Wife wants an annulment, is it valid, what can I do?

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There was a questionnaire my wife and I had to fill out and go over with the priest before we were married, is that not standard throughout the Church? Well, now I know I am wrong and I am glad that this is the only time I’ve ever repeated what I heard in regards to annulments to someone else. Thanks for setting me straight.
 
The affair is an obstacle. That she is not “pursuing” it - not sure what that means. Is she thinking of it, or o th next possiblity. That you cannot answer.

But I wonder, HOW can you have 4 kids in 4 years and have any time for an affair?? That’s out of this world!

Continuing to pursue understanding the havoc wrecked by porn is good. It is serious sin but Jesus can heals us completely from sin-sickness if we turn to Him completely. Remember, Mary the Magdalene who “loved much” - Jesus’ praise - was a prostitute. Yes, she converted while Jesus was in his 3 year ministry. Then she was the one He chose to show himself to first when He rose! You can be sure she Had by then COMPLETELY recovered from her serious sin. *. I say this of Mary Magdalene to point out that Jesus can completely heal us. But first we must be truly repentant, and to be that, you need to really grasp the sin.

Put your marriage in God’s hands and trust Him. As to divorce, follow wise lawyer’s advice if you get hit with that, since its all you can do. (Most of the time, almost all the time, you cannot block this). Annulments take much time. Meanwhile she has to raise the kids in separate homes.

Control what you can and give up on what you cannot. Give it to God and trust Him with it. Be not anxious, He says, and in order to be not-anxious you must give Him the things you cannot control. Work on what you can, like understanding your sin. Improve your prayer life; add some new habit, weekly adoration or a daily prayer or both. Trust in Him. And anywhere along the line of it falling apart she could come to her senses. Meanwhile become your best. Know God’s forgiveness and healing - that will do more for you than any pounds or workout.*
 
onceablasphemer said:
There was a questionnaire my wife and I had to fill out and go over with the priest before we were married, is that not standard throughout the Church? Well, now I know I am wrong and I am glad that this is the only time I’ve ever repeated what I heard in regards to annulments to someone else. Thanks for setting me straight.
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I think you are confusing this with the Canon that covers Fraud. Fraud would be lying to the potential spouse about something that would prevent them from giving proper consent to the Sacrament of Marriage. Showing that the person lied during the marriage prep about this same issue can be evidence of this. For instance if a husband is found to have lied about a psychological condition that he was treated for prior to the marriage and sure enough he lied in the marriage prep that would be pretty good evidence that he probably didn’t tell the the potential wife either if that is what she is saying if that is also what the witnesses are saying. But I digress.
 
Did you say your wife had four babies in four years? That’s hard on mind and body, no matter how much you love your kids. Have you considered that she has postpartum depression or is mentally and physically “at her breaking point” and in need of some psychological health care? Please do not underestimate this possibility. Four back-to-back pregnancies without any sort of a recovery period would be hard on any woman. Especially one that started out so very young.

I notice that some moms who have their kids very early in life go through a period of “Wait! I want to be young and have fun again!” People change so rapidly in their 20s. Could she be having feelings of being tied-down prematurely?

Finally - you say you were fornicating prior to marriage and not using contraception. Two healthy people in their very early 20s do not usually make the choice to risk a pregnancy before they marry, and either abstain or use ABC. I think you need to explore what it is about you and your wife that, at the time, thought this course of action was a good idea. It seems odd to me that a healthy, stable girl of 20 would put herself at such high risk of becoming pregnant out of wedlock. Was your wife hoping to get pregnant so that you would marry her? Was she trying to leave an abusive home life? Did she think having a baby would “fix” something about her life?

I feel like there is more to this story than her just being angry about the porno habit.
 
Three pregnancies, one was twins, I honestly do not think this is post partum depression, I have considered things like this. It can certainly be highly stressful, but a big part of this for her right now is “rediscovering herself” she is realizing who she is and what she really wants in life and wants to make decisions for herself. That in itself is a good thing overall, but not when it comes to something like this. She wants to do marriage the “right way”, she wants to date again, and be more careful in who she chooses, and not have premarital sex, she wants a “do-over” although she would never say that, when she talks about what she wants in the future that is exactly how it sounds. She certainly has regrets and I think she feels like she was tied down prematurely, the irony being when we were dating, all we wanted was to start married life.

