Woman in Islam.

[seraphime2008]

i was talking about history. it is a well known fact that muslims during the middle ages had excelled in all scientific and medical and astronomic and philosophic and etcetera fields above the west

wasalam

Live up your dream about the past, hold on to the glory of those golden age which happened waaaaay long ago which is not the reality now. I bet those terrorists were also acting on behalf of muslims dreaming about those golden age, they really can’t see the fact that it’s all over because what they claimed to be golden age, was an age of oppressing other people and oppressing free thinking and they’ve been fought back…and read some more books about it, a reliable one that can show you that what u claimed is not really true. I remember reading that those Muslim scholars you claimed excelled, were the ones that were more free independent thinkers who might find that some Islamics rules and regulations might hinder them from thinking advance.

 

[seraphime2008]

:console:, I agree with all your points expect for the last one, because sometimes I think such gathering might leads to a sin at the end, from people getting drunk to start kissing and at the end committing adultery.

Indeed Sam, you have to free your self from your set of cultural background to be able to see that what happened in other part of the world is not really that black and white. Why gathering will end to kissing and getting drunk and commiting adultery? Believe me, even in Indonesia, a rather secular country though most are Muslims, it doesn’t happen that way. If you have that kind of thought, then whenever you meet a girl or women, your focus will be shifted to whether that should have a lusting effect to you? C’mon dude!

 

[ZAKI]

Live up your dream about the past, hold on to the glory of those golden age which happened waaaaay long ago which is not the reality now. I bet those terrorists were also acting on behalf of muslims dreaming about those golden age, they really can’t see the fact that it’s all over because what they claimed to be golden age, was an age of oppressing other people and oppressing free thinking and they’ve been fought back…and read some more books about it, a reliable one that can show you that what u claimed is not really true. I remember reading that those Muslim scholars you claimed excelled, were the ones that were more free independent thinkers who might find that some Islamics rules and regulations might hinder them from thinking advance.

that’s what you think

wasalam

 

[seraphime2008]

responsabilities wasn’t that complicated in the desert 1400 years ago , it was custom to marry in such ages between muslims and christians and jews and pagans , and churches never objected such marriage
i agree with you that the time change , afterall it’s silent issue in islam . it’s not obligated upon muslims to marry little girls

my holy book is of all time and place , my holy book didn’t determine the age of marriage in the first place . even todays there is no common laws about the age of marriage

yes i remember this discussion , where we was talking about the favor of islam and teaching of mohammed (pbuh) upon the slave women and favor of islam to end slavery gradually in muslims society

i read some of them
1)Women should learn in silence and subjugation.

2)Women should not teach.

3)Women should not have authority over men but should remain silent.

4)Adam and Eve were not equal in sin. Adam was not deceived but Eve was.

5)Women are commanded to be under obedience to men. God ordained that men shall for all time rule over women

6)Women must keep silent in Churches. It is shameful for them to open their mouths therein. If they have a question they should ask their husbands before going to church and then their husbands will ask for them in the church.

7)A woman should neither pray nor profess with her head uncovered.

8)If a woman prays with her head uncovered then she might as well shave her head.

9)Man was created in the image and glory of God, and Woman was created in the glory of Man, thus Man must have power over her.

10)Any woman who delivers a male baby shall be unclean for one week. But any woman who delivers a female baby shall be unclean for TWO weeks. Thus, females make their mothers DOUBLY unclean as compared to males.

11)While it is possible to find one upright man in every thousand, it is impossible to find even one single upright woman in every thousand

12)Woman is a snare, her heart is a trap, and her hands are chains. The man who pleases God will escape her, but she will ensnare the sinner.

