Why you should think that the Natural-Evolution of species is true

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buffalo said:
The universe is intelligible and rational and worthy of study. This understanding is the foundation of science.
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But it does not follow that science can determine the existence or non existence of God. That the world is intelligible and worthy of study is a philosophical understanding that comes before science.
 
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Catholics are not allowed to believe in atheistic evolution.

“According to St. Thomas Aquinas: “The effect of divine providence is not only that things should happen somehow, but that they should happen either by necessity or by contingency. Therefore, whatsoever divine providence ordains to happen infallibly and of necessity happens infallibly and of necessity; and that happens from contingency, which the divine providence conceives to happen from contingency” ( Summa theologiae, I, 22,4 ad 1). In the Catholic perspective, neo-Darwinians who adduce random genetic variation and natural selection as evidence that the process of evolution is absolutely unguided are straying beyond what can be demonstrated by science. Divine causality can be active in a process that is both contingent and guided. Any evolutionary mechanism that is contingent can only be contingent because God made it so. An unguided evolutionary process – one that falls outside the bounds of divine providence – simply cannot exist because “the causality of God, Who is the first agent, extends to all being, not only as to constituent principles of species, but also as to the individualizing principles…It necessarily follows that all things, inasmuch as they participate in existence, must likewise be subject to divine providence” ( Summa theologiae I, 22, 2).”
 
IWantGod said:
You’re welcome to that belief, you’re welcome to take scripture at face value and give it authority over the scientific evidence, but it’s not reasonable to do so. It’s cognitive dissonance.
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Two can play at the cognitive dissonance game.

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IWantGod said:
But it does not follow that science can determine the existence or non existence of God. That the world is intelligible and worthy of study is a philosophical understanding that comes before science.
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Philosophy takes one to the existence of God, theology tells one who He is.

Science (methodological naturalism) by its own definition can say nothing about God. It has excluded itself and painted itself into a corner. Science, in the sense of searching for knowledge should be open to all sources of knowledge. Excluding the formal and final causes undermines that total search.
 
edwest said:
An unguided evolutionary process
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Science cannot determine whether or not God is the cause of physical reality. If a scientist uses the word unguided, it can mean two things. Either they are speaking about their philosophical commitment to metaphysical naturalism, or they are simply saying that things are acting according to their nature rather than like a puppet on a string which is not in itself an example of atheism or a denial of divine providence.

Also it is not true that a Catholic has to believe in a completely deterministic universe, Concepts such as chance and randomness are not an affront to divine providence when properly understood.
 
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An unguided evolutionary process – one that falls outside the bounds of divine providence – simply cannot exist because “the causality of God, Who is the first agent, extends to all being, not only as to constituent principles of species, but also as to the individualizing principles…It necessarily follows that all things, inasmuch as they participate in existence, must likewise be subject to divine providence” ( Summa theologiae I, 22, 2).”
 
edwest said:
An unguided evolutionary process – one that falls outside the bounds of divine providence – simply cannot exist because “the causality of God, Who is the first agent, extends to all being, not only as to constituent principles of species, but also as to the individualizing principles…It necessarily follows that all things, inasmuch as they participate in existence, must likewise be subject to divine providence” ( Summa theologiae I, 22, 2).”
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It’s irrelevant. Nothing said here is against the natural evolution of species.
 
So it doesn’t say what it says?

That leads me to conclude that evolution is being used to promote atheism.
 
buffalo said:
Science (methodological naturalism) by its own definition can say nothing about God.
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It’s not meant to. It is a method of studying physical reality, and it works. There is no conspiracy theory here.
 
edwest said:
An unguided evolutionary process – one that falls outside the bounds of divine providence – simply cannot exist because “the causality of God, Who is the first agent, extends to all being, not only as to constituent principles of species, but also as to the individualizing principles…It necessarily follows that all things, inasmuch as they participate in existence, must likewise be subject to divine providence” ( Summa theologiae I, 22, 2).”
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This is not really a criticism of evolution as anyone proposes it. In fact the evolutionary computer model I used as an example earlier, where the creator sets up the environment wherein unguided evolution can naturally take place, is perfectly compatible with this view of nature, just as it is compatible with the idea that gravity orders the motion of the planets and that God created gravity. God created the laws of nature that allow the planets to fall into order and for living organisms to evolve and diversify in a vibrant, changing, and diverse world.
 
Oh yes it is. God did not make a wind-up toy that when let go, did whatever it wanted. God works infallibly in Creation.
 
He can know what will happen because he has infinite knowledge. Evolution is not truly random, at it’s most basic level it is ruled by physics, and even at the general level it is ruled by the environment. Unless you have a similar attack against chemistry and physics also needing miraculous intervention…
 
edwest said:
Oh yes it is. God did not make a wind-up toy that when let go, did whatever it wanted. God works infallibly in Creation.
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Nobody said he did. But God did create a world that operates through secondary causes. Physical things act according to their nature (through the existential power of God), and since they do it is evident that God intended things to be that way.

You wish to deny the obvious, which is something Aquinas never did.
 
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It works well for things like the effects of gravity. It is observable, repeatable and predictable.
 
Apparently, you didn’t read it or can’t accept what you read. God works infallibly. Infallibly. That’s what Aquinas wrote.
 
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