To answer your last question, let me explain to you our mindset. We were both devout Catholics that struggled with our sexual purity, however we never wanted to start a habit of contraception that could potentially follow us into our marriage. I know it might sound a bit ridiculous, but we weren’t afraid of pregnancy, she knew I was going to marry her either way. We certainly weren’t actively trying to get pregnant, we just acknowledged that whatever happened would happen before we got married. There is certainly more to the story than the porno habit, and she definitely wanted to get away from her over bearing mother, however once she got her own apartment 3 hours away from her mom, I just can’t see that being relevant.
 
i didn’t realize that you had this problem. You can say as you wish, but it is an addiction, and you must pray fervently. Jesus could grant you freedom from this addiction. This problem can endanger souls and you wife might be able to obtain the nulling.

Anyway, i pray for God’s will to prevail. Amen!
 
joeshea said:
Three pregnancies, one was twins, I honestly do not think this is post partum depression, I have considered things like this. It can certainly be highly stressful, but a big part of this for her right now is “rediscovering herself” she is realizing who she is and what she really wants in life and wants to make decisions for herself. That in itself is a good thing overall, but not when it comes to something like this. She wants to do marriage the “right way”, she wants to date again, and be more careful in who she chooses, and not have premarital sex, she wants a “do-over” although she would never say that, when she talks about what she wants in the future that is exactly how it sounds. She certainly has regrets and I think she feels like she was tied down prematurely, the irony being when we were dating, all we wanted was to start married life.

To answer your last question, let me explain to you our mindset. We were both devout Catholics that struggled with our sexual purity, however we never wanted to start a habit of contraception that could potentially follow us into our marriage. I know it might sound a bit ridiculous, but we weren’t afraid of pregnancy, she knew I was going to marry her either way. We certainly weren’t actively trying to get pregnant, we just acknowledged that whatever happened would happen before we got married. There is certainly more to the story than the porno habit, and she definitely wanted to get away from her over bearing mother, however once she got her own apartment 3 hours away from her mom, I just can’t see that being relevant.
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At 20, before the brain is fully developed and one has little sense of oneself and little experience with the “real world” - marrying and making babies sounds super cuuuuute! Who doesn’t love sweet little babies? Especially when your mom is a real bummer! Reality is, parenting and marriage is damn hard work. Four kids in four years is setting oneself up for about 6 years of tireless physical labor. I suggest she sees a counselor STAT. She needs to come to terms with the fact that her time to be a young woman free and finding herself is over. She skipped that part and as much as she wants to go back, she can’t. Find counseling!
 
I think she had a pretty good idea of what raising kids would be like, she basically raised her 4 siblings through high school and helped homeschool them while her mom did nothing, but I’m sure she did not know how difficult being a wife and mother would be, but then I don’t think anyone can know it until they’ve done it.

Right now, the most difficult thing for me to do is trying to love her. I hate that she is still in love with this other man, and I hate that she has changed so suddenly into this new person. I believe our marriage was valid but, I want so badly to let go of her and move on in my own heart, only because the pain of trying to hold on is so much. She has no affection for me, and when we do talk, she makes me feel as if I am annoying her. I want to hate her and despise her, and I know it’s not entirely fair because of the part my own sin played in this, but it’s such torture trying to win her back when I know in her own head she has made her decision and regards nothing for me. In fact I am starting to feel like maybe I am enabling her, because she knows that she can always fall back to me if things don’t work out.
 
joeshea said:
Three pregnancies, one was twins, I honestly do not think this is post partum depression, I have considered things like this. It can certainly be highly stressful, but a big part of this for her right now is “rediscovering herself” she is realizing who she is and what she really wants in life and wants to make decisions for herself. That in itself is a good thing overall, but not when it comes to something like this. She wants to do marriage the “right way”, she wants to date again, and be more careful in who she chooses, and not have premarital sex, she wants a “do-over” although she would never say that, when she talks about what she wants in the future that is exactly how it sounds. She certainly has regrets and I think she feels like she was tied down prematurely, the irony being when we were dating, all we wanted was to start married life.

To answer your last question, let me explain to you our mindset. We were both devout Catholics that struggled with our sexual purity, however we never wanted to start a habit of contraception that could potentially follow us into our marriage. I know it might sound a bit ridiculous, but we weren’t afraid of pregnancy, she knew I was going to marry her either way. We certainly weren’t actively trying to get pregnant, we just acknowledged that whatever happened would happen before we got married. There is certainly more to the story than the porno habit, and she definitely wanted to get away from her over bearing mother, however once she got her own apartment 3 hours away from her mom, I just can’t see that being relevant.
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Was she or is she just very immature?
 
joeshea said:
Let me start from the beginning,

My wife is currently pursuing a divorce, we were married young, I at 22 she at 20, we never practiced any form of contraception, were open to life and have 4 children, we have been married for 4 years, I have had an on and off problem with pornography throughout our marriage, although I disclosed it before our marriage. When we were dating we were having premarital sex, we had been engaged for about 3 months before she became pregnant. We are both devout Catholics, frequent confession, daily mass etc. We both always intended for marriage while dating, and before she became pregnant, the pregnancy was not a “panic” situation, as we had not been using contraception we knew it was likely.

