Wife Won't Accept My Victory

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AviPap,

You know your wife. What teachings do YOU think she would find most convincing that the Truth resides in the Catholic Church and thus want her children raised in it?

The Sacraments? Real Presence? It’s moral teachings? Devotion to Mary? The Communion of Saints? The Petrine Office?

What teachings does she oppose and/or disagree with? What are those hurdles?
 
southern_knight said:
If your insinuating that St Augustine thought that porn usage is acceptable in moderation, then you are mistaken. Do you really believe this?
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Sure. I mean, and this is probably directed at the men more than the women because people take sex too seriously–but didn’t all the Catholic kings and stuff have mistresses? What teenaged boy hasn’t looked at porn? It’s not some great thing you need to repent, I assure you, there are far, far, far worse sins than looking at a women with a great body and enjoying the moment.

I guess a lot of the posters here are “old school.” I don’t have a problem with that, and I applaud them on their application of the faith. But last I checked, Catholic means universal, and is meant to be a “big tent” religion. In that spirit, I do think moderation is a virtue.

But I mean, it’s not like I’m going to be talking to my kids about porn anytime soon. My oldest is only four. And my wife was more accepting of porn viewing early on, but is less so as we have “become established” in the marriage context.

I understand the importance of the “letter of the law” when it comes to the Catholic faith, but it’s not everything. I just want to get my kids into the Catholic Church, and then we can sort out the other stuff later. I don’t want to be the traveling circus with some Catholics here, Protestants there.
 
firead said:
It is one of the hardest things for a Protestant to accept, but it is the key to everything (and was the turning point for me and several other Protestant-to-Catholic converts I know).
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That, and the veneration of Mary, devotion to the Saints.

Perhaps that is a way AviPap can take. To deal with whatever it is his wife opposes in Catholicism.
 
firead said:
Because we have Jesus, we have the fullness of truth, and we were founded by Jesus Christ.

Do you believe in the Real Presence? If not, read, pray, whatever it takes to truly convince yourself that Christ is present, body, blood, soul, and divinity, in the Eucharist. If you truly do believe that, think of what that means Mass really is and what is says about the Church and her authority and legitimacy when compared to the Protestants.

It is one of the hardest things for a Protestant to accept, but it is the key to everything (and was the turning point for me and several other Protestant-to-Catholic converts I know).
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Thank you. Yes, yes, yes, I believe this! Glad to see someone finally give me the kind of stuff I’m looking for here. Thank you.
 
AvignonPapacy94 said:
Mary, I’ve been a Catholic all my life. I understand the teachings of Jesus and the Catechism. I don’t need to read books aimed at “dummies” to accomplish my objective.
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It’d be a good beginner guide for your wife.
Mary.
 
AvignonPapacy94 said:
Sure. I mean, and this is probably directed at the men more than the women because people take sex too seriously–but didn’t all the Catholic kings and stuff have mistresses? What teenaged boy hasn’t looked at porn? It’s not some great thing you need to repent, I assure you, there are far, far, far worse sins than looking at a women with a great body and enjoying the moment.

I.
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What work of Augustine did he say that in?
 
It’s not so much that my wife is anti-Catholicism, but rather, “pro” her specific tradition. [BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]
 
It was either City of God or the Confessions, I can’t remember which.
 
AvignonPapacy94 said:
It’s not so much that my wife is anti-Catholicism, but rather, “pro” her specific tradition. [BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]
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If you were to say “How can I convince my wife to take my kids out sailing with me. My father was a sailor and I respect him so I want to take my kids out sailing too”.

I would say … learn how to sail well yourself first because the life and soul of your kids is the most precious thing you have. Keeping them safe and guiding them well is imperitive upon you. I’d say to your wife… until he can sail that boat darn well… stay on dry land with your kids where you are, baby!

Incompetance is never going to make a competent argument.
 
AvignonPapacy94 said:
But I mean, it’s not like I’m going to be talking to my kids about porn anytime soon. My oldest is only four.
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You’d be surprised. I’ve read that the average age is 11 and dropping. A couple studies have listed the average age as low as 8. With the internet, it is all over, and people take it lightly and accept it so much they don’t even think about a child being exposed to it anymore.

And, yes, porn is damaging. Even taking religion out of the picture, there are a lot of serious issues with porn and the “adult industry” as a whole. You’d be surprised at the number of girls who are doing it because their partner is manipulating them into it with threats of violence or blackmail, or drug addiction. Even the people who get into it of their own free will and want to do it usually end up with some pretty disturbing experiences.
(Without getting too far into detail, I was involved with the sex industry when I was younger and have several friends who are or have been involved with porn and related things - it damages people).
 
