Why was the Mass changed after Vatican II?

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  • The Pope, who wrote a landmark encyclical affirming the Church’s stance on sex during the sexual revolution, allowed himself to be influenced by others.
Humanae Vitae was about as effective as an ABC anti-directive as Jubilate Deo was in preserving Latin in the Mass. One must remember this same Pope wrote the “conscience” clause in Populorum Progressio and assembled many moral theologians who consistently held the pro-ABC position. It appeared that he was being influenced by others and this was enough to convince many bishops that he was relaxing any ABC restriction. Many priests were instructing the faithful about the use of conscience in the matter. By the HV came out, it was much too late to undo the spread of misinformation that had come about regarding birth control.
 
See, for instance, the Thirteenth and Fifteenth sessions of Trent. Here’s a selection from the decrees of the Fifteenth; the bold is mine, and in case it is too long (but who can’t make time in his day to read the decrees of the Sacred Council of Trent?) I will sum it up at the end:
DECREE FOR PROROGUING THE SESSION

Whereas, in pursuance of the decrees made in the last Sessions, this holy and universal Synod has, during these days, most accurately and diligently treated of the things which relate to the most holy sacrifice of the mass, and to the sacrament of order, with the view that, in the Session held on this day, It might publish, as the Holy Ghost should have suggested, decrees on these subjects, and on the four articles concerning the most holy sacrament of the Eucharist, which had been finally deferred to this Session ; and whereas it was thought that, in the interim, there would have presented themselves at this sacred and holy Council those who call themselves Protestants, for whose sake It had deferred the publication of the said articles, and to whom It had given the public faith, or a safe-conduct, that they might come freely and without any hesitation; nevertheless, seeing that they have not as yet come, and the holy Synod has been petitioned in their name, that the publication which was to have been made on this day, be deferred to the following Session, an assured hope being held out that they will certainly be present long before that Session, upon receiving in the meanwhile a safe-conduct in a more ample form : . . .

SAFE-CONDUCT GIVEN TO THE PROTESTANTS

The sacred and holy, ocecumenical and general Synod of Trent,-lawfully assembled in the Holy Ghost, the same Legate and Nuncios of the Apostolic See presiding therein,–adhering to the safe-conduct given in the last Session but one, and enlarging it in the manner following,–certifies to all men,- that by the ten our of these presents, It grants and wholly concedes the public faith, and the fullest and most true security, which they entitle a safe-conduct, to all and singular the priests, electors,-princes, dukes, marquises, counts, barons, nobles, soldiers, commonalty, and to all other persons whatsoever, of what state, condition, or quality soever they may be, of the province and nation of Germany,- and to the cities and other places thereof, and to all other ecclesiastical and Secular persons,- especially those of the Confession of Augsburg,- who shall come, or shall be sent with them, to this General Council of Trent, and to those that shall set forth, or have already repaired hither,- by whatsoever name they are entitled, or may be designated,–to come freely to this city of Trent, and there to remain, abide, sojourn, and to propose, speak and treat of, examine and discuss, any matters whatsoever together with the said Synod, and freely to present and set forth all whatsoever they may think fit, and any articles what-ever, either in writing, or by word of mouth, and to explain, establish, and prove them by the sacred Scriptures, and by the words, passages, and reasons of the blessed Fathers, and to answer even, if it be needful, to the objections of the General Council; and to dispute, or to confer in charity, without any hindrance, with those who may have been selected by the Council, all opprobrious, railing, and contumelious language being utterly discarded; and in particular, that the controverted matters shall be treated of in the aforesaid Council of Trent, according to sacred Scripture, and the traditions of the apostles, approved Councils, the consent of the Catholic Church, and the authorities of the holy Fathers; with this further addition, that they shall not be punished under pretence of religion,- or of offences already committed, or that may be committed, in regard thereof; as also, that the divine offices shall not, on account of their presence, be in any way interrupted, either upon the road, or in any place during their progress, their stay, or their return, or in the city of Trent itself; and that, upon these matters being concluded, or before they are concluded,- if they, or any of them, shall wish, and whensoever such is their or his pleasure, or the command and leave of their superiors, to return to their own homes, they shall forthwith be able at their good pleasure,- to return freely and securely . . . .
. . . It also reciprocally wills, that if, which God forbid, any one, or divers, of this Synod, should, either on the road, or whilst sojourning at, or returning therefrom, perpetrate or commit any heinous act, whereby the benefit of this public faith and assurance may be violated, or in any way set aside, the persons discovered in any such crime shall be forthwith punished by the Synod itself, and not by others,- with a proportionate chastisement and a sufficient reparation, which the Germans of the Confession of Augsburg, who may be present here at the time, may on their part justly approve of and commend,-the present form, conditions and terms of the safe-conduct remaining wholly untouched thereby. . . .
That’s right, they prorogued a whole session of Trent and delayed the publication of articles about the Mass and the Eucharist to give Protestant extra time to come and propose their ideas “and to explain, establish, and prove them by the sacred Scriptures.”
“May be present here at the time” They were invited,given safe passage. Does it say that the Protestants actually arrived?
 