13)If a woman had her period and touches a chair or a bed or anything else then that item immediately becomes unclean. Anyone who then touches those things shall also become unclean. They must then bathe themselves and wash their clothes because they have touched an item that a menstruous woman has touched

Whatever you say…I have already said what I believe was the truth and path towards how Christian view women differently than Muslim. I’ve all answered your above list of wrong understanding of the bible. So it’s up to you whether to see it with a clean mind or with blind one.Anyway I can also conclude after all your posts of “playing words” and taqqiya, that:

• in Islam, marriage is only about legalizing sex, so there is no need to have responsibilities or some kind of higher dignify holy purpose in a marriage because after all it’s all about how sex can be performed in halal way. And the duty of a wife is just to produce children and give a sex service to her husband. Indeed for such thing you don’t need to limit the age. Any body can be married and be divorced even a young woman who hasn’t got her menstruation. So there’s no need for mental preparation, as long as the husband can get what he wanted, why need to be complicated, right?

-a slave can be taken as wife indeed, after all wife is only to perform sex. Why bother the status? Responsibility is just a way of rewarding those sex and perhaps children that come along. No need to be complicated of course. If they can’t satisfy the husband, no complication, just divorce them, give them some money, the case is close.

Ok…now I can see how you really favor your “religion”. It gives you what you always want. Indeed evil always want to entertain you, why complication, doncha think?

you didn’t tell me the view of your holy books about the age of marriage ?

I can understand if you have some objection to see the truth. Too hurtful.

 

[ZAKI]

Whatever you say…I have already said what I believe was the truth and path towards how Christian view women differently than Muslim. I’ve all answered your above list of wrong understanding of the bible. So it’s up to you whether to see it with a clean mind or with blind one.Anyway I can also conclude after all your posts of “playing words” and taqqiya, that:

• in Islam, marriage is only about legalizing sex, so there is no need to have responsibilities or some kind of higher dignify holy purpose in a marriage because after all it’s all about how sex can be performed in halal way. And the duty of a wife is just to produce children and give a sex service to her husband. Indeed for such thing you don’t need to limit the age. Any body can be married and be divorced even a young woman who hasn’t got her menstruation. So there’s no need for mental preparation, as long as the husband can get what he wanted, why need to be complicated, right?

-a slave can be taken as wife indeed, after all wife is only to perform sex. Why bother the status? Responsibility is just a way of rewarding those sex and perhaps children that come along. No need to be complicated of course. If they can’t satisfy the husband, no complication, just divorce them, give them some money, the case is close.

Ok…now I can see how you really favor your “religion”. It gives you what you always want. Indeed evil always want to entertain you, why complication, doncha think?

I can understand if you have some objection to see the truth. Too hurtful.

he asked you to share the view of the bible to the age of consent for marriage-plz share

wasalam

 

[seraphime2008]

Quote:
Originally Posted by seraphime2008 View Post
I am only stating the main line, but you can find the verses in the bible yourself:

• that the women were entrusted as the witness of Jesus resurrection at the time that women were not hold the trust of witness.

which means ?

*which means that eversince that time, women can be regarded equally as men, their testimonies are regarded valid. Not as in your so called holy book, women only worth half of men or even less. *

Quote:

• that Mary was entrusted with God’s plan to be the mother of the saviour.

so , the saviour have a mother means that woman be respected in christianity ?

*Yeah of course, don’t you respect your mother or a mother doesn’t mean anything to you? She was entrusted to be involved in a plan, then u have to think that she was not a meek woman who didn’t know what to do and what to say, stay at the back. She was actively engaging herself.
*
Quote:
-that women are equal to men in all the teachings.

how that differ than women in islam ?

Read what Sam had posted above.

Quote:
-that we can find women talking and discussing things with men in equal manner as in the bible.
according to the bible

Women must keep silent in Churches. It is shameful for them to open their mouths therein. If they have a question they should ask their husbands before going to church and then their husbands will ask for them in the church.

