promoting condoms encourages MORE promiscuous behavior. It is a fact that the only African country that has witnessed a decline in AIDS is the country (can’t remember which) is the one that, most due to pressure from the Catholic Church, instituted an abstinence-only sex-ed program.
I really wish I had a source for that!
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It’s Uganda, but it is not abstinence-only. They have the ABC program - A = Abstinance, B = Be faithful, C = Condoms. Because they include a strong push for abstinence, their rate of AIDs is much lower than other African nations.

This is a piece negative towards abstinence (of course…it’s backed by the evil Bush administration 😉 ), but it gives the data:
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4433069.stm
 
The logic is clear.

People who argue continuously for condoms and promiscuity do so from hard hearts and pure selfishness; simply put.
 
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rlg94086:
It’s Uganda, but it is not abstinence-only. They have the ABC program - A = Abstinance, B = Be faithful, C = Condoms. Because they include a strong push for abstinence, their rate of AIDs is much lower than other African nations.

This is a piece negative towards abstinence (of course…it’s backed by the evil Bush administration 😉 ), but it gives the data:
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4433069.stm
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Thanks for the link. I kept thinking Uganda or Congo, but I wasn’t sure.
For a second, I thought you were saying the article was backed by the Bush admin. :eek: Glad I misunderstood.
 
You are right! I worded it very poorly. I’m glad you were able to make sense of it.

While I’m against condoms, I think the Uganda ABC program is very sensible. It basically says, “don’t have promiscuous sex”, but if you are going to play russian roullette just for sexual pleasure, then “use a condom.”
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vluvski:
Thanks for the link. I kept thinking Uganda or Congo, but I wasn’t sure.
For a second, I thought you were saying the article was backed by the Bush admin. :eek: Glad I misunderstood.
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Condoms gotta be better than 90%. Even the CDC isn’t so politically manipulated to not see the horrendous truth that such a statistic would mean. If it only prevented AIDS at a 90% rate, then you would statistically have a 95% chance of getting AIDS if you had sex with an infected spouse 28 times.

But even if it is 98% effective (which I believe is its anti-pregnancy rating) you would have an 87% chance of getting AIDS after 100 incidents of intercourse.

Even 98% is fools odds. No loving spouse would do that. If nohome thinks that is similar to the risk of driving to church, I suggest some driving lessons. (and I’d hate to know your insurance premiums!)
 
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manualman:
Condoms gotta be better than 90%. Even the CDC isn’t so politically manipulated to not see the horrendous truth that such a statistic would mean. If it only prevented AIDS at a 90% rate, then you would statistically have a 95% chance of getting AIDS if you had sex with an infected spouse 28 times.

But even if it is 98% effective (which I believe is its anti-pregnancy rating) you would have an 87% chance of getting AIDS after 100 incidents of intercourse.

Even 98% is fools odds. No loving spouse would do that. If nohome thinks that is similar to the risk of driving to church, I suggest some driving lessons. (and I’d hate to know your insurance premiums!)
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What level of risk would a loving spouse accept?

Do you disagree with the CDC?
 
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vluvski:
The problem is that promoting condoms encourages MORE promiscuous behavior. It is a fact that the only African country that has witnessed a decline in AIDS is the country (can’t remember which) is the one that, most due to pressure from the Catholic Church, instituted an abstinence-only sex-ed program.
I really wish I had a source for that!
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Maybe you were thinking of this source:

ipsnews.net/africa/Radio/interna.asp?idnews=2655

JOHANNESBURG - A 10-year study on HIV/AIDS prevention in UGANDA suggests that the country’s much-lauded success in tackling the pandemic has little to do with abstinence.

Findings presented at the 12th Annual Retrovirus Conference, in MASSACHUSETTS, U.S.A., show condom-use is on the rise, with 50 percent of men and boys aged 15 to 49 consistently using condoms with their most recent non-marital sex partner.

Chief researcher, Dr MARIA WAWER, is quoted by Reuters as saying that ”By AFRICAN standards that’s incredibly high”, adding that ”condom use is getting better among both sexes.”

The research team, which includes experts from the Johns Hopkins University in the U.S. and UGANDA’s Makerere University, followed the sexual behaviour of ten thousand adults in 44 villages in UGANDA’s RAKAI district for 10 years. (END/ IPS - IRIN PLUSNEWS RADIO BULLETIN/2005)
 
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manualman:
Even 98% is fools odds. No loving spouse would do that. If nohome thinks that is similar to the risk of driving to church, I suggest some driving lessons. (and I’d hate to know your insurance premiums!)
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Turns out they protect much better than 98%

webmd.com/content/article/5/1680_50205.htm?z=1624_00000

A 1994 European study published in the New England Journal of Medicine looked at HIV transmission rates of heterosexual couples with one HIV-infected partner. The study compared the transmission rates for couples who used condoms consistently to those who didn’t. Of the 123 couples who consistently used condoms, none of the HIV-free partners became infected during the study, whereas 12 of the 122 partners who didn’t consistently use condoms became infected.
 
