Wife refuses marital relationship

[PAJAKI]

What is this “probably” has vaginismus?? Why are you not sure about your wife’s medical condition? Go with her when she sees her OB/GYN and talk to the doctor about this issue. If she doesn’t have an OB/GYN, she should find one, preferably one of Jesus’ cousins and preferably a woman.
Sex is important to marriage, it is the most powerful mode of communicating love to a spouse. Most marriages can’t and shouldn’t do without it.
Both of you should be doing whatever you can to solve both the physical and psychological problems that keep you from enjoying a normal marital relationship. The issues are probably not all on one side, either.
Get practical; get help.

Matthew

Dear all, I want to thank you for all of your comments and I appreciate your help very much.

I wrote “probably” because it’s a diagnosis I made myself by reading here and there; my wife refuses to talk to her GYN, a Catholic female, about the problem. She thinks sex is not all that important to marriage. I am aware that the issues are not all on one side but it’s very difficult to tackle them because whenever I try to talk to my wife about this or when I express my unease and discomfort, her latent depression reappears and she has to increase the quantity of her antidepressant. As a matter of fact I think that this sex problem caused her to be depressed.

 

[PAJAKI]

Let’s talk about the actual symptoms and possible causes of vaginismus. Who diagnosed this, if she hasn’t spoken to a medical doctor?

Since your wife hasn’t mentioned this to a doctor, do her physical symptoms match up with any of the information is found here?

This is where I"m confused: “I’m tired” or “not tonight” are far cries from “It’s painful! Stop!” With this sexual disorder, it is physically impossible to have intercourse. If this is the case, I"m shocked at the lack of sensitivity.

According to the website Medicine Plus, vaginismus “has several possible causes, including past sexual trauma or abuse, psychological factors, or a history of discomfort with sexual intercourse. Sometimes no cause can be found.”

That’s much more than ‘simple’ depression, and it’s serious enough that a professional should be consulted. The lack of sex isn’t the issue for your wife, though it is for you. The lack of sex for your wife is a symptom of a larger problem. The trick now is finding out if it’s a physical problem or a psychological one. Intercourse is not a priority if you wife has an official diagnosis of “vaginismus.”

But the end result of all this shouldn’t be just a happy sex life for either – or both – partners. It should be the health and wholeness of both partners in a marriage, beginning with addressing this issue.

Ray, I’m sorry but I read that to read as if marriage in “Christian sense” sounds more like focusing on having monogamous sex, rather than two people becoming one. I am trying to say that it takes more than sex to have a healthy marriage. If she has vaginismus, then refusing sex isn’t the issue. It’s what makes her refuse sex.

I’m nonplussed that since the OPs wife is already on antidepressants, it seems to have taken a lack of sex to get interested in her mental health and whole well-being.

My suggestions:

1. 
   *]Look up what medication she is already on, and how they affect her libido.
   
   *]Talk to the doctor who prescribed the antidepressants and insist that pills alone are a band-aid for other issues, and enlist his help in encouraging her to round out her treatment with talk therapy – preferably with a Catholic psychologist/psychiatrist. Don’t go at it with an attitude that “if she feels better, I can have sex again.” That’s treating her like an object. For her sake, I would much rather your attitude be, “There’s something wrong with my wife’s health that is affecting our overall relationship me directly; I want her to be happy and for both of us to receive the full graces of the sacrament of marriage.”
   
   *]Suggesting going along with her yearly OB/GYN appointment, and sit in on the consult. Talk about vaginismus. Get a real diagnosis. Ask for options.
   
   Edited to add: drafdog beat me to it by 9 minutes!

1. 
   Dear Miserissima,
   
   I thank you for your help. When we got married both of us were virgins and she has not had any traumatic experience.
   As I said before I do not blame her because she refuses to have marital intercourse with me and the way I put it in my first post was a try to take this problem, that causes me and my wife a lot of sufferings, a little more lightheartily.
   All that said, I think she was selfish and dishonest to herself when her first psychologist insisted that the problem could be about sexual life she refused to see her any more and when the new psychiatrist tried to investigate a little about her sexual life she told her that everything was pretty normal and that was far, far from true even if we had been able to have intercourse two times after months and months without sex.

 

[larryhc]

This is a real tough one ! Maybe she needs to be courted and you have to romance her yet again. Maybe she is under the strain of routine or stressed emotionally and physically. Perhaps both of you need a change of your environment, a breath of fresh air, to be wined and dined and to rediscover the joys of conjugal sex ?
Hope it works out for you. God bless.

 

[PAJAKI]

There is such thing as post-traumatic stress disorder! If the birth was difficult, perhaps the time has just come for her to react to the trauma of the birth. The trauma has a delayed effect on her.