*Ah…really, see what I’ve told and explained to u regarding these in previous post. Or you just playing of skipping and innocence. Jesus have talked and discussed with women. *

Quote:
and many others I supposed you might find your self if you read the bible.
Btw community situation is a reflection of what they believe, and supported by the teachings that they hold. I believe Christian community has endorsed the belief that men and women are equal well, as opposed to many Muslim countries when women are still facing so many oppression.

what about community situation in the dark period of the west ?

Which dark period? Did the dark period say that women was silent? Did the women were granted all her equality by men as prize or bonus, or because the community can finally see the truth in the bible so that we can see now that it’s prevalent? Or so called Islamic’s rule have changed the society at least in its own? As far as I can remember, those countries that applied shariah have been reported having so many oppression towards women up till now…now…at this very-very moment ?

Quote:
really…really…? that they start thinking as adolescent before they get their menstruation? and that only signifies Islam’s teaching that women before menstruation can get married…and later can be divorced. What ridiculous thing! And you keep thinking that this is instruction from God. Wake up…!!!

it isn’t instructions from God , it’s just solutions for wrong decisions
allah didn’t instruct muslims to divorce thier wifes , he just gave it us as a solution for wrong decisions

everytime you come to this stumble block you always come with illogical answer that God give solution like this. It’s man’s solution to escape his problems…how come that to solve problems you have to runaway from it?*

Quote:
But this is about young man and young women, not young women with old men…that’s pedophilia as Muhammad had practiced.

do you wanna to say that it’s okey foe a man to marry 9 yo if he was younger than mohammed (pbuh) ?
do wanna to say that pedophilia isn’t about the little age , rather it’s about age difference between spouses ?

*I am only stressing that the absurd situation is worse in Muhammad’s case. And of course pedophilia is about age difference since the old men supposedly know all the consequences and can rationalize what a marriage is about and what sex is about, while the little child was practically forced to do so and have no idea at all what it is about. So Muhammad has given a very-very bad example as a prophet of all time.
Are you loosing your balance thought now? seems that you’re just legalizing whatever in the name of Allah. My God,…that’s just what evil want.
Quote:
I don’t know that the Jews practiced young marriage at that time, but I believe it’s the same situation with that ethnic marriage I mentioned before, but I don’t believe any Jew would still do that, and they certainly didn’t learn from the Muslim. You on the other hand can’t annul that rule since it’s in your book.

age of marriage never determined in our book , we can marry in any age

Yeah…I can see it clearly now…*

Quote:
Why do Jesus have to address the age of marriage that when all the responsibilities of a wife is clearly mention in the bible, and it’s clearly understood that such responsibilities can not be hold upon a little young girl. Understand?
because it was custom to marry in such little age

anyway , which responsabilities the little girls can’t hold ?

I supposed as a rational man you can understand the mental development in human. That’s why we as human knows that there are certain stage of human life with their own development. Or perhaps in Islamic countries little girls were called miniature?*
Reply With Quote Multi-Quote This Message

 

[elwill]

not all quran is so clear … anyway since you are sunni not shiit
i have no problem to repet the rule for you : anyone can not explain the quran by himself and by his interpretation but hemay return to the 4 explainers ( tabari qortobi aljalalyn ibnkathir)
and again man
you change the sences of things
is not marrying captives …it’s make them a slaves for all their lives
may i repet ?
the captive woman is not a wife she still always a captive woman
hah

• First :

malakat alyamin = slaves ; why? because malakat alyamin mean :
malakat = your property
and malakat alyamin = (اماء imae) = slaves at all

• second :

islam didn’t gave to the slaves women anyright
or lately the same rights given to the wives the free women
review the verse 3 of sourat annisa
don’t forget you aren’t talking to a normal guy … no you’re talking to an MURTAD and proud to be
and knowing very well his ex fake religion

you don’t feel shame because your religion legalise raping and taking women as slaves ? just for raping their and for sex
are you serious man ?

