Woman sneaks Host to her son after Communion

[Br.Rich_SFO]

No way. Not unless the pastor expressly directed you to do that, and I doubt any would. Even then I doubt I would as I would be a bit concerned about any pastor that would give that sort of directive.

If you feel compelled, lay it all out for father and then step aside. It’s up to him to deal with it. Likely through communicating directly with her and catechesis and not by having operatives out in the pews. He might also alert the EMsHC.

It wouldn’t matter if they were Eastern Catholics by the way. That wouldn’t be an excuse for what they appear to be doing wrong.

There are many priests that ask for help in such matters. They cannot be everywhere and we should not be afraid to confront those who mistreat the Blessed Sacrament. An EMHC cannot chase down someone either. Other members of the faithful are in the best position to help with this. Many times they are not members of the parish and disapear quickly after Mass. Something that is also on the rise are people approaching Communion and taking the Host out of the Church for pagan purposes.

A small child of Eastern Rite parents may receive Holy Communion in the Catholic Church. Many times Eastern Rite parents will do this because the EMHC’s don’t now what to do when a 4,5,6 year old presents themselves with their parents for Holy Communion.

 

[MusicMan]

I don’t think this situation counts as desecration. It isn’t malicious. At worst, it’s disobedient. At best, there’s a misunderstanding somewhere.

As for the disabled situation in my parish, I agree that it may not be the best solution, but it is the one that the pastor is utilizing. I don’t believe it my place to question his wisdom on this matter.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

oh dear, that seems harsh too me. :nope: I don’t think it’s our job to be police. However, saying it a way that is more charitiable. “excuse me Miss?, are you Catholic?” Smile and be polite while asking the questions if the priest has allowed you to do this… We need to find out frist what’s going on before we start forcing a person. There could be many reasons. Just my own opinion, I know many will say “but it’s our Lord she is holding!!” I feel our Lord is understanding of the uneducated.

It is our “job” to protect the Blessed Sacrament when we see this. Yes, I agree that we are not to attack, but she should be stopped and asked, in a charitiable and polite manner. Too many today say “I’m not getting invloved!”

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

That just wouldn’t be the way to handle it. If the pastor shared the grave concern then he should speak to the woman off-line. He should also warn EMsHC to make sure she consumes the host in their presence. He might even make sure that it is he who distributes communion to her.

If those two actions don’t take care of the problem, I don’t think pew police will either. Just try to “STOP” her. It will just cause a scene and she’ll end-up ignoring the pew police or worse…

I have stopped “him” or “her” several different time in several different places. With the priest expressing his gratitude after, saying that he has noticed this from time to time but was never in a position to do anything about it before the person disapeared.

 

[seekerz]

I don’t really see a reasonable explanation for someone taking the Host to another in the pew. Call me old-fashioned, but distribution of the Eucharist is the business of a priest or EMHC.

Disabled or not (and I’m the parent of a disabled child myself), some of the examples given above to explain the mother’s action seem suspect to me.

Access to the Eucharist is not simply a function of age or physical mobility. How about the state of the soul? When someone takes the deliberate action of walking up to Communion or requests (if physically disabled) that it be given, this is quite a different thing than routinely being handed a Host he/she may not be spiritually prepared to receive.

Receiving Jesus is not just about what the recipient wants but what is proper and respectful of our Lord.

 

[Spiller]

It is our “job” to protect the Blessed Sacrament when we see this. Yes, I agree that we are not to attack, but she should be stopped and asked, in a charitiable and polite manner. Too many today say “I’m not getting invloved!”

Oh, I might very well ask – with or without talking to the pastor first. But this is considerably different than what you first posted:

Tell the pastor what you did see and think happened. Then plan to sit either next to her or right behind her next Sunday if Father asks you to. When you see her return to her pew watch that she consumes the Host. If not and she breaks it, STOP her and tell her to either give it to you or consume it herself. But first let Father know just to be sure that they are not Eastern Catholics, attending your Latin parish.

That I would not do. Further I cannot imagine a priest asking for help in that manner. STOPping her could get quite nasty in more than a few instances…

 

[Jea9]

Actually, I have done this myself. At my previous parish, my neice would always ask the priest for an extra host to take back to her mom in the pew who is disabled. She gave her mom the host, who then consumed it. On several occasions I was with her and did the same thing for her when the neice was not present. On several occasions there was a priest I did not know so didn’t feel comfortable making the request. In that case I did break the host, consume half, and give the other half to the mom.

I’m sorry but this seems wrong to me. Is it not possible for an EMHC to walk over to where the disabled person is? Are you an EMHC and allowed to distribute Holy Communion? What if the host were broken on your way back to the pew and then stepped on? Is that really a chance you’re willing to take? Not trying to be argumentative, just curious. Our priest, deacon, or EMHC will walk to any person that is not able to stand, and I’ve seen that done many times. A second EMHC follows with a cup to receive the Precious Blood as well.