Please, please, please don’t blame yourself!! You say you are with her and you love her - that is all you can do, leave the rest to the doctors! Love her, and assure her that whatever happens, you are there for her. Small acts of kindness go a long way. BUT, the point is that she gets the treatment, medication, and attention she needs.
You have to be strong now for her, and blaming yourself weakens you. Get rid of guilt, you are not to blame.

Yes, the birth was terrible and she got a 3rd degree laceration and it hasn’t certainly made things easier but I think that is not the primary source of the problem since things have always been difficult, even in the first years of marriage.
I have to confess that it’s not always that easy to be kind to her because, in some way, I feel rejected. She even refuses my innocent kisses, most of the times.

 

[Ray_Scheel]

PAJAKI: I’m seeing more and more of my own situation in yours. There is no more time to waste, get a list of Catholic therapists in your area and recommendations as far as who was effective at resolving peoples issues (not the ones that someone “liked” but was still seeing with no real resolution of life hindrances years later). Your ideal treatment provider would be a Catholic PhD who is trained as a sex therapist. Go by yourself a couple of times to establish a rapport and then insist your wife start to come with you for joint counseling, possibly enlisting the aid of your priest to instruct her to cooperate with joint counseling and clarifying for her that perpetually refusing marital intimacy is not normal or proper according to the Catholic idea of marriage. Nothing is going to be helped by continuing to let her slide in avoiding this.

Simultaneously, try to spend some more time at church activities and around the friends you still have. Get the family out together if your wife will come, and if not, take your child with you and just go be seen in public functioning normally. Based on my own experience there is a good chance your wife make lash out with abuse accusations if she feels like she’s may be forced to address the issues she’s been avoiding. If she does something along those lines, you will need a group of supporters who have seen you enough in family settings to be able to say that you care for your child and are not abusive / controlling. Even if she doesn’t, having that kind of support network is a healthy thing.

My ex also previously dropped therapists who challenged her refusal to address her core issues that were generating the soap opera daily issues she keeps winding up in, but once she found a practice that would simply let her linger forever she absolutely refused to seek an outside opinion. She even filed multiple abuse accusations against me when the “last chance” that a priest had given her therapist of 6 years (now 7) ran out and I insisted that her treatment approach had to change. She also generally refused simple daily types of affection, insisted that sex was not a normally a common event in of marriage, dismissed any resources written by males simply because they were men, claimed I needed therapy for being interested enough to keep asking when she’d been refusing for months, etc.

This isn’t you, at least, there isn’t anything left for you to try differently that might help without a mediator skilled in shutting down the excuses she’s using to shut down your attempts to communicate on the issue (and has probably even been punishing you for doing the right thing when it triggered feelings for you she was trying to keep suppressed). Start getting recommendations from your priest, chancery, Catholic Charities, and/or Catholictherapists.com today.

 

[mdgspencer]

Obviously, she has a serious problem of some sort that she should deal with by getting help of the proper sort, whatever that might be. But if she won’t, it may be necessary to accept that you will have to live with it perhaps from now on. For one person to provide a serious life time difficulty in their marriage is common, and the only thing you can do is learn to live with it as best you can if it continues indefinitely.

 

[dulcissima]

Obviously, she has a serious problem of some sort that she should deal with by getting help of the proper sort, whatever that might be. But if she won’t, it may be necessary to accept that you will have to live with it perhaps from now on. For one person to provide a serious life time difficulty in their marriage is common, and the only thing you can do is learn to live with it as best you can if it continues indefinitely.

I disagree. Why would a husband have to just accept that he must live a celibate life? That is not a marriage. He needs to help her understand that sexual intimacy most definitely is a big part of a marriage and that he is not selfish for wanting to have this type of a relationship with his wife. It is morally wrong for one spouse to regularly deny the other. Why should he accept that? She seems to not understand her role as a wife, and he should seek assistance in bringing her to this understanding.

 

[whatevergirl]

I disagree. Why would a husband have to just accept that he must live a celibate life? That is not a marriage. He needs to help her understand that sexual intimacy most definitely is a big part of a marriage and that he is not selfish for wanting to have this type of a relationship with his wife. It is morally wrong for one spouse to regularly deny the other. Why should he accept that? She seems to not understand her role as a wife, and he should seek assistance in bringing her to this understanding.

She might understand her role…but she is in pain. I can’t imagine my husband being so selfish because he feels my role as a wife should be to please him sexually–that he would be willing to hurt me. That’s not a marriage, either.