Well, the Protestant influence came from somewhere.
The laity didn’t have the power to change the Mass and probably had no clue that it went as far as to look like a Lutheran service.
I agree. So where did the Protestant influence come from if not the Protestants?
 
I agree. So where did the Protestant influence come from if not the Protestants?
The desire to modernize the Mass is not necessarily “Protestant”, as I have pointed out Protestant churches also went through modernization of their services, for instance the Anglicans.

Personally I think it was just giving into popular trends of the time to ditch out what was “old” and “stuffy”.

It was a 60s thing. As I look at some of the ugly architecture of the 60s that replaced some fine old buildings just because of the desire to be “modern” or “futuristic”, I see that this wasn’t a trend confined to religious services.

Not that I mind the new Mass. The old one had become complicated to the point of ridiculousness. Just look at the rubrics for censing the altar.

What does bother me is that we threw out the baby with the bathwater, in particular our patrimony of sacred music.

Our abbot gave us a really good impromptu talk at our last Oblate’s meeting on this very subject; the reasons for many of the embellishments, such as the way to cense the altar, had become lost in the mists of time, had become difficult to implement correctly, and did not always add to the focal point of the Mass, Jesus Christ made present (an aside, in addition to the Mass, the simplification of the Calendar certainly shouldn’t be neglected, and this simplification makes participation of laymen in the Liturgy of the Hours practical; previously with all the Octaves, special days, degrees of feasts, etc, there were hardly any “ordinary” ferial days left; and ordinary ferial days, in Ordinary Time, to me, are the metronome of prayer life, a richness that had been lost with the excessive complications, and restored and rediscovered).

Fortunately the abbey has sought to create a beautiful liturgy with the OF Mass, using Gregorian chant, that nobody in their right mind could ever confuse with “Protestant”.
 
“May be present here at the time” They were invited,given safe passage. Does it say that the Protestants actually arrived?
Without doing a whole lot of research, I can say, quoting the Catholic Encyclopedia:
In the meantime, ambassadors from several Protestant princes and cities reached Trent. They made various demands, as: that the earlier decisions which were contrary to the Augsburg Confession should be recalled; that debates on questions in dispute between Catholics and Protestants should be deferred; that the subordination of the pope to an ecumenical council should be defined . . . .
That said, I would love to know what people would say if there were a line in the documents of Vatican II that went, “Well, we were going to publish some statements about the Mass and the Eucharist, but we’d greatly prefer having the (name removed by moderator)ut of Protestants about it first before we say anything publicly. So we’re going to hold off for a while until any Protestant who wants to come can get here and prove all his ideas to us.” Can you even imagine what dark meaning people would ascribe to those words? Because that is exactly what the Council of Trent said. 😃

Needless to say, my point is not to run down the Council of Trent here, but to show vividly why the common practice – common in the case of Vatican II, that is – of drawing the wildest adverse inferences from any sort of openness or accommodation to the Protestants is so ill-conceived. If there were a line such as I gave above in the proceedings of Vatican II, there can be no doubt that it would be repeated constantly as irrefutable “proof” that everything which came out of the Council was irretrievably tainted by a maniacal desire (they even admitted it! :eek:) to please the Protestants, to become more Protestant, and so on and so forth. Yet obviously we do not think that in the case of the Council of Trent. This goes to show that arguments about what is “Protestant” have to be made on the basis of the facts, not of insinuations deriving from who was invited to what council.
 
I agree. So where did the Protestant influence come from if not the Protestants?
disclaimer:
I attend the OF, I’m not saying I agree with information posted here. I do find this topic fascinating so I do a lot of digging. 🙂 I’ve limited the information provided here so I don’t get myself in trouble.
disclaimer:

Father Cekada, who I believe is a sede, just wrote a theological critique of the OF Mass (the Mass of Paul VI), this book has been reviewed by Msgr. Andrew Wadsworth who is the current head of the International Commission on the Liturgy (ICEL). ICEL is the group that produces the English Missal. The review can be found here

doctrinaliturgica.com/2011/07/missal-translation-director-praises-cekadas-book-on-the-mass-of-paul-vi/

Here is a quote from Father Cekada about this very topic.

"When I began research for Work of Human Hands, I thought I’d eventually find a lot more on the influence of the Protestant observers than I did. But there wasn’t much about their role in the writings of the members of Consilium most directly involved in creating the Novus Ordo Missae (Bugnini, Braga, Patino, Jungmann, Wagner, etc.).

