Will Pell be defrocked?

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My wife traveling on Business was at Mass at that Cathedral not three weeks ago. Controversy aside. She was impressed with the beauty.
 
Celibacy is a great gift. If you cannot be chaste, then you shouldn’t be allowed to become a priest. Period. One should not be regularly committing mortal sins against chastity while in seminary and then get the OK to become a priest. You should be able to go years comfortably celibate before being ordained. A man who regularly commits grave sins shouldn’t be ordained. Period.
 
Emeraldlady said:
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Erikaspirit16:
I’m genuinely curious. What would it take for all you who think Pell is innocent / falsely accused / etc. change your minds? Apparently guilty verdicts are worthless. So what, then? Or do you take the position that nothing can ever be “proven” to your satisfaction?
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It would take legitimate credible evidence that has always been associated with priestly pedophilia/pederasty. Pell has been convicted only on the evidence of one person who made no mention to a single other person about this abuse until nearly 20 years afterwards in 2014.

When the current accusation was made, it was at a time when Pell was being accused of ignoring a report of abuse as a young Priest in Ballarat. What was needed to ‘get him’ was what’s called in legalese ‘propensity evidence’. That is some sign of his propensity to abuse or cover up abuse. That was when this claimant made his accusation of being abused in St Pat’s Melbourne. He alleged the incident happened when he and a friend had snuck into the Sacristy after Mass ended and were swigging altar wine. Problem is that the friend denied the abuse and the court heard from his parents that when they’d asked him if he was abused, the friend said no. The friend died of an overdose in 2014 clearing the way for the claimant to go ahead unchallenged.

Needing again some ‘propensity evidence’, 2 more men were found who claimed that Pell had abused them at the Ballarat pool in the 70’s. The problem with these two was credibility. Both were career criminals who’ve been in and out of jail. One has also already attempted to get compensation from a female teacher who he accused of beating him class. Their case has been dropped this week meaning no need to keep the suppression order.

The fact that even the community of victims in Ballarat were surprised to hear that George Pell had been accused, is telling. Paul Tatchell who was a former mayor in the district and a survivor of one of the notorious pedophile Priests of the area and had been an advocate for some 60 other victims… expressed surprise on hearing about it. He claims that there had never been a hint or any dirt on Cardinal Pell which would be unusual when there was a climate of openness among Ballarat victims. George Pell at the Ballarat pool: 'Everything he did was done with a grandeur'

The constant theme of Priestly pedophiles so far convicted is their long history of abuse of victims. It makes Pell unique that there is only 1 single accuser over his 77 year old history. (apart from the non credible ‘propensity evidence’ pool accusers who popped up suddenly at a most ‘convenient’ time.)

So for me, I’d like to see some more victims come forward while Pell is still alive, with credible accounts of abuse.
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Thank you for your link 🙂
I find it interesting that I am the only one that has looked at it,it makes me wonder have any here actually read your very informative post 🤔
 
Absolutely. In fact, homosexual intercourse is one of the most grave sexual sins. Get them out, first time. And tighten up the formation process, as you infer.
 
Vonsalza said:
Which has nothing to do with the pedophilia problem in the Catholic Church.
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Why not? You argue that married priests is a solution, but if much of the abuse is perpetrated by married men, then how is that a solution?
 
Within the Catholic clerical hierarchy, the abuse is overwhelmingly committed against young boys and adolescent males. One only needs to look at the statistics to see that.

This has been the case historically as well.

One can interpret this in different ways but the data is legit regardless.
 
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Greenfields said:
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Emeraldlady:
It would take legitimate credible evidence that has always been associated with priestly pedophilia/pederasty. Pell has been convicted only on the evidence of one person who made no mention to a single other person about this abuse until nearly 20 years afterwards in 2014.

When the current accusation was made, it was at a time when Pell was being accused of ignoring a report of abuse as a young Priest in Ballarat. What was needed to ‘get him’ was what’s called in legalese ‘propensity evidence’. That is some sign of his propensity to abuse or cover up abuse. That was when this claimant made his accusation of being abused in St Pat’s Melbourne. He alleged the incident happened when he and a friend had snuck into the Sacristy after Mass ended and were swigging altar wine. Problem is that the friend denied the abuse and the court heard from his parents that when they’d asked him if he was abused, the friend said no. The friend died of an overdose in 2014 clearing the way for the claimant to go ahead unchallenged.

