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CMatt25
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Republicans laying off govt workers at the state and local levels has probably had an impact on making the unemployment rate worse too.
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CMatt25
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Seriously you should have talked to my mother and other family members who actually lived in WV during the Great Depression before making such a statement.
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ishii
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No kidding.
Depression circa 1937: Soup kitchens and “brother can you spare a dime.”
Depression circa 2011: " When my unemployment benefits finally run out it will actually be job-searching time."
Ishii
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oldcelt
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Indeed,
John
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Nec5
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A pity your economics class didn’t mention that the metrics used today are different than the ones used decades ago. It’s equally a pity that your course did not teach you about how political entities manipulate the actual figures just as they now measure inflation without looking at food and energy prices.
All the pollyanna’s seem to have come to visit this thread. I guess they loved the “summer of recovery”.
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principio
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I don’t know where anyone else lives, but if you live anywhere near me, go outside and look around… Do you see just how much ***stuff ***there is out there?? I went to Walmart today (yeah… sorry) to look at vacuume cleaners, there are enough cheap vacuume cleaners in Colorado for every man, woman and child to last into the next century… Why are we selling so many vacuume cleaners? That’s what our economy is running on, we think we can sustain ourselves having workers stock shelves with $40 vacuume cleaners. It seems pointless to me.
We can’t afford to pay anyone in this country to make useful things, but we expect everyone to buy junk.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but Obama isn’t doing this.
We can’t afford to pay anyone in this country to make useful things, but we expect everyone to buy junk.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but Obama isn’t doing this.
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loneviking
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Why? Because the depression of today seems to look a bit different than the one then?
The two should look different, in spite of the similarities:
In the 30’s, we were largely an agricultural nation. Our money was tied to the gold standard which limited just how much money could be printed. In the 20’s a lot of new wealth had been created, but the value was greatly inflated. When the collapse happened in '29, we had shortages of money. In the early 30’s, ironically, there were huge surpluses of grain in states like Kansas, Oklahoma and parts of Texas. At the same time, people were going hungry in other parts of this country. As the depression continued on, the natural disaster known as the dust bowl came into play. As the depression deepened, you had more people riding the rails (and there weren’t that many rails compared to the highways of today), and you had Hoovervilles of the unemployed. There were government programs to help solve the problems, such as the WPA and the Rural Electrification Board, and the creation of Social Security. And, in reaction to the depression, communism became quite a movement in our country up until the 1950’s.
Today, we are a nation of city dwellers. Our money today is tied to nothing but the ‘full faith and CREDIT’ of the American people. And credit (and by extension, money) is in short supply. Why? We’ve overextended our credit by living on debt, and by our banks speculating in derivitives. We don’t have hunger in this country, yet. But, if the natural disasters such as the recent flooding in the Midwest continue, we can. Huge amounts of farmland where much of our corn and soybeans are grown is still underwater. Just as in the 30’s, you have tent cities all over this country. The media usually doesn’t say much about it, but they do exist. There are also thousands of vacant, foreclosed homes that squatters use. You don’t see huge numbers on the move, useing trains to get around, because today they use cars and the interstate highway system. Federal government has the various programs to help homeowners avoid foreclosure. There is the Federal foodstamp program, and Obamacare, which compares to Social Security in creating a new etitlement program. Much like communism in the 30’s, the reaction to the excesses of today are in the Tea Party movement.
Do I need to go on? We are in a depression, it is not getting better, and the fools in Washington are going to spend us into a point of no return, no chance of things turning around.
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CMatt25
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No not for me if you think we are in a depression as bad as the 1930s. God bless you and peace.
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loneviking
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OK…I’m going to respond to your observations in two posts. First ‘Obama isn’t doing this’.
I don’t recall anybody posting on the thread that it’s all Obamas fault. I and another poster were talking about the Bilderberger group that has been working towards Americas downfall, and a new world order, for almost a century. Obama is playing his part, to be sure:
By quadrupling the amount of yearly debt when measured against the debt during the Bush administration;
By refusing, along with Congress, to seriously cut Federal spending, and reducing the deficit;
By getting us involved in still more wars (or hostile actions if you please) in Libya, Yemen and apparently, soon in Syria. Wars that are costing us billions of dollars a week.
By greatly enlarging the size of the Federal government, especially with his Obamacare which if it goes into effect will require 15,000 new IRS agents alone.
By going against the will of Congress and making sure that the EPA makes and enforces new rules against power plants that will make your energy costs go up.
By denying drilling permits, by direct Presidential directive to the EPA, despite a drilling moratorium having been lifted by Congress, which will increase our energy costs.
I could go on for page after page of costly actions this president has taken that are wrecking our economy. The man acts like a dictator for life, instead of a president!
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loneviking
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Yes, it is pointless, and welcome to the new America and the New World Order! The average worker will make minimum wage, and the shelves will be full of cheaply made goods.
Why? That’s where things get complicated. In large part, quality American manufacturing was driven from our shores to places overseas. Corporate taxes, regulations, labor regulations, unions and their demands, along with changing consumer tastes all combined to make it far easier and more profitable for many companies to relocate overseas.
It’s far more profitable to make products in China or Mexico, using labor that costs $5 dollars a day, than here in America. In turn, that means that you can find near our port cities, cargo containers piled up by the thousands. Lots of goods coming into the states, but not much being exported which results in a trade inbalance.