At first I thought this was because Bugnini and company covered up their role, due to the controversy that erupted in trad circles when the existence of the observers was revealed. In the 1970s, the New Mass looked plenty protestant — Anglicanism with baby-talk English and bad music — so I and many others assumed that this was due to the observers.

However, I eventually concluded what we took for protestantism was in fact primarily the result of modernism, which overlaps in a lot of areas."
 
the simplification of the Calendar certainly shouldn’t be neglected, and this simplification makes participation of laymen in the Liturgy of the Hours practical; previously with all the Octaves, special days, degrees of feasts, etc, there were hardly any “ordinary” ferial days left; and ordinary ferial days, in Ordinary Time, to me, are the metronome of prayer life, a richness that had been lost with the excessive complications, and restored and rediscovered).
This I completely agree with and am thankful for. It’s awesome that the LoTH has been put in the Laity’s hands.
 
The desire to modernize the Mass is not necessarily “Protestant”, as I have pointed out Protestant churches also went through modernization of their services, for instance the Anglicans.

Personally I think it was just giving into popular trends of the time to ditch out what was “old” and “stuffy”.
This is also a valid point as pointed out by James Hitchcock in The Renewal of the Sacred Liturgy.

"The official Roman Catholic liturgical changes implemented after the Second Vatican Council, and the changes in Episcopalian worship contained in the 1974 Prayer Book were not for the most part intended to be radical, although in certain ways they did mark momentous departures from traditional practice, especially in the official language. In the light of unauthorized liturgical practices or of the most advanced liturgical thought, they must be considered relatively conservative, with the exception of the Episcopalian third eucharistic service, which encourages free improvisation and has been adopted by some congregations as their usual celebration.

The severe problems created by free liturgical experimentation do not therefore apply of necessity to the new official rites, which were clearly devised to maintain continuity with the traditions of the past and, most important, to provide norms of liturgical uniformity and stability.

At the same time, these official changes have been of such magnitude (even if dismissed by radicals as timid) as to have caused severe disturbance to many people. That such changes have been authorized by the highest governing bodies of the respective churches has lent support to those who charge that the old rituals are irrelevant; hence the new official liturgies inevitably invite the criticism of not going far enough, of maintaining a timid compromise position. Conspicuous liturgical change under official sanction helps create an atmosphere in which unauthorized changes are more readily dared, in which liturgical stability is undermined, and in which, symbolically, it is declared that a new era has been inaugurated. (Thus some advanced liturgists can accuse the Roman Church of failing to carry out the spirit of the Vatican Council, despite that body’s demonstrable caution in liturgical matters.) Once striking official changes have been mandated, this is taken by many people as a signal for general revolution."

The whole book can be found here

adoremus.org/RecoverySacred.html
 
The only issue, if I remember right, was that Bugnini had done earlier revisions on the Missal (1955) and Pope John XXIII “fired” him, only for him to be rehired by Paul VI to continue the reforms.

Probably more noteworthy, though is that Paul VI actually signed an erroneous document on the Mass. From the book Reform of the Liturgy,
The designation was changed to conform the Missal of Paul VI to the theology of the Mass stated at the Council of Trent. Yet, the Missal itself received very little changes to clearly uphold the sacrificial nature of the Mass and more or less still resembles the heretical designation that once characterized the it; albeit a valid form of the Mass. To state things more lightly, each Missal emphasizes different elements, such as the community in the Ordinary Form and the sacrifice in the Extraordinary Form, simply.
 
Things change with time. Since the people did not understand Latin, it was time for change and it is a BEAUTIFUL change.Prior to that the priests’ back faced us and we couldn’t see what was going on. It is beautiful to see how the bread and wine are changed to the body and blood of christ.

Why have you changed wearing the same clothes the last 20 years?
 
The designation was changed to conform the Missal of Paul VI to the theology of the Mass stated at the Council of Trent. Yet, the Missal itself received very little changes to clearly uphold the sacrificial nature of the Mass and more or less still resembles the heretical designation that once characterized the it; albeit a valid form of the Mass.
This is true, but what is interesting is that even in the newer definition,

“…ad memoriale Domini seu sacrificium eucharisticum celebrandum
(to celebrate the Memorial of the Lord, or the Eucharistic Sacrifice)”

seems to offer the Massgoer a choice of believing one or the other. I wonder if they meant to put the “and” conjunction there. The seu is used in a disjunctive sense, according to my Latin dictionary.
 
Things change with time. Since the people did not understand Latin, it was time for change and it is a BEAUTIFUL change.Prior to that the priests’ back faced us and we couldn’t see what was going on. It is beautiful to see how the bread and wine are changed to the body and blood of christ.

Why have you changed wearing the same clothes the last 20 years?
EVERY liturgical church (and even the Orthodox Jewish synagogue, today) has the priest (or rabbi) facing the front (in the case of Christians, this is the altar he is facing), with his back to the people.