Recently my wife fell in love with another man, it was a strictly emotional affair. She is no longer pursuing this relationship but, she tells me that this gave her the courage she needed to leave our marriage. She tells me she no longer loves me and believes our marriage to have been invalid because of my pornography problem and her not understanding what she was undertaking. I love my wife, I love our family, I believe with all my heart our marriage was valid and my wife was fully competent enough to take her vows. She has no history of mental illness, she just believes she didn’t fully understand what she was getting into. My problem with pornography was never serious, but it was enough that it was perpetuated throughout our marriage. I want to do whatever it takes to defend this sacrament, and be prepared when she begins the annulment process. I would love any (name removed by moderator)ut I could get as far as what to expect with everything.
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A particularly serious porn problem could perhaps results in invalidity due to fraud (can. 1098) if such a problem were maliciously concealed from the spouse-to-be with intention of securing consent by hiding it. But since you actively disclosed it, actually, there is no room for fraud whatsoever. Neither does struggling with a porn addiction necessarily mean psychic incapacity to undertake the obligations of marriage (can 1095 no. 3). That incapacity is a total incapacity and one connected with grave issues. It’s not just a serious problem connected with, say, moderate psych issues. Problems much more serious than that still fail to cause incapacity.

Therefore there doesn’t seem to be any ground for invalidity. Invalidity has everything to do with there being an actualy ground of invalidity as defined in canon law, and very little to do with what feelings a spouse has about it.

A badly chosen marriage or a marriage that didn’t work well is by no means necessarily an invalid marriage.

As for her not understanding what she was doing, the use of judgement and the understanding of rights and obligations exchanged (can. 1095 nos. 1-2) are measured “against the institution” and not against a partner. Basically, they refer to whether you’re canonically able to marry at all or not, and they won’t save you from making a bad choice of partner.
 
Joe, you have so many good plans to reconcile with your wife but it seems to me that so far you still miss the best one. That is praying …

Please remember that a lot of things are impossible for us but nothing is impossible for God …

Just a quick sharing of my own experience: Since we have the first baby (9 years ago), our marriage began to fall apart … I tried my best, as much as I can to resolve the problems but the more I tried the worse things became. Recently, I found my marriage came so close to the point of breaking up. I got so depressed that I had a serious mental break down. Finally, somethings has came across my mind. Why I have tried so hard by myself? Why haven’t I let the Mighty God help me? God wants to help me. He is more than happy to help me but I refuse to receive his assistance! The consequence is I almost kill myself by working so hard but vainly.

I started to pray … Very simple … God … You always keeps your promise even though we, humans, usually don’t … You united us through the blessing of the marriage sacrement. Please help me to resolve the problem … Please help both, me and my husband to change, adapt to each other and love each other again …

Wow, it is just a miracle … after only very short time (less than one month), things start to change … both of us change … radically …

Just a few month have passed ever since … our marriage is still not perfect … but at least we found the way out … Thanks God …

See, do you find this ridiculous … We, humans, are willing to pay around $150/hr for a psychologist to help us with family matters, which does not have any warranty of effectiveness. But the Mighty God, present deep inside of us, is always willing to tend his hands towards us but we often turn our back to this GREAT FREE OFFER.

God blesses you Joe, You can PM me your email address if you wish to have more private sharing. Thanks
 
I just want to add another point of view … Do you know why we humans are unable to resolve marriage issues by our own efforts most of the time, even ones with very simple root cause?

Simply because it takes two for the tango … In a relationship breakup, we can seldom soly attribute the fault to one party … One may be the first to initiate the messy process but as time goes, the other cannot control his/her temper and will involve himself/sheself in as well …The big problem is … each party has his/her own fault but none of them is willing to change / fix himself / herself first … Instead, they expect and wait for the other to change … A deadlock situation … Nothing will moving along … Why? **Nobody, except God, has the ability to change other people **… The maximum thing we can do is to change ourselves! However, we often fail to do the latter too.

God, the Creator, is the only One that has the power to change the world and convert people, including ourselves and our spouses / kids.

In God, we trust
 
Joe,

In summary, I recommend you to pray God to help you with your porno problems, to help you to love your wife, and to regain her love.

Why? Because:

*Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.*

Matthew 11 : 28-30
 
After all, please forgive me for my terrible English because it is not my mother tongue … Hope that you understand what I mean.
 
