Will the Liberal Church 'Schism'?

  • Thread starter Thread starter EudistCJM
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Yes you may my brother in Christ. For those that tell you, that you may not, they know nothing of supplied jurisdiction
rben20 said:
Ok so if I have a love for the TLM may I take part in SSPX Mass? Are all the sacraments valid?
Click to expand...
 
EudistCJM said:
Question is, will the Church ever ‘change’ these teachings? If not, do you see a possible schism later on?
Click to expand...
As you have pointed out the teachings cannot change. I don’t know that many of the people who hold these views would fit a canonical definition of schism yet (although many do). Beyond their public figures, most of them are not even heretics (they are in error, but unless they spread that error, not heretical). However, next year in Detroit their major organizations are forming a new umbrella organization, starting Pentecost Sunday 2011 with a “lay council”. The have already endorsed Americanism (as condemned by Leo XIII). Hopefully this will awaken a modicum of courage: in them that they might leave or repent, and in the bishops that they respond with appropriate vigor to the assault on the faith.
 
CDNowak said:
As you have pointed out the teachings cannot change. I don’t know that many of the people who hold these views would fit a canonical definition of schism yet (although many do). Beyond their public figures, most of them are not even heretics (they are in error, but unless they spread that error, not heretical). However, next year in Detroit their major organizations are forming a new umbrella organization, starting Pentecost Sunday 2011 with a “lay council”. The have already endorsed Americanism (as condemned by Leo XIII). Hopefully this will awaken a modicum of courage: in them that they might leave or repent, and in the bishops that they respond with appropriate vigor to the assault on the faith.
Click to expand...
since when such a thing ever exist? a council called by lay peopple to decide the fate of the CC?
 
wisdomseeker said:
since when such a thing ever exist? a council called by lay peopple to decide the fate of the CC?
Click to expand...
Note the quotes, the fact that these are dissenting groups, and the rise of Americanism. This is the closest these groups have been to formal schism since the infamous Call To Action Conference (that one was called by bishops in 1976).
 
Emmit_Fitzhume said:
I do not think you truly know what you are talking about? If we were lepers as you imply, Rome would not be hosting us for Doctrinal talks. The truth of the matter is that ANY Catholic may go to an SSPX Mass out of love for the Traditional Latin Mass. Why do you distort the truth so much?
Click to expand...
You are correct, in a way. I think that a Catholic can go to an SSPX Mass, but, I don’t believe it is licit. And, I have nothing against the SSPX. I believe they are a valid society, with good intention, but they are lacking one thing: The One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church under the holy authority of our Pope Benedict XVI. You clearly love the church, though.
Magnus467 said:
Rome reached out to you because Rome seeks to be one. Romes reaches out to Protestants and the Orthodox and atheists. The Latin Mass is not necessary to the survival of the Church and is not the Church. The Latin Mass didn’t exist for centuries. The Eastern Catholics seem to survive quite well without it. Some people didn’t want the TLM because it would spread the influence of schismatics, at the time, like Lvefebre (I don’t know how to spell it). Who are you to declare yourselves the guardian of the Church? I doubt the HS inspired their excommunication. It appears Pope Benedict and the FSSP appear to be the tools not the SSPX. The Church does not need you, you need the Church. There is no salvation outside the Church.
Click to expand...
👍 Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus! And, it’s Lefebvre 😉
The FSSP is great, so is the ICRSS.
 
LoyalViews said:
You are correct, in a way. I think that a Catholic can go to an SSPX Mass, but, I don’t believe it is licit. And, I have nothing against the SSPX. I believe they are a valid society, with good intention, but they are lacking one thing: The One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church under the holy authority of our Pope Benedict XVI. You clearly love the church, though.

👍 Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus! And, it’s Lefebvre 😉
The FSSP is great, so is the ICRSS.
Click to expand...
they lack nothing. while the SSPX go around defending the pope and blessing the pope, snd keeping the teachings of the Church, the liberals of the NO Mass, are going around slamming the Pope and causing the people to disobey the pope, and disecrating the Holy Mass.
who is lacking now?
 
wisdomseeker said:
they lack nothing. while the SSPX go around defending the pope and blessing the pope, snd keeping the teachings of the Church, the liberals of the NO Mass, are going around slamming the Pope and causing the people to disobey the pope, and disecrating the Holy Mass.
who is lacking now?
Click to expand...
They are lacking full communion with Rome. Without this, the SSPX is lacking much.
 