 

[whatevergirl]

I’m a 44 year-old husband. My wife and I have been married 7 years and we get along quite well. The problem between us is sex. My wife probably suffers from vaginismus and she is not interested in sex at all. “Leave me alone” and “I’m tired” are the sentences she prefers. She refuses to see any counselor or physichian about this matter. I have always been confident that she might change but after so many years I’m losing hope.
We haven’t had any intercourse for several months.
What shall I do? Please, don’t tell me that we should pray together, we do that every day.

God allows us to remain in situations, not because He is a sadist…but because He wants us to work together to come out with a beautiful end result. His way. I think first, I’d go to a Christian counselor/MD, one that could help you with the physical problems of your sex life, as well as your wife’s potential emotional problems from not being able to fulfill you. These things can often be a vicious cycle…she says no (because she is afraid to be in pain)…then you feel rejected…then…your rejection makes her feel worse…then, things just keep escalating. I watched a documentary about something similar to this recently, where the wife had severe pain during intercourse. The couple sought out counseling…and then, a MD to really help them physically…I believe some type of medication was given for the wife’s pain–for during intercourse. You might want to look into that, too.

We all have our crosses to bear. I feel badly for you, but I also feel badly for your wife. She loves you, and she can’t show you through the marital embrace.

 

[dulcissima]

She might understand her role…but she is in pain. I can’t imagine my husband being so selfish because he feels my role as a wife should be to please him sexually–that he would be willing to hurt me. That’s not a marriage, either.

Whatevergirl, I just went and re-read all of the posts from the OP. His wife does not say that she is in pain. She say she is tired or that sex is not all that important to a marriage. This does not sound like a woman in physical pain. It sounds like a woman who is not interested in meeting her husband’s needs. To regularly refuse relations is not only neglectfu,l it is also very selfish. This is a question of balance and both spouses having their needs met. Just like it would be sellfish for one spouse to say that the answer can never be “no”, it is equally selfish for the other spouse to say the answer must always be “no.”

This wife also refuses to get any kind of help or discuss it with a doctor. She is the one who is hurting her husband.

 

[whatevergirl]

Whatevergirl, I just went and re-read all of the posts from the OP. His wife does not say that she is in pain. She say she is tired or that sex is not all that important to a marriage. This does not sound like a woman in physical pain. It sounds like a woman who is not interested in meeting her husband’s needs. To regularly refuse relations is not only neglectfu,l it is also very selfish. This is a question of balance and both spouses having their needs met. Just like it would be sellfish for one spouse to say that the answer can never be “no”, it is equally selfish for the other spouse to say the answer must always be “no.”

This wife also refuses to get any kind of help or discuss it with a doctor. She is the one who is hurting her husband.

ok…you need to look at post #23…his first post kicking off this thread states that ‘she suffers from…’ If there’s no pain…where’s the suffering? Maybe could be uncomfortable…but, before we get too far along with dissecting this…I’m gonna look up the symptoms of this…be back later.

 

[actorgirl]

she sounds so very sad. The no sex is not the problem. It’s just a side effect of a much bigger issue.

 

[blessedtoo]

I wrote “probably” because it’s a diagnosis I made myself by reading here and there; my wife refuses to talk to her GYN, a Catholic female, about the problem. She thinks sex is not all that important to marriage.

The OP has “diagnosed” his wife based things he has read. As you can see, she has not seen a doctor and refuses to speak to one about whatever this “pain” is.

She even refuses my innocent kisses, most of the times.

Does this cause physical pain as well?

 

[PAJAKI]

Obviously, she has a serious problem of some sort that she should deal with by getting help of the proper sort, whatever that might be. But if she won’t, it may be necessary to accept that you will have to live with it perhaps from now on. For one person to provide a serious life time difficulty in their marriage is common, and the only thing you can do is learn to live with it as best you can if it continues indefinitely.

I’m prepared to live without sex, that’s not big deal to me. But I still think it’s wrong. I cannot help but think that our difficulties are not unsurmountable, like it would be the case if there was physical impairment, and therefore we are morally bound to tackle them. I also believe that, as a married couple, we are to respond to God for the gift of fertility and I’m very happy I managed to convince my wife to make love with me the night we conceived our child.

 

[PAJAKI]

The OP has “diagnosed” his wife based things he has read. As you can see, she has not seen a doctor and refuses to speak to one about whatever this “pain” is.

Does this cause physical pain as well?

There is certainly a pain problem. That’s why I try to be as delicate as possible. I do not want to be too graphic but I’ll try to explain. Even if I manage to convince her, penetration is impossible, most of the times, because there is not enough lubrication (she absolutely refuses to use any lubricant) and it is as if there is no opening. If she feels pain I immediately quit. Furthermore, when she does not feel pain, she says it gives her no pleasure at all and the shorter it lasts, the better is for her.