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manualman:
If nohome thinks that is similar to the risk of driving to church, I suggest some driving lessons. (and I’d hate to know your insurance premiums!)
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Nohome thinks you’ve got the wrong guy. Ortho gave us the AIDS/Driving comparison.
 
Why dont we give everyone bull proff vests to that if they get shot they have a chance of the bullet not piercing into them. Its an absurd notion and the Church has every right and all the Truths of God to back them up. As Jesus said himself " He who hears you , hears me" he said this to his apostles referring to them as the Church, what laws they establish after he has left them as a result of modernization , such as condoms , are his laws as well ( based on his guidelines and earlier laws).
 
Can you find some better data or more detail from the study?

“50 percent of men and boys aged 15 to 49 consistently using condoms with their most recent non-marital sex partner” tells me that of those who had sex, 50% used condoms. It doesn’t tell me anything about the percentage of people who are abstaining versus having sex.
Either the study’s conclusions are seriously flawed, or the person who wrote the article doesn’t have any capability to think logically.
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Nohome:
Maybe you were thinking of this source:

ipsnews.net/africa/Radio/interna.asp?idnews=2655

JOHANNESBURG - A 10-year study on HIV/AIDS prevention in UGANDA suggests that the country’s much-lauded success in tackling the pandemic has little to do with abstinence.

Findings presented at the 12th Annual Retrovirus Conference, in MASSACHUSETTS, U.S.A., show condom-use is on the rise, with 50 percent of men and boys aged 15 to 49 consistently using condoms with their most recent non-marital sex partner.

Chief researcher, Dr MARIA WAWER, is quoted by Reuters as saying that ”By AFRICAN standards that’s incredibly high”, adding that ”condom use is getting better among both sexes.”

The research team, which includes experts from the Johns Hopkins University in the U.S. and UGANDA’s Makerere University, followed the sexual behaviour of ten thousand adults in 44 villages in UGANDA’s RAKAI district for 10 years. (END/ IPS - IRIN PLUSNEWS RADIO BULLETIN/2005)
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Nohome:
Turns out they protect much better than 98%

webmd.com/content/article/5/1680_50205.htm?z=1624_00000

A 1994 European study published in the New England Journal of Medicine looked at HIV transmission rates of heterosexual couples with one HIV-infected partner. The study compared the transmission rates for couples who used condoms consistently to those who didn’t. Of the 123 couples who consistently used condoms, none of the HIV-free partners became infected during the study, whereas 12 of the 122 partners who didn’t consistently use condoms became infected.
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You’d think it’d be best (though not ethical) to have a group without condoms… As the couples that did become infected could have happened during the use of a condom…

Though, I like the “‘Correct and consistent condom use,’ says CDC’s Peterson, ‘could break the back of the AIDS epidemic.’”
Of course abstinance and faithful relationships wouldn’t do that :o
 
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Nohome:
Turns out they protect much better than 98%

webmd.com/content/article/5/1680_50205.htm?z=1624_00000

A 1994 European study published in the New England Journal of Medicine looked at HIV transmission rates of heterosexual couples with one HIV-infected partner. The study compared the transmission rates for couples who used condoms consistently to those who didn’t. Of the 123 couples who consistently used condoms, none of the HIV-free partners became infected during the study, whereas 12 of the 122 partners who didn’t consistently use condoms became infected.
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As the CDC says, they should be used consistently and correctly.
 
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Nohome:
Nohome thinks you’ve got the wrong guy. Ortho gave us the AIDS/Driving comparison.
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I did. And I’ve sat here giggling as Nohome took the heat.
 
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willy:
Why dont we give everyone bull proff vests to that if they get shot they have a chance of the bullet not piercing into them. Its an absurd notion and the Church has every right and all the Truths of God to back them up. As Jesus said himself " He who hears you , hears me" he said this to his apostles referring to them as the Church, what laws they establish after he has left them as a result of modernization , such as condoms , are his laws as well ( based on his guidelines and earlier laws).
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Bulletproof vests are an excellent idea if one is going to be around active bullets. Condoms are an excellent idea if one is going to be around active sex. Don’t go unprotected around either.
 
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CatholicCid:
You’d think it’d be best (though not ethical) to have a group without condoms… As the couples that did become infected could have happened during the use of a condom…

Though, I like the “‘Correct and consistent condom use,’ says CDC’s Peterson, ‘could break the back of the AIDS epidemic.’”
Of course abstinance and faithful relationships wouldn’t do that :o
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The CDC said abstinence and faithful relationships work just fine. Why do you say they wouldn’t? Disagree with the CDC?
 
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