Hello Joeshea,
I suggest she sees a counselor STAT. She needs to come to terms with the fact that her time to be a young woman free and finding herself is over. She skipped that part and as much as she wants to go back, she can’t. Find counseling!
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I imagine that you have little say in her choice of counselors. If you do have any (name removed by moderator)ut on any counselor that either or both of you see then please find one whose goal is to help you each BE better and not FEEL better. The vast majority of counselors… even professing-to-be-Christian counselors… have the goal of helping you get rid of guilt and feel better. They would just as willingly counsel a homosexual couple on how to “be happier” within their “marriage.” They would just as willingly help your wife 10 years from now be more happy in her adulterous “remarriage” with her new “husband.”

A truly Christian counselor desires to help you be better. This is defined as being more Christ-like. This Christ-like is the One True Christ that the Catholic Church holds up. Not some partial Christ that denominations hold up.

To learn how to defend your marriage against the annulment machine please check out Mary’s Advocates website. There are a few members of the group who gave successfully defended their marriages. The American tribunals used junk psychology to declare their marriages null on canon 1095 grounds but they used the Roman Rota as the court of second instance and the Rota found that their marriages were valid. These individuals are now faithfully carrying their crosses of keeping the vows they made even though their spouse have abandoned them. (The Gospel reading today, anyone!)

Anyway, I am not sure you will find a place where you can get any better advise than that website.
Bryan
LOVE SO AMAZING
 
Sorry, forgot to mention that your family will be in my prayers every morning.

If someone you know would get her to commit to reading the book The Unexpected Legacy of Divorce and also reading about the study that showed that civil divorce takes an average 5 years off of a kids life (search for it on Lifesitenews) then… if she has any conscience left… it may help her realize she is not loving her children by doing this to them. Sadly, however, she will be able to easily find a priest and a counselor who will hold her hand if she still chooses this path.

Saints John the Baptist, John Fisher and Thomas M., Monica, Helena, Pray for this family!!

Bryan
LOVE SO AMAZING
 
Love reading your replies Mayxanh. Congratulations with the success of your marriage and may God bless your family always. Amen
 
mayxanh said:
Joe, you have so many good plans to reconcile with your wife but it seems to me that so far you still miss the best one. That is praying …

Please remember that a lot of things are impossible for us but nothing is impossible for God …

Just a quick sharing of my own experience: Since we have the first baby (9 years ago), our marriage began to fall apart … I tried my best, as much as I can to resolve the problems but the more I tried the worse things became. Recently, I found my marriage came so close to the point of breaking up. I got so depressed that I had a serious mental break down. Finally, somethings has came across my mind. Why I have tried so hard by myself? Why haven’t I let the Mighty God help me? God wants to help me. He is more than happy to help me but I refuse to receive his assistance! The consequence is I almost kill myself by working so hard but vainly.

I started to pray … Very simple … God … You always keeps your promise even though we, humans, usually don’t … You united us through the blessing of the marriage sacrement. Please help me to resolve the problem … Please help both, me and my husband to change, adapt to each other and love each other again …

Wow, it is just a miracle … after only very short time (less than one month), things start to change … both of us change … radically …

Just a few month have passed ever since … our marriage is still not perfect … but at least we found the way out … Thanks God …

See, do you find this ridiculous … We, humans, are willing to pay around $150/hr for a psychologist to help us with family matters, which does not have any warranty of effectiveness. But the Mighty God, present deep inside of us, is always willing to tend his hands towards us but we often turn our back to this GREAT FREE OFFER.

God blesses you Joe, You can PM me your email address if you wish to have more private sharing. Thanks
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Never under estimate the power of prayer.
 
Hi Joe,

My husband went through the annulment process and it was completed just 6 months ago. (His first wife left him, then claimed that marriage was just “common law with ceremonial benefits” and her vows “didn’t really mean anything”.) It seems to me that your best course of action right now is to pray and to actively participate in the annulment process. You will be contacted to come in for an interview. Given that you are not wanting this marriage to be proved invalid, it may be helpful for you to come to the tribunal to discuss your side. As other posters have said, you will be given full access to all testimony from her and from the witnesses.

On the face of it, it’s difficult to say whether or not the marriage was valid. This is why the tribunal is well-versed in the finer points of canon law on the subject. In addition, it typically takes 12-18 months (it took 15 months in my husband’s case) for a declaration of nullity to be granted, as an affirmative (i.e., marriage not valid) decision is required from two tribunals. In Canada, at least, it is also a requirement that the couple be legally divorced prior to filing a petition for a nullity trial.

My husband and I will pray for you and your family. My husband, also, has a daughter from his first marriage so I have seen how hard the divorce process is on children. (She was almost 4 when it happened, now she is 8 and she and I get along very well, thank God.)
 
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