 

[Spiller]

I’m sorry but this seems wrong to me. Is it not possible for an EMHC to walk over to where the disabled person is? Are you an EMHC and allowed to distribute Holy Communion? What if the host were broken on your way back to the pew and then stepped on? Is that really a chance you’re willing to take? Not trying to be argumentative, just curious. Our priest, deacon, or EMHC will walk to any person that is not able to stand, and I’ve seen that done many times. A second EMHC follows with a cup to receive the Precious Blood as well.

We routinely give communion to others who cannot leave the pews…

I have also distributed communion to 3 month old babies who have been baptized, received holy communion and chrismation in one of the Eastern Catholic churches. The “traditionalists” around me were turning purple with rage because they had no idea what was going on, even though the pastor had been correctly notified beforehand.

 

[Jea9]

We routinely give communion to others who cannot leave the pews…

“we” being you as an EMHC?

 

[Spiller]

“we” being you as an EMHC?

Me as an EMHC, other EMsHC and the ordained.

 

[Katie1723]

Th parish I attend once a month in VA has two gentlemen who stand off to the side near the priest to make sure the host is consumed properly.
Kathy

 

[JimG]

I’m sorry but this seems wrong to me. Is it not possible for an EMHC to walk over to where the disabled person is? Are you an EMHC and allowed to distribute Holy Communion? What if the host were broken on your way back to the pew and then stepped on? Is that really a chance you’re willing to take? Not trying to be argumentative, just curious. Our priest, deacon, or EMHC will walk to any person that is not able to stand, and I’ve seen that done many times. A second EMHC follows with a cup to receive the Precious Blood as well.

I admit it was irregular; but apparently the arrangement was OK with her parish priest, who was the one distributing communion. My own parish has a special section up front where priests or EMHC’s will distribute to those sitting in the front pews who are not able to approach in the communion line.

 

[MusicMan]

What if the boy was autistic and going through the line or having an unfamiliar person (meaning anyone who isn’t Mom) would cause an inappropriate reaction from the boy, and this was the only way he could successfully receive?

 

[BlestOne]

What if the boy was autistic and going through the line or having an unfamiliar person (meaning anyone who isn’t Mom) would cause an inappropriate reaction from the boy, and this was the only way he could successfully receive?

We have an autistic girl in our parish and she has other problems too… the mom takes her up for communion and the priest puts a tiny sliver on her tongue so she doesn’t choke. Priests can and do know what to do for special needs of the people.

Speaking of the needs of the people… in my parish we have the front 2 pews reserved for people who can’t make it up to the communion line. They also built a ramp up to the door closest to the front pews for handicapped entrance. The priest goes to them and the EMHC takes them the precious blood before the rest of the congregation. I know when my son and I were both on crutches we sat together up front and had communion brought to us. We also have those on oxygen, or in wheel chairs, or severely arthritic up front on a regular basis. I find this method much easier than having ushers try to tell EMHC’s where people are that need communion brought to them.

 

[e-catholic]

Grace and Peace,

Is this woman Orthodox? I know that Orthodox Christian Children are given Communion from the day that they are Baptized.

I know my daughter has asked me many times if she could have communion and it tears my heart out every time I deny her the Body and Blood knowing that she is in a state of grace since Baptism. I know Byzantine Catholics also give their Children Communion also.

If she is giving it to her child I can sympathize with her because just as many well-known Saints can sympathize with her as well.

As I understand, a byzantine who attends a latin church could receive communion, regardless of age. When children go through the RCIA they receive all of the sacraments at the same time regardless of age. If you have a 4 or 5 year old that goes through RCIA they receive communion, and continue to from there after.

Furthermore, at our church if someone walks away with the host in their hand the eucharistic minister follows them, and tells them to consume it. I am sometime surprised at how attentive they are, I have only seen it happen once, but the EM cought it. No matter what the reason, no one should be walking away with the host, it is to be consumed immediately.

 

[kitkatty]

No way. Not unless the pastor expressly directed you to do that, and I doubt any would. Even then I doubt I would as I would be a bit concerned about any pastor that would give that sort of directive.

If you feel compelled, lay it all out for father and then step aside. It’s up to him to deal with it. Likely through communicating directly with her and catechesis and not by having operatives out in the pews. He might also alert the EMsHC.

It wouldn’t matter if they were Eastern Catholics by the way. That wouldn’t be an excuse for what they appear to be doing wrong.

No, it wouldnt be an excuse, if that is the case the woman should have approached befiore Mass to explain the situation and taken the child with her so he could receive. The priests arent supposed to refuse communion to Eastern catholic children as long as they know whats going on ahead of time. Somehow that doesn`t sound like that is the situation here.

 

[Spiller]

As I understand, a byzantine who attends a latin church could receive communion, regardless of age. When children go through the RCIA they receive all of the sacraments at the same time regardless of age. If you have a 4 or 5 year old that goes through RCIA they receive communion, and continue to from there after.