man there is not slave women in christianity ;; don’t you know that’s is christianity there is no divorce and just the alone wife for all the life !!!
and we aren’t talking about this in this topic
you can a new topic in the convent forum and talk about what do you want in christianity

not allowed now alhamdo lillah ??!!
why alhamdo lillah ? you disgust from your religion and your prophet ?
isen’t that’s your statue ? so why you are so happy when it stop right now ?
don’t you know that’s if the islamic countries began strongs again and made wars against non muslims can take the women as slaves !!!
don’t you know this ???

she’s Maris the copt and mohamed did not marry her ever
that’s what you Sirah books says !

i’m sorry to telling you that’s you’re false
the verse mean 100/100 the little girl not unwell yet
please review what the explainers says
and true mohamd legalise pedophilia

Paul , when Islam was reveled to Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him), slavery was a worldwide common social phenomenon; it was much older than Islam. Slavery was deeply rooted in every society to the extent that it was impossible to imagine a civilized society without slaves.

In spite of this social fact, Islam was the first religion to recognize slavery as a social illness that needed to be addressed. Since slavery was deeply rooted in the society, Islam did not abolish it at once. Rather, Islam treated slavery in the same manner it treated other social illnesses. Islam followed the same methodology of gradual elimination in dealing with this social disease as it did with other social illnesses, for example: the prohibition of alcohol in three steps.

Concerning having slave women, we would like to let you know that it happens to be a practice necessitated by the condition in which early Muslims found themselves vis-a-vis non-Muslims, as both parties engaged in wars. Slave women are referred to in the Qur’an as “Those whom your right hand possess” or “ma malakat aymanukum”; they are those taken as captives during conquests and subsequently became slaves, or those who were descendants of slaves.

**Thus, it was a war custom in the past to take men and women as captives and then turn them into slaves. Islam did not initiate it, rather, it was something in practice long ago before the advent of Islam. And when Islam came, it tried to eradicate this practice, bit by bit. So it first restricted it to the reciprocal practice of war, in the sense that Muslims took war captives just as the enemies did with Muslims. **

But as it aimed at putting an end to such issue, Islam laid down rules which would eventually lead to eradicating the practice. So it allowed Muslims to have intercourse with slave women taken as captives of just and legitimate wars. In so doing, the woman would automatically become free if she got pregnant. What’s more, her child would also become free

Not only that, Islam also ordered a Muslim to treat the slave woman in every respect as if she were his wife. She should be well fed, clothed and given due protection. In the family environment, she had the opportunity to learn about Islam and was free to accept it or reject it. She also had the opportunity to earn her freedom for she could be ransomed.

In the light of the above-mentioned facts, and the nature of the question posed by people, it’s clear that some people misunderstand the wisdom behind the permissibility of having female slaves and think that it is meant to unleash men’s desires and give them more enjoyment. Never ! That is not the point ! It is, rather, means of freeing slaves; and this is clarified above in the fact that if a master got a female slave pregnant, then he could neither sell her nor give her away as a present. And if he died, she would not be considered part of his property. She’d receive her freedom and her baby would also be free.

so Paul , instead of throwing your blames against islam for it’s dealing with such illness practice , tell us what jesus did according to it !!!

 

[Jay53]

But as it aimed at putting an end to such issue, Islam laid down rules which would eventually lead to eradicating the practice. So it allowed Muslims to have intercourse with slave women taken as captives of just and legitimate wars. In so doing, the woman would automatically become free if she got pregnant. What’s more, her child would also become free

Wait just a minute! I thought you said in the other thread that the Muslim men could marry a slave, that the verse in the Quran did not mean a ‘master’ could just have intercourse with her. How is just having intercourse with a slave woman one is not married to not adultery?!?!?

This also means that she doesn’t get her freedom unless she gets pregnant!!!