Dum_Spiro_Spero said:
Yes you may my brother in Christ. For those that tell you, that you may not, they know nothing of supplied jurisdiction
Click to expand...
Actually, if you can avoid it, you may not. Confessions and Marriages are not valid. SSPX seeks to make itself greater than Rome and sole arbiter of the Catholic faith. But what do I know I’m a liberal modernist heretic and a self-appointed canon lawyer and armchair theologian.
 
Magnus467 said:
SSPX seeks to make itself greater than Rome and sole arbiter of the Catholic faith.
Click to expand...
Really? I didn’t see anywhere where the SSPX excommunicated Rome or even tried to. What’s more, they actually try to abide by the new Canon Law and follow the 1962 Missal. Imagine that.
 
ProVobis said:
Really? I didn’t see anywhere where the SSPX excommunicated Rome or even tried to. What’s more, they actually try to abide by the new Canon Law and follow the 1962 Missal. Imagine that.
Click to expand...
I’m gonna start calling you Babe Ruth, the Sultan of Swat, the King of the swing.

Another home run.
 
Magnus467 said:
Actually, if you can avoid it, you may not. Confessions and Marriages are not valid. SSPX seeks to make itself greater than Rome and sole arbiter of the Catholic faith. But what do I know I’m a liberal modernist heretic and a self-appointed canon lawyer and armchair theologian.
Click to expand...
My advice to you is to inquire why and whither. Ice cream is to be enjoyed, that’s agreed, but it too melts and fades away. Enjoying the moment is fine, and is encouraged, but every moment echoes in eternity at our own particular judgment. Of each and every one of us.
 
Emmit_Fitzhume said:
The SSPX are the pillars of The Church. Let history be the judge. We will be thanked for our service in the end.
Click to expand...
Then why the excommunications, I wonder? The SSPX are the source of the problems. This is what happens with rebellion.
 
StTommyMore said:
Then why the excommunications, I wonder? The SSPX are the source of the problems. This is what happens with rebellion.
Click to expand...
A better question: why the lifting of the excommunications? And a more timely question. The Society has not altered it position not iota unum.
 
ProVobis said:
Have all been lifted, conceding that there were some.
Click to expand...
But their faculties have yet to be restored, rendering every SSPX Mass as illicit. There is nothing wrong with desiring the TLM. There is a problem with attending an illicit Mass in order to do so.
 
StTommyMore said:
But their faculties have yet to be restored, rendering every SSPX Mass as illicit. There is nothing wrong with desiring the TLM. There is a problem with attending an illicit Mass in order to do so.
Click to expand...
Then your issue is really with Cardinal de Hoyos who quite a number of years ago declared a Society Mass as fulfilling one’s Sunday obligations. You have another issue with Canon Law which clearly spells out supplied jurisdiction. You have another issue with His Holiness Benedict who has never spoken or published anything to the contrary, as you have been (quite unfortunately) screaming about.

Maybe vyou can take your issues up with Carinal de Hoyos, Canon Law and Our Holy Father?
 
You argue about fidelity to The Holy See, yet the Holy See said it is perfectly ok for any Catholic to attend the TLM at any SSPX Chapel out of attachment to the Traditional Latin Mass. Too risk sounding like all the people who try to discredit us, “Do you think you know better than The Pope”?
StTommyMore said:
But their faculties have yet to be restored, rendering every SSPX Mass as illicit. There is nothing wrong with desiring the TLM. There is a problem with attending an illicit Mass in order to do so.
Click to expand...
 
Emmit_Fitzhume said:
You argue about fidelity to The Holy See, yet the Holy See said it is perfectly ok for any Catholic to attend the TLM at any SSPX Chapel out of attachment to the Traditional Latin Mass. Too risk sounding like all the people who try to discredit us, “Do you think you know better than The Pope”?
Click to expand...
Provide the document.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top