Furthermore, at our church if someone walks away with the host in their hand the eucharistic minister follows them, and tells them to consume it. I am sometime surprised at how attentive they are, I have only seen it happen once, but the EM cought it. No matter what the reason, no one should be walking away with the host, it is to be consumed immediately.

The young Byzantine Catholic would need to have been baptized
and have received first communion (and christmation.)

4 and 5 year olds would not go through RCIA.

 

[Woodstock]

It wouldn’t matter if they were Eastern Catholics by the way. That wouldn’t be an excuse for what they appear to be doing wrong.

Correct. Eastern Catholic or not, it doesn’t excuse deliberate disobedience. It is a problem some Eastern Catholics face. When they inform the priest in advance and give sufficient time to verify the correct procedures, some Roman Catholic priests refuse to commune Eastern Catholic children. I know of a person who couldn’t find a priest within 30 miles who would commune her baby. While disobedient and not excusable, she would hold a small amount of the Precious Blood in her mouth and put it on her finger and commune the baby herself. When the priest refuses to do his job and denies a child his canonical rights, some parents feel that they have no other choices. They should address it with the bishop, then with the Eastern bishop, then with canon lawyers, and on up until change is effected. When looking at the passing time and a child being denied, it can be difficult to endure.

Then there are the people who think they have a right to everything and don’t have to follow proper procedures but can just take whatever pleases them, and instead of the hassle of getting the child prepared will just take it. So speculation on the woman’s motives are in vain.

I believe you are incorrect. It is the liturgical law of the Byzantine Church that prohibits all from receiving in the hand at the Divine Liturgy, not Canon Law. When a Latin Catholic attends the DL, s/he must receive in the mouth, due to the liturgical laws.

Incorrect. The Byzantine Typikon has the Eucharistic species, comingled, distributed on a spoon. As such, reception is on the tongue. The rubrics for the DL are not binding on the faithful, meaning they don’t have to receive that way when in a Roman Catholic Mass. They are binding on the Liturgy, meaning a priest offering a Divine Liturgy is bound to them, unless directed otherwise. Otherwise, all Roman Catholics could insist on receiving in the hand at a Divine Liturgy since their Mass rubrics allow for it. The rubrics don’t cover the people, but the service.

A Byzantine Catholic attending a Latin Mass would certainly have the option to receive in the hand, because they would be bound by the liturgical law of the Latin Mass.

Yes they could, but because the Mass is done according to the Latin rubrics, not because the people there are under Latin laws when present. Eastern Catholics attending Mass remain bound to their Eastern canons, such as fasting and days of observance. The people are bound to the canons. The services are bound to the rubrics.

Much in the same way, you cross yourself appropriate to the Rite you are attending in, not the Church you belong to, and you say or omit The Filioque based upon the Rite you are attending, not the Church you belong to.

While polite, neither of those are binding on the people.

As I understand, a byzantine who attends a latin church could receive communion, regardless of age. When children go through the RCIA they receive all of the sacraments at the same time regardless of age. If you have a 4 or 5 year old that goes through RCIA they receive communion, and continue to from there after.

Any confirmed person in a state of grace who presents himself for communion has a right to receive. Byzantine Catholic children fit the criteria. Some Latin priests continue to deny them communion in spite of this.

The young Byzantine Catholic would need to have been baptized
and have received first communion (and christmation.)

4 and 5 year olds would not go through RCIA.

They would go through RCIC. I think they should not be confirmed unless they’ve reached the age of reason, but they should be confirmed and then communed if they go through RCIC after the age of reason.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Oh, I might very well ask – with or without talking to the pastor first. But this is considerably different than what you first posted:

That I would not do. Further I cannot imagine a priest asking for help in that manner. STOPping her could get quite nasty in more than a few instances…

Of course I don’t mean physically wrestling her to the ground. There is not enought room in the pews for that.
Oh, I might very well ask – with or without talking to the pastor first. But this is considerably different than what you first posted:

Tell the pastor what you did see and think happened. Then plan to sit either next to her or right behind her next Sunday if Father asks you to. When you see her return to her pew watch that she consumes the Host. If not and she breaks it, STOP her in a charitiable and polite manner and tell her to either give it to you or consume it herself. But first let Father know just to be sure that they are not Eastern Catholics, attending your Latin parish.

Does it really change what I said by adding the 6 words?

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

As I understand, a byzantine who attends a latin church could receive communion, regardless of age. When children go through the RCIA they receive all of the sacraments at the same time regardless of age. If you have a 4 or 5 year old that goes through RCIA they receive communion, and continue to from there after.

Furthermore, at our church if someone walks away with the host in their hand the eucharistic minister follows them, and tells them to consume it. I am sometime surprised at how attentive they are, I have only seen it happen once, but the EM cought it. No matter what the reason, no one should be walking away with the host, it is to be consumed immediately.

It would be improper for an EMHC to chase after someone with a full ciborium of Hosts.

Also small children under 7 (the Age of Reason and First Communion age) are only Baptized as “infants”, if their parents are received through RCIA.