The novus ordo church is the only one that has the priest facing THE PEOPLE.

The Eastern Orthodox and Traditional RC liturgies are regarded as SACRIFICES, that is WHY the priest AND the people BOTH face the same direction: the altar.

So you see, there is a REASON WHY the priest and the people face ONE direction: the altar. That is how it is done when it is the Holy SACRIFICE of the Mass.
 
Things change with time. Since the people did not understand Latin, it was time for change and it is a BEAUTIFUL change.Prior to that the priests’ back faced us and we couldn’t see what was going on. It is beautiful to see how the bread and wine are changed to the body and blood of christ.

Why have you changed wearing the same clothes the last 20 years?
You’ve got some reading to do. Ad Orientem is not “hiding” anything or worse just the priest giving his back to the people. There is so much more to it than that. Clothes and tradition are very different things with the latter rarely changing dramatically but instead organically developing.
 
This is true, but what is interesting is that even in the newer definition,

“…ad memoriale Domini seu sacrificium eucharisticum celebrandum
(to celebrate the Memorial of the Lord, or the Eucharistic Sacrifice)”

seems to offer the Massgoer a choice of believing one or the other. I wonder if they meant to put the “and” conjunction there. The seu is used in a disjunctive sense, according to my Latin dictionary.
Well, that certainly explains the past forty plus years of liturgical upheaval within the Roman Rite.
 
EVERY liturgical church (and even the Orthodox Jewish synagogue, today) has the priest (or rabbi) facing the front (in the case of Christians, this is the altar he is facing), with his back to the people.

The novus ordo church is the only one that has the priest facing THE PEOPLE.

The Eastern Orthodox and Traditional RC liturgies are regarded as SACRIFICES, that is WHY the priest AND the people BOTH face the same direction: the altar.

So you see, there is a REASON WHY the priest and the people face ONE direction: the altar. That is how it is done when it is the Holy SACRIFICE of the Mass.
So is the Mass no longer a sacrifice? If no can you explain what it is?
 
So is the Mass no longer a sacrifice? If no can you explain what it is?
The Tridentine Mass is a sacrifice, as for the NO, I have only been to one in my entire life, and that was in 1978 (all other Masses since have been the TLM).
 
The reason I ask was on Catholic Answers radio podcast they had a guest that said that Jesus whole life is made present in Mass. He stated it is the glorified Lord that we consume in the Eucharist. Nothing he said mentioned sacrifice. I found it a bit strange, but was unsure. What is the correct teaching on this? Has the teaching always been the same, or did it change after Vatican 2?
 
Well, that certainly explains the past forty plus years of liturgical upheaval within the Roman Rite.
Seu in this sense does mean “or,” but this usage is typical in a construction to indicate alternate names for something. That’s why the Latin missal of the OF designates Eucharistic Prayer I as “Prex Eucharistica I seu Canon Romanus.” It doesn’t mean “This is either Eucharistic Prayer I, or else it’s the Roman Canon, they’re totally different things.” It means “Eucharistic Prayer I, also called the Roman Canon.”

isSeu a variant spelling of sive. As far as words go that are generally translated “or,” Riddle and Arnold remarks:
We may say that aut distinguishes, vel co-ordinates, sive denotes synonyms, ve is a milder vel.
Hope this helps.
 
The reason I ask was on Catholic Answers radio podcast they had a guest that said that Jesus whole life is made present in Mass. He stated it is the glorified Lord that we consume in the Eucharist. Nothing he said mentioned sacrifice. I found it a bit strange, but was unsure. What is the correct teaching on this? Has the teaching always been the same, or did it change after Vatican 2?
I heard this idea once from an SSPX Priest. He explained it quite well (by the way, I’m not in favor of the SSPX, I was just listening to his commentary):

The Prayers at the Foot of the Altar & Confiteor = the fallen human race asking for forgiveness

The Introit = the incarnation of our Lord

Moving from the Epistle side to the Middle of the Altar before the Gloria = the journey from Nazareth to Bethlehem

The Gloria = the birth of our Lord

Moving from the Middle of the altar to the Epistle side before the Collect = the journey back to Nazareth

The Collect = the private life our Lord spent in prayer

The Epistle = the forerunner: St. John the Baptist

The Gospel = the public ministry of our Lord

The Sanctus = Palm Sunday

The Consecration = The Last Supper

The Angus Dei = The Crucifixion

The Priest & People’s Communion = The Resurrection of Christ (We’re receiving the benefits of Christ’s sacrifice)

The Ite Missa Est = The Apostolic Age (We’re sent forth)

I don’t think this view takes away from the notion of sacrifice. It merely adds another dimension to the Mass, which is first a sacrifice and then a meal where the Lord dines with his people.
 
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