Edit: I also just want to add, even though it’s off topic, since elwill asked what Jesus did, He gave us the commandment: (Matthew 22: 39-40) “…Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”

 

[Paul_89_33]

Paul , when Islam was reveled to Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him), slavery was a worldwide common social phenomenon; it was much older than Islam. Slavery was deeply rooted in every society to the extent that it was impossible to imagine a civilized society without slaves.
In spite of this social fact, Islam was the first religion to recognize slavery as a social illness that needed to be addressed. Since slavery was deeply rooted in the society, Islam did not abolish it at once. Rather, Islam treated slavery in the same manner it treated other social illnesses. Islam followed the same methodology of gradual elimination in dealing with this social disease as it did with other social illnesses, for example: the prohibition of alcohol in three steps.
Concerning having slave women, we would like to let you know that it happens to be a practice necessitated by the condition in which early Muslims found themselves vis-a-vis non-Muslims, as both parties engaged in wars. Slave women are referred to in the Qur’an as “Those whom your right hand possess” or “ma malakat aymanukum”; they are those taken as captives during conquests and subsequently became slaves, or those who were descendants of slaves.
**Thus, it was a war custom in the past to take men and women as captives and then turn them into slaves. Islam did not initiate it, rather, it was something in practice long ago before the advent of Islam. And when Islam came, it tried to eradicate this practice, bit by bit. So it first restricted it to the reciprocal practice of war, in the sense that Muslims took war captives just as the enemies did with Muslims. **
But as it aimed at putting an end to such issue, Islam laid down rules which would eventually lead to eradicating the practice. So it allowed Muslims to have intercourse with slave women taken as captives of just and legitimate wars. In so doing, the woman would automatically become free if she got pregnant. What’s more, her child would also become free
Not only that, Islam also ordered a Muslim to treat the slave woman in every respect as if she were his wife. She should be well fed, clothed and given due protection. In the family environment, she had the opportunity to learn about Islam and was free to accept it or reject it. She also had the opportunity to earn her freedom for she could be ransomed.
In e light of the above-mentioned facts, and the nature of the question posed by people, it’s clear that some people misunderstand the wisdom behind the permissibility of having female slaves and think that it is meant to unleash men’s desires and give them more enjoyment. Never ! That is not the point ! It is, rather, means of freeing slaves; and this is clarified above in the fact that if a master got a female slave pregnant, then he could neither sell her nor give her away as a present. And if he died, she would not be considered part of his property. She’d receive her freedom and her baby would also be free.
so Paul , instead of throwing your blames against islam for it’s dealing with such illness practice , tell us what jesus did according to it !!!

all this is your interppretation and have no relation with
Quran and Sirah and not based ever to any quran text or a hadith i can’t accept it … if you want talk ; talk with the proof or just listen
and where’s your reply about my last reply for you ?
running
that’s ok i’ll post again the proofs from quran and waiting a muslim knowing his fake religion very well and able to reply according to islam not balderdash

• the muslim can take women as slaves

[3] If ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with the orphans, marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one, or (a captive) that your right hands possess. That will be more suitable, to prevent you from doing injustice.
4.3
my comment : of course those poor women are just for sex … how can muhamed a prophet and he commond on war and slaving ? where’s women right when ye capture a woman a free woman and transform her to a slave just like an animal or less
and note this : all non muslim women are legalized ti be captured and be slaves for muslim men . you too CA women

• Islam legalise PEDOPHELIA believe or not

[4] Such of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the prescribed period, if ye have any doubts, is three months, and for those who have no courses (it is the same): for those who carry (life within their wombs), their period is until they deliver their burdens: and for those who fear Allah, He will make their path easy
65.4
my comment : of course i have no comment i lat the commonts for you

trust me that’s a just sample for women in islam i’ll add more later

 

[elwill]

Wait just a minute! I thought you said in the other thread that the Muslim men could marry a slave, that the verse in the Quran did not mean a ‘master’ could just have intercourse with her. How is just having intercourse with a slave woman one is not married to not adultery?!?!?

This also means that she doesn’t get her freedom unless she gets pregnant!!!