Needing again some ‘propensity evidence’, 2 more men were found who claimed that Pell had abused them at the Ballarat pool in the 70’s. The problem with these two was credibility. Both were career criminals who’ve been in and out of jail. One has also already attempted to get compensation from a female teacher who he accused of beating him class. Their case has been dropped this week meaning no need to keep the suppression order.

The fact that even the community of victims in Ballarat were surprised to hear that George Pell had been accused, is telling. Paul Tatchell who was a former mayor in the district and a survivor of one of the notorious pedophile Priests of the area and had been an advocate for some 60 other victims… expressed surprise on hearing about it. He claims that there had never been a hint or any dirt on Cardinal Pell which would be unusual when there was a climate of openness among Ballarat victims. George Pell at the Ballarat pool: 'Everything he did was done with a grandeur'

The constant theme of Priestly pedophiles so far convicted is their long history of abuse of victims. It makes Pell unique that there is only 1 single accuser over his 77 year old history. (apart from the non credible ‘propensity evidence’ pool accusers who popped up suddenly at a most ‘convenient’ time.)

So for me, I’d like to see some more victims come forward while Pell is still alive, with credible accounts of abuse.
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Thank you for your link 🙂
I find it interesting that I am the only one that has looked at it,it makes me wonder have any here actually read your very informative post 🤔
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It is an interesting article in that it can’t be accused of bias. The fact that victims and advocates deeply involved in the victims community in Ballarat, were surprised by the sudden accusations against Pell, has to be significant.
 
Greenfields said:
We have our washed out versions of 'Catholic 'schools ,and our fair dinkim catholic schools .I wish I’d sent mine to the later.
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Could you explain the difference to a non-Aussie? I’m not familiar with the regional vernacular.

Is “fair dinkim” used like “legitimate” or “valid”?
 
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Meaning the real thing.Having practicing Catholics teaching religion for starters.
 
Hoosier-Daddy said:
Believe based on what? Are you charging the Jury members with destroying an innocent man’s life? Australia is 23 percent Catholic as of the 2016 census. America is 24 percent Catholic… Personally I’d say with some recent events that America is far more antiCatholic especially when you factor in the Bible Belt south. And though historically many Catholics are Irish, I’d say Ireland and England are two of the most anti Catholic countries in the west. Yet we know that the trials of accused in America and Ireland are pretty dependable. We also have the mistakes made by the Church leadership in Chile and the Pope himself. I’m inclined to extend the virtue of Charity to the country of Australia and certainly to innocent jurors over a Church that is caught up in cover up and bias.You can assert positively his innocence if you wish. But it sounds odd right? I believe convicted pedophile Pell is innocent even though I have less info than the Jury…
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You may not be aware of the case but many of us older Australians continue to painfully recall the horrendous false conviction of Lindy Chamberlain accused of killing her baby daughter. This case has so many similar characteristics. Chamberlain had previous to the charges, lived a blameless religiously devout life. She protested her innocence every step of the way. She had the unfortunate quirk of autistic affect which wasn’t understood in the 80’s that made her come across as cold, aloof, uncaring and odd. Her going on the stand in her defense cemented the jury’s opinion that she was a psychopathic baby killer. People are saying why didn’t they put Pell on the stand but us oldies know only too well how quick people are to judge someone with odd affect as sinister.

Even the scenes of the vilification and vulgarity being hurled outside the court is so reminiscent of how Lindy Chamberlain was vilified. She spent 3 years in prison all appeals being denied. New evidence was discovered (a jacket worn by the baby found in a dingoes lair by tourists) confirming the account the Chamberlains originally gave and she was released. It took another 3 years for the conviction to be vacated and she be declared totally innocent.

So if people ask, how can a jury get a conviction so wrong… I suggest they do some cursory research into all the wrongful convictions that have happened prior to this.
 
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The only case Americans would be familiar with would be the dingo eating a baby one… lol. We have many false convictions here too. R Kelly, Cosby, oj, dahmer, kasinsky etc…
 
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