 

[Ray_Scheel]

There is certainly a pain problem. That’s why I try to be as delicate as possible. I do not want to be too graphic but I’ll try to explain. Even if I manage to convince her, penetration is impossible, most of the times, because there is not enough lubrication (she absolutely refuses to use any lubricant) and it is as if there is no opening. If she feels pain I immediately quit. Furthermore, when she does not feel pain, she says it gives her no pleasure at all and the shorter it lasts, the better is for her.

The fact that she managed ot bear a child and deliver naturally (even though with complications) pretty much ruled out a physical cause for vaginismus. There was a possibility the doc messed up with the stitching but that’s fitting what you are describing either, as a physical issue would always be present, not transient. However, the condition may be transient for psychological reasons, but that version is fully surmountable if she can be persuaded to cooperate with treatment.

With her attitude about sex, it does not surprise me at all that she is not generating enough natural lubricant. Will she allow you to apply lubricant, or is this yet another aspect in which she’s forbidding/refusing the things that might help resolve the issue?

 

[PAJAKI]

The fact that she managed ot bear a child and deliver naturally (even though with complications) pretty much ruled out a physical cause for vaginismus. There was a possibility the doc messed up with the stitching but that’s fitting what you are describing either, as a physical issue would always be present, not transient. However, the condition may be transient for psychological reasons, but that version is fully surmountable if she can be persuaded to cooperate with treatment.

With her attitude about sex, it does not surprise me at all that she is not generating enough natural lubricant. Will she allow you to apply lubricant, or is this yet another aspect in which she’s forbidding/refusing the things that might help resolve the issue?

She does not allow me to apply lubricant. She thinks that lubricant could be dangerous for her uterus. There is no way for me to convince her and, of course, she won’t discuss this issue with her gynaecologist.

 

[KCT]

Maybe someone else has suggested this or perhaps you already go, but . . .

Even if your wife won’t talk to a therapist, you may want to go on your own. Just to have a professional to talk with, and who will listen to you. —KCT

 

[gam197]

First, it must be confirmed that there is no medical condition that is causing her great pain. If so, medication is necessary.

You didn’t mention her age.Is she younger? It could be a fear of another pregnancy which will be just as difficult as the last. She needs to be aware that each pregnancy is different and if she did get pregnant, there are good doctors available. **She needs to feel that her life is not in danger.**I hope you care enough not to endanger her life. Pregnancy at older ages is rare but it can happen.

She needs a lubricant. It is simply a soft Vaseline and won’t hurt her and takes one second to insert. It is simple to use. I use it myself.

Psychologically she has to come to terms with the fact that you are her husband and sex is a need of her husband even if she doesn’t feel that need or thinks that need is ridiculous. She may have past guilt. She may need to work off some of this guilt by doing charity work. She may have post partum depression.

God calls her to submission in this area. She doesn’t have to submit in every area of her life but when it comes to sex, she is bound to Christ to submit. That is why it is a part of the marriage vows. I would say it is a sin and she cannot receive communion but she needs to speak to a priest on this.

You are bound to Christ to care enough that you won’t harm her is any form. That means extra work on your part also.

 

[PAJAKI]

First, it must be confirmed that there is no medical condition that is causing her great pain. If so, medication is necessary.

You didn’t mention her age.Is she younger? It could be a fear of another pregnancy which will be just as difficult as the last. She needs to be aware that each pregnancy is different and if she did get pregnant, there are good doctors available. **She needs to feel that her life is not in danger.**I hope you care enough not to endanger her life. Pregnancy at older ages is rare but it can happen.

She needs a lubricant. It is simply a soft Vaseline and won’t hurt her and takes one second to insert. It is simple to use. I use it myself.

Psychologically she has to come to terms with the fact that you are her husband and sex is a need of her husband even if she doesn’t feel that need or thinks that need is ridiculous. She may have past guilt. She may need to work off some of this guilt by doing charity work. She may have post partum depression.

God calls her to submission in this area. She doesn’t have to submit in every area of her life but when it comes to sex, she is bound to Christ to submit. That is why it is a part of the marriage vows. I would say it is a sin and she cannot receive communion but she needs to speak to a priest on this.

You are bound to Christ to care enough that you won’t harm her is any form. That means extra work on your part also.

She is 41 and yes, she fears another pregnancy. We are thinking of adopting a child even if this is very, very difficult in Italy and she
opposes international adoption. She is very active in charity and in our parish.
I don’t think she has post partum depression, as a matter of fact she was able to get rid of her antidepressant until a few months ago.