Edit: I also just want to add, even though it’s off topic, since elwill asked what Jesus did, He gave us the commandment: (Matthew 22: 39-40) “…Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”

i clarified the whole issue allready

as for your asking about intercourse with slaves , it’s consider kind of marriage either , no way to be similar to adultery , the difference is that when you marry free women you give them dowery , but when you intercourse with slave you give them freedom

Islam restored dignity to slaves and enhanced their social status. It was this fact that always attracted slaves to Islam. It is painful to see that those who never cease to be vociferous in their unjust criticism of Islam should take no notice of this principle

again if your religion better than mine i will convert to your religion , islam came after christianity about 600 years , then tell me how christianity dealed with such problem ?

 

[elwill]

all this is your interppretation and have no relation with
Quran and Sirah and not based ever to any quran text or a hadith i can’t accept it … if you want talk ; talk with the proof or just listen
and where’s your reply about my last reply for you ?
running
that’s ok i’ll post again the proofs from quran and waiting a muslim knowing his fake religion very well and able to reply according to islam not balderdash

which part of my post you want proof about ?

• the muslim can take women as slaves

[3] If ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with the orphans, marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one, or (a captive) that your right hands possess. That will be more suitable, to prevent you from doing injustice.
4.3
my comment : of course those poor women are just for sex … how can muhamed a prophet and he commond on war and slaving ? where’s women right when ye capture a woman a free woman and transform her to a slave just like an animal or less
and note this : all non muslim women are legalized ti be captured and be slaves for muslim men . you too CA women

was taking women as captives of war prohibited in christianity ?

• Islam legalise PEDOPHELIA believe or not

[4] Such of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the prescribed period, if ye have any doubts, is three months, and for those who have no courses (it is the same): for those who carry (life within their wombs), their period is until they deliver their burdens: and for those who fear Allah, He will make their path easy
65.4
my comment : of course i have no comment i lat the commonts for you

trust me that’s a just sample for women in islam i’ll add more later

to find a common ground , give me defination for PEDOPHELIA , and give me proof that marrying little girls isn’t acceptable in your religion

 

[Paul_89_33]

• how the muslim can buy the slave woman ?

for alwill specially
let’s read two true Hadiths explaining how the muslim can buy the slave women for sex

” عن ابن عمر أنه كان إذا اشترى جارية كشف عن ساقها ووضع يده بين ثدييها وعلى عجزها وكأنه كان يضعها عليها من وراء الثياب “.
الراوي: نافع مولى ابن عمر
خلاصة الدرجة: إسناده صحيح
المحدث: الألباني
المصدر: إرواء الغليل
الصفحة أو الرقم: 6/201

the traduction ( by myself)
Omar’s son when he went buy the slave woman he uncorvred her leg and put his hands among her breasts and on her Butt like he put his hands under her clothes

Shame shame shame !!!
and they says that the islam the alone religion glory the woman
so elwill you stay in your opinion or not !!
now you don’t feel shame from your religion ?

 

[Paul_89_33]

i said that’s i’ll not let to change the subject
if you want talk about all this in christianity … just open a topic in the christian class not here and you’ll find the answer quicly

PEDOPHELIA is sexual deviation characterized by an abnormal sexual attraction to young children
from Babylon English-English
and tell me are you againt pedophelia or not ?

 

[planten]

i clarified the whole issue allready

as for your asking about intercourse with slaves , it’s consider kind of marriage either , no way to be similar to adultery , the difference is that when you marry free women you give them dowery , but when you intercourse with slave you give them freedom

Islam restored dignity to slaves and enhanced their social status. It was this fact that always attracted slaves to Islam. It is painful to see that those who never cease to be vociferous in their unjust criticism of Islam should take no notice of this principle

again if your religion better than mine i will convert to your religion , islam came after christianity about 600 years , then tell me how christianity dealed with such problem ?

**Elwill, your post #109 is excellent. Everything is very well described. There cannot be any improvement in it. But these people do not undertand. I amy just add few words about slavery under Islam. It should be read with your good post #109.