So in order to raise your kids Catholic, you have to be a perfect Catholic?

If you miss some masses, occassionally masturbate and look at porn, or use contraception with your life, then the faith forecloses to you?

Sorry, but I can’t believe that in a world of 1.2 billion Catholics, all of them are that perfect. I don’t think you should have to be the exemplar of every letter of Church teaching to raise your kids Catholic.

But you think if I drag my family to church every week, then it’ll be easier to win? I make about 2x as much money as my wife.
 
firead said:
You’d be surprised. I’ve read that the average age is 11 and dropping. A couple studies have listed the average age as low as 8. With the internet, it is all over, and people take it lightly and accept it so much they don’t even think about a child being exposed to it anymore.

And, yes, porn is damaging. Even taking religion out of the picture, there are a lot of serious issues with porn and the “adult industry” as a whole. You’d be surprised at the number of girls who are doing it because their partner is manipulating them into it with threats of violence or blackmail, or drug addiction. Even the people who get into it of their own free will and want to do it usually end up with some pretty disturbing experiences.
(Without getting too far into detail, I was involved with the sex industry when I was younger and have several friends who are or have been involved with porn and related things - it damages people).
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Well, what can you do? Obviously, if you are being coerced or blackmailed into porn, then that is a huge, huge problem, and you need to get whatever resources to the person so they get out of it.

Perhaps I should specify what I mean by porn–if you are talking full nudity and the performance of sexual acts, then I agree, the industry has corruptive elements that are definitely damaging. What I have more in mind is bikini modeling in which the women act of free will and make easy $$$. They are taking advantage of their God-giving blessings, and perhaps they are contributing to it as well (by working out, exercising, etc.) and earning some money while the man enjoys some harmless pleasure. It’s not like a middle-aged man is going to think that he can honestly land one of these babes, so I doubt it will actually harm his marriage.

It is a shame that the internet makes it hard for you to align the “pornography conversation” better with puberty. Not a whole lot you can do–even if you manage to block it out of your house, what are you going to do when your kid visits a friend and they roam the computers?

I think the key is to remember that it’s something we all went through, and most likely, we’ll have bigger things to worry about than moderation when it comes to lust. I’m sorry you’ve had to see the damaging sides of the industry, though. My prayers are with you.
 
AvignonPapacy94 said:
So in order to raise your kids Catholic, you have to be a perfect Catholic?
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In order to take your children sailing you have to be a competent sailor. In order to raise your kids healthy, you have to believe in hygeine. In order to raise your kids as English speaking you have to be competent in English. You have to have a basic grasp on the ideals that you are desiring to impart otherwise you’re just scamming them to their detriment.
 
Absolutely. I agree with that. I’d consider myself a competent Catholic.
 
AvignonPapacy94 said:
So in order to raise your kids Catholic, you have to be a perfect Catholic?
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In order to raise your children Catholic you should WANT to be perfect.

So be perfect, just as your heavenly Father is perfect. Mt 5:48
AvignonPapacy94 said:
If you miss some masses, occassionally masturbate and look at porn, or use contraception with your life, then the faith forecloses to you?
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If you do these things, you have the opportunity to repent, confess, and strive to do better.
AvignonPapacy94 said:
Sorry, but I can’t believe that in a world of 1.2 billion Catholics, all of them are that perfect.
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But the majority of them strive for holiness. We are all called to do that.

Strive for peace with everyone, and for that holiness without which no one will see the Lord. Hebrews 12:14
AvignonPapacy94 said:
I don’t think you should have to be the exemplar of every letter of Church teaching to raise your kids Catholic.
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You are the only exemplar your child has. Seems that you don’t really care what example he sees.
AvignonPapacy94 said:
But you think if I drag my family to church every week, then it’ll be easier to win?
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You are still framing the situation in terms of a competition. You are on the wrong track.
AvignonPapacy94 said:
I make about 2x as much money as my wife.
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what does that have to do with anything?
 
1ke said:
what does that have to do with anything?
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To explain the power dynamics of the relationship. For instance, if my wife gained like 75 pounds, she’d lose some of her upper hand. I make a lot more money, so that puts me in the driver’s seat a bit, so to speak. When we both are in disagreement, it helps being the one who can emerge victorious and get this resolved.
 
And I agree that it is important to set a good example for my children. That’s why I’m here.
 
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