Put that together with a consumer that is more than happy to buy cheap junk from overseas and yes, you do get a pointless carousel that just keeps going around and around.
The good news is that there are small manufacturers still making quality goods here in America. Instead of the cheap $40 vacumns, you can spend a few hundred (or maybe get lucky at an auction for much less) and buy a Kirby. Kirby, heavy and made of metal instead of plastic. Or, instead of buying cheap shoes that provide little support for your feet and wear out in a few months, buy a pair of handmade shoes that can be rebuilt and will last for decades. Or, buy wool socks and learn to ‘darn’ them (which you can’t do to cotton socks) to save some money. There are some very thin, very soft wool socks out there that can last for years.
I could go on and on about quality products that are still available. You have to hunt for them, and you may have to pay good money for them, but they are worth it. Whenever possible, I prefer to buy quality products built here in America and leave the cheap junk alone.
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CMatt25
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Ishii, we can thank God people have such benefits for in their time of need today. Circa 2011 vs circa 1937. And among those we also have to thank are people of faith who voted into office folks who would, along with and in addition to private individuals and faith based communities, work towards providing benefits for those in need.
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Scott_Lafrance
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Actually, Royal vacuums are a better product than the Kirby, in fact Kirby basically modelled their cleaner after the Royal Everlast line. The difference is that Kirby uses a plastic suction fan, where Royal uses a metal on. It is nearly impossible to destroy a Royal. For the same price as a Dyson, you can buy the last vacuum you will ever need to buy that has more suction and cleans deeper than the Dyson.
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Monte_RCMS
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The inventory of vacuum cleaners and the SALES of vacuum cleaners are two totally different things.
It’s when people actually BUY the vacuum cleaners that the economy is picking up.
So, when you say “why are we selling so many vacuum cleaners”, … we may not actually be selling vacuum cleaners. What you are seeing is the store being full of vacuum cleaners.
Doesn’t mean that anyone is actually buying them.
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Monte_RCMS
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credit-to-cash-advisor.com/Resources/USBankruptcyStatistics/MonthlyUSBankruptcyFilings
Number of bankruptcies by month since 2004.
Number of bankruptcies by month since 2004.
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curlycool89
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Uh, that’s what I just said. The reported unemployment figure is cut off at a certain point, and it wouldn’t be surprising if they tried to make it look better. The actual unemployment is always higher and will include longer-term unemployment, which is a metric that doesn’t usually matter because we don’t usually have such a high long-tern unemployment.
Inflation doesn’t usually include energy prices because it’s too volatile. It’s an outlier, it throws off the average. As far as I know, food is usually included. Maybe it’s just here in Canada, but out “regular” inflation includes food, and Stats Canada usually gives out a second figure including energy. Maybe it’s just you guys.
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principio
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Yeah… That’s even worse.
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principio
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Actually someone DID buy the vacuume cleaners… Walmart bought them from China.
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loneviking
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Yeah…and to continue the economics lesson, what happens if no one wants to buy the vacumn cleaners at the posted price? The difference between what Walmart paid, and what the market (you and I) will pay is the profit margin for Walmart. Inventory, sitting on the shelves and not moving, means lost profit. So, what happens? A sale–the price is dropped until it meets what the market will pay.Actually someone DID buy the vacuume cleaners… Walmart bought them from China.
Add to this that Walmart figured out a long time ago that inventory on the shelves equals lost profit. So, they figured out a ordering/shipping system that is ‘just in time’—replacement goods come in ‘just in time’ to replace goods sold. Now, to do this requires two things:
- A market that isn’t volatile…prices going up or down rapidly. Inflation is already here, and hyperinflation is potentially (more than likely) on the horizon. and
- Cheap fuel costs to move the products from wherever they arrive at to the Walmart stores. And fuel costs are going up! I read somewhere that if fuel prices were to reach the six to seven dollars a gallon range, Walmart would be toast.
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principio
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Wow! It’s like I’m back in Biz Skool againYeah…and to continue the economics lesson, what happens if no one wants to buy the vacumn cleaners at the posted price? The difference between what Walmart paid, and what the market (you and I) will pay is the profit margin for Walmart. Inventory, sitting on the shelves and not moving, means lost profit. So, what happens? A sale–the price is dropped until it meets what the market will pay.
Add to this that Walmart figured out a long time ago that inventory on the shelves equals lost profit. So, they figured out a ordering/shipping system that is ‘just in time’—replacement goods come in ‘just in time’ to replace goods sold. Now, to do this requires two things:
Try this on as a thinking exercise: What happens if your local Walmarts go out of business? In so many places, Walmart took away so much business from the little local mom and pops stores that they had to close. So, if Walmart now goes under, where do you buy clothes? Groceries? Lawn mowers? Something to think about…
- A market that isn’t volatile…prices going up or down rapidly. Inflation is already here, and hyperinflation is potentially (more than likely) on the horizon. and
- Cheap fuel costs to move the products from wherever they arrive at to the Walmart stores. And fuel costs are going up! I read somewhere that if fuel prices were to reach the six to seven dollars a gallon range, Walmart would be toast.
I wish we could continue this discussion over beers, Loneviking.
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loneviking
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Gosh, that sure would be fun!Wow! It’s like I’m back in Biz Skool again
I wish we could continue this discussion over beers, Loneviking.
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