1. Islam did not initiate slavery. You also said that.
2. the slaves were to be treated as equal in matters of food and clothing. That was the order.
   3.They could buy themselves out by settling their price with the master and by doing labor some where.
3. Having sex with a slave girl is not adultery because she belongs to him. Of course nobody else could use her sexually.
4. The rest is described by Elwill that if ever the slave girl (lady) became pregnant, the master could not sell her. The child born would inherit propert from father. The christians do not hve any inheritance rule. So they may not appreciate that thing.
5. It is strictly forbidden to make free men into slaves without any war etc. One should remember the bad work that the christians of America did in Afrika, like catching free living men from the jungles. That was a shame on the face of all the christians. Later they had to free all the slaves. The African blacks suffered much in America. It was people like Abraham Lincoln who worked hard to free the poor souls in America.
6. I repeat. No free person could be made into a slave in Islam. There is a specific order of the prophet Muhammad in that respect.
7. Only reasonable work could be taken from the slaves. Slave was to be helped by the master or other free men in his work load.
8. Slave was to be given the same food that master ate.
9. Slave was to be given same clothing that the master wore.
10. Many Muslims acted on these orders of the prophet Muhammad.
11. A slave was not to be beaten or mistreated. Of course he could be sold and handed over to some one else for a price. No harm at all. The sons of Jacob sold their brother (Joseph) to the Arab Caravan people for a small price. Please note the practice of those times.
12. There were no jails in those days. The war captives had to be handled in some good manner. Islam adopted the best manners.
13. Special is the case of women captives. They were dealt well. They were distributed amongst familes. That slave belonged to the master. it is useless to say that what went on between them. There was a genearl understanding.
14. But i have also heard it that according to the Quran, even a slave lady could not be used for sex without marriage. I cannot prove it (remember the verses) but it is suggested by the Islamic scholars that master could never use slave lady without marriage. It was not allowed to use her without marriage. What more could be done for the slaves.
    16.If ever any one committed a sin, it was obligatory in some cases to free a slave.**

 

[elwill]

• how the muslim can buy the slave woman ?

for alwill specially
let’s read two true Hadiths explaining how the muslim can buy the slave women for sex

the traduction ( by myself)
Omar’s son when he went buy the slave woman he uncorvred her leg and put his hands among her breasts and on her Butt like he put his hands under her clothes

Shame shame shame !!!
and they says that the islam the alone religion glory the woman
so elwill you stay in your opinion or not !!
now you don’t feel shame from your religion ?

i allready said that when Islam was reveled , slavery was a worldwide common social phenomenon; it was much older than Islam. Slavery was deeply rooted in every society to the extent that it was impossible to imagine a civilized society without slaves.

this record is talking about this phenomenon , there is no mention about any islamic teaching or any encouragment or permission from the prophet

so what is your question exactly ?

 

[Paul_89_33]

i allready said that when Islam was reveled , slavery was a worldwide common social phenomenon; it was much older than Islam. Slavery was deeply rooted in every society to the extent that it was impossible to imagine a civilized society without slaves.
this record is talking about this phenomenon , there is no mention about any islamic teaching or any encouragment or permission from the prophet
so what is your question exactly ?

• first

you who asked me to telling you about slaves women market

• second

i’m not asking , i’m informing about how can the muslim buy the women

• thirth

if you says that’s slavery is common social phenomenon , what the difference now between islam and terrestrials religions
and if you say that islam encourage to fight again slavery , that’s false at all
islam encourage to slavery and wars and then capture women and make them slaves for sex

• fourth

i’m waiting your commont and muslims commonts about the omar son hadith
Omar’s son when he went buy the slave woman he uncorvred her leg and put his hands among her breasts and on her Butt like he put his hands under her clothes
عن ابن عمر أنه كان إذا اشترى جارية كشف عن ساقها ووضع يده بين ثدييها وعلى عجزها وكأنه كان يضعها عليها من وراء الثياب
i’m asking don’t feel shame from your religion ?
what your reply of all this ?
what is your human reply about this ? you like that happend to your mother or your sister or your wife ?
you stay in your first opinion that’s islam glory the woman ???

Sam , which religion is the best for woman then ?

 

[elwill]

i said that’s i’ll not let to change the subject
if you want talk about all this in christianity … just open a topic in the christian class not here and you’ll find the answer quicly

i wnat to hear the respond from you personally to test your double standard , it’s not about change the subject , i don’t try to change the subject , i just show you that you have a bigger problem in your religion .

** don’t throw others with stones if your home is built from glass **

PEDOPHELIA is sexual deviation characterized by an abnormal sexual attraction to young children
from Babylon English-English
and tell me are you againt pedophelia or not ?

how much little ? determine for me the age

by the way , your defination not applied to mohammed (pbuh) , as for he had 12 wives in her life , just one of them where little in her age , so where is the abnormal attreaction to young children ?

by the way , it was her father who offered his daughter to the prophet

 

[sedonaman]

…
3.They could buy themselves out by settling their price with the master and by doing labor some where.
…

How nice of Mohammed. I suppose they could do the labor in their free time.

 

[elwill]

• first

you who asked me to telling you about slaves women market

• second

i’m not asking , i’m informing about how can the muslim buy the women

• thirth

if you says that’s slavery is common social phenomenon , what the difference now between islam and terrestrials religions
and if you say that islam encourage to fight again slavery , that’s false at all
islam encourage to slavery and wars and then capture women and make them slaves for sex

• fourth

i’m waiting your commont and muslims commonts about the omar son hadith
Omar’s son when he went buy the slave woman he uncorvred her leg and put his hands among her breasts and on her Butt like he put his hands under her clothes
عن ابن عمر أنه كان إذا اشترى جارية كشف عن ساقها ووضع يده بين ثدييها وعلى عجزها وكأنه كان يضعها عليها من وراء الثياب

i’m asking don’t feel shame from your religion ?
what your reply of all this ?
what is your human reply about this ? you like that happend to your mother or your sister or your wife ?
you stay in your first opinion that’s islam glory the woman ???

i can’t understand why i have to feel shame , my religion helped to end slavery which be encouragmnet in your bible and which your churches always involved in the trading of slavery

my religion make me proud actually

beside your records have nothing with teaching of islam , islam was revealed through 23 years , it didn’t prohibit everything in the first year
when exactly from the period of islamic massage bn omar was talking about buying slaves ? can you tell me

may be he was talking about his tradition before islam , right ? who knows

 

[Jay53]

i clarified the whole issue allready

as for your asking about intercourse with slaves , it’s consider kind of marriage either , no way to be similar to adultery , the difference is that when you marry free women you give them dowery , but when you intercourse with slave you give them freedom

Islam restored dignity to slaves and enhanced their social status. It was this fact that always attracted slaves to Islam. It is painful to see that those who never cease to be vociferous in their unjust criticism of Islam should take no notice of this principle

again if your religion better than mine i will convert to your religion , islam came after christianity about 600 years , then tell me how christianity dealed with such problem ?

What’s the difference between “kind of marriage” and “marriage”?

I understood your previous explanation (in the other thread) that masters were not to have sex with slaves unless they married them first, but that is NOT what your previous post in this thread says. You wrote:

So it allowed Muslims to have intercourse with slave women taken as captives of just and legitimate wars. In so doing, the woman would automatically become free if she got pregnant. What’s more, her child would also become free

According to this Muslims can have sex with slave women - it does not say anything about marriage. And THEN, it goes on to say that “in so doing the woman would automatically become free if she got pregnant” which I take to mean that she is NOT free until she gets pregnant - which further means either a.) she is not married or b.) marriage does not free the woman